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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Who is RED?

Kris Anderson said:
I was at a post house, sitting in a Flame suite, recently.... and the operator showed me a TVC shot on a 5D. I remarked that it looked quite good. He said, sure, as long as you use cine lenses, grade the sh!t out of it in Baselight and don't move the camera while you're rolling. Laughter ensued.
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We had a shot kicked back to us from a TV spot (airing right now) that was shot on a 5D. "CEO says this all looks really blurry is there anything you can do to make it look like the quality of the shots he says he's used to seeing?"

*blank stare.* "No. That's why we recommend against shooting on a 5D. That's as sharp as it gets on a 5D. "

The instant I got the footage I knew it was going to be a problem. "Someone shot the spot on a 5D, I can just sense it." Sure enough... it was.

I don't ever want to to have that conversation with a RED product. "Sorry, that's just what you get when you shoot on a RED camera."
 
Jannard said:
No matter how he tries to spin this... the real message is clear. Scarlet is more "alive" than ever...
Jim
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"It's alive!" muhahahaaaa

...
Hmm and didn't he talk about the AF100 which is priced at... hmmm let me think, what was it? About $6000. at that sum something else comes to my mind...
 
Jannard said:
Prosumer cameras are ones that hold back capability. Professional cameras don't. I guess us committing to always putting out every possible invention, advancement and not building a "price point camera with neutered features"... is a bad thing?

Jim
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This is great news. I was thinking that even with added HDRx, the Scarlet S35 was becoming the redundant camera in the line-up. I should have figured it out earlier when the difference in price/performance from Scarlet S35 and Epic S35 was $20K..
 
noahvolek said:
Despite the "Pro" focus, I still see a professional application for low cost 2/3 sensor cameras. They have the potential to be awesome in the ENG field, and in terms of cinema applications, 2/3 scarlets will make great crash cameras.
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Actually, a true Red crash cam could be a really nice idea: it could be the ultimate bare bone version of 2/3" Scarlet, with not much more than rec button functionality, running at 24/25 fps max, no HDRx or anything fancy. Just the very essentials needed to record 3K images and audio.

For pros it would be a totally dispensable camera for risky situations - and at the same time, it could cater to the budget restricted indie folks as an entry model to raw shooting...
 
Lorenzo Straight said:
I feel somewhat abandoned, but what can I do. I don't think prosumer is a bad thing. I thought Red was building cameras for Pro's and Prosumer's alike.
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Prosumer is bad because it is a substandard concept. The original "3k for 3k" - camera was even supposed to have a plastic body.

A professional tool is a tool made to professional standards, not a tool exclusive to professionals. I am not a professional mechanic, but I can feel how much better it is to work with a $40 Belzer wrench than a $10 Bahco or a $4 generic Chinese.

The same thing goes for cameras. In the prosumer segment, people expect a certain mix of useful functionality and marketing gimmicks in a package designed to last five years. In the professional segment, the expectation is pure functionality built to last fifty years - it should be obsolete long before it fails.

The customer for the professional equipment may be a professional, or just somebody who does not like to use substandard things. The cost of ownership is probably not much different over a number of years.
 
"Life is short" especially when dealing with one compromise after another. 11 years ago I learned a valuable lesson: I shot a short video with the Canon XL-1 and got into a few film festivals. It was shown along with other shorts shot on 16mm and 35mm. As I proud as I was, when it was projected on the big screen and shown back to back with the 16mm and 35mm shorts, I was somewhat embarased and dissapointed. Sure people said nice things about it, but deep down I couldn't get past the quality. I felt I had let down my cast and crew, and should have shot it on film. I didn't even bother going to the other film festivals. Anyway, today I get to make videos professionally and love every moment of it, but that initial experience was a rough learning experience for me--visual quality mattered especially in a visual medium like film or video.

For years companies like Sony, Panasonic and Canon keep perpetuating this myth that their prosumer cameras (<10k) are primed and ready for filmmaking--they barely squeak by. What's worse is they deliberately disable features on their products, and control what they enable every year as to give the illusion of innovation and progress. I got a better sense of this when I read one guy, Juan Pertierra, discovered the DVX100 sensors were far more capable than they were set for, and developed technology that would enable one to record 4:4:4 data out of it, well that is until he was mysteriously bought out. And today it still continues, in fact the only thing going for 5D and 7D, I felt, was a way to bypass h.264 compression via Tramell Hudson's Magic Lantern, but even that was thwarted by Canon: "With the latest update for the 7D, however, Canon has effectively stopped my development with what appears to be a firmware update counter: my camera no longer accepts the signatures, even in Canon's official firmware files.""

Big name companies give you the impression that they are listening, they're really not, in fact they never were, and the improvements they seem to have are really calculated tactics to combat any truly disruptive and innovative companies and their products.

/rant
 
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There are a lot of jabber! Let's work! We will see Who is Who only after Epic and Scarlet will go out on the street!
 
Jannard said:
It amazes me how much people read into this stuff. We'll tell you what's going on. You don't need to guess.

Jim
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That's because everyone is so used to being totally shafted by ALL the other camera manufacturers.

RED is different and special. I only wish I could have bought a RED earlier, because I have always loved this companies attitude and have been very pleased with every thing you guys have done, and I'm always happy when I am hired to work with a RED.

I believe in supporting companies that do right by me... and you guys are on the top of my list.

I did buy a 7D... and I only wish it could have been a RED S35 camera, any of them really. Budgets are budgets :(
 
Elan Gunos said:
Big name companies give you the impression that they are listening, they're really not, in fact they never were, and the improvements they seem to have are really calculated tactics to combat any truly disruptive and innovative companies and their products.
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Elan, I need investors for an expose I'm doing on the Space Aliens who killed Kennedy ... Ya wanna come onboard?
 
I don't understand… was RED planning on making sub-standard equipment? What does this confirmation of identity change? I'm guessing that's why some people are jumping to conclusions, because this seems to imply there is some change (so people immediately think price increases or cancelled models or whatever).

Not trying to stir stuff up, just trying to figure out what the OP actually means in practical terms. I agree with the sentiment and I'm glad RED is committed to professional-grade products, but it seemed to me that was already the gameplan. Am I wrong?
 
Meryem Ersoz said:
The more appropriate gap to fill is going to be $5750 - $10K - SCARLET will BE the economy of scale, in relative terms -- relative to anything that is on the market.

Canon will not be too far from upgrading cameras in the $800 - $5750 range - there is no reason to compete with them at that price point.

(...)

It makes a lot of sense to make buyers reach up, instead of RED reaching down. That has not worked well for them.

(...)

I do think that SCARLET will still represent an economy of scale, which EPIC won't - and RED is going to need that broader user base to keep the cash flowing. They still need a lot of cameras out there, and this is the way to achieve that.
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The more you sell the more cash flow you have, it results in a stronger company. It makes all the sense to compete.

It has worked very well for DSLRs manufacturers and for those outside jumpin' in such as Panasonic, Sony and the list goes on.

RED has pushing this industry, RED RAY and the not-enough-1080p philosophy are just a few examples why RED should not neglect the 'crowd' in behalf of all of us.
 
Meryem Ersoz said:
Also, there is still a place for even smaller, lighter cameras than EPIC...SCARLET with Canon/Nikon lenses will represent an astonishing value.
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Sure it is.
 
Emanuel A. said:
The more you sell the more cash flow you have, it results in a stronger company. It makes all the sense to compete.

It has worked very well for DSLRs manufacturers and for those outside jumpin' in such as Panasonic, Sony and the list goes on.

RED has pushing this industry, RED RAY and the not-enough-1080p philosophy are just a few examples why RED should not neglect the 'crowd' in behalf of all of us.
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Only RED might win.

[Monday, Oct 4 2010 11:30AM CET]
There's already a sentiment of relief and rejoicing from the traditional contenders part or their usual shills on the perspective to have RED out of the game.
 
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