Dragon Update + A.D.D.

[Ryan Hamblin]

Let's hope mark didn't ruin anything for us hoping to upgrade our Scarlett's to scarlet dragons

 

[Bob Gundu]

Everyone take a deep breath! I'm just like Tom. Bought the scarlet, upgraded to epic, and also ordered the dragon upgrade. But damn, I'm in India right now shooting killer footage at 5K on a camera that is far from obsolete. Seems like Red are the ones being patient here.

 

[Tom Greenberg]

Don't worry Tom. Won't penalize you. Actually..we will upgrade you early. Send me an email. No more rules.

We are all supposed to be in this together. The moment that concept is lost there is no reason to do what we do.

This is why I bleed RED…thanks for everything you guys do for us! I've been in this business for 30 years and you have the most unique (in a good way) business model I've ever experienced.

 

[Isaac Marchionna]

Ah great. Someone crapped in the pool. Everyone out.

Still patiently waiting for the upgrade. Hoping by early summer.

 

[Jack Shanahan]

yeah i am super appreciative of upgrades. Going from Scarlet to Epic for me was huge. Saw huge returns on opportunity and rentals. I think RED is great. Love my epic, will love my dragon more.

Keep on keeping on. I am a fan for life and look forward to telling some young guns about what happened to the industry in 2007 when this company called Red came along.

 

[George A.]

Hi Jarred!

I totally understand your frustration!
I can't imagine what you're all going through at RED with (probably) dozens of angry e-mails each day inquiring about the upgrades, jumping the line, etc etc
I get it.

But it never helps to get angry. Let's take a deep breath and relax. I know you as a cool balanced guy! That's why we love and respect you. I, for one, loved how you brought Geoff back on Reduser and made peace - that was a classy move my friend.

It's never good to let your frustration take hold of you! Even when one is right.

Many early adopters (should I say most?) still support RED and are patiently waiting in line. I know because I talk to them on a regular basis.

Best regards from New York,
George

P.S. Plus, Epic is still one of the greatest cameras shooting motion now. I had the chance to play with Dragon a few weeks ago, and while I'm super-excited to upgrade as an early adopter myself, I am still shooting very happily with the MX!

 

[Zeb B]

Hey just fooling with the ADD feature and comparing the TIFF results against my Canon 1Dx (same shot/same lens etc). Dragon+ADD is da shit so far as I can tell at this early stage. Keep up the great work!

 

[Ricky Guing Senen]

Don't worry Tom. Won't penalize you. Actually..we will upgrade you early. Send me an email. No more rules.

We are all supposed to be in this together. The moment that concept is lost there is no reason to do what we do.

Jarred,

I have already requested for an Dragon upgrade. I can wait as long as it takes. Keep up the good work!

 

[Dr. Sassi]

Perhaps a stand-by option.

If one can spare his/her camera for longer, it can be send in and closes so an eventual gap in the pipeline.

An advantage for everyone.

BTW, I'm happy about the offer to go Dragon with my Epic! Thank you RED.

==========

Besides that I thought about something different. People get their e-mail and pick one of four slots (each slot is a week long), so no waiting for single cameras, just a little bit more management ;o)

 

[Nikhil Kamkolkar]

Really think it can be all easily addressed.

1. Let new orders go in a different queue. Those who really want a Dragon today, can order a new one, and sell their EPIC on the used market. Simple.

2. If someone who gets called for an upgrade can't send in their camera right away, they slip to the bottom of the next batch of callees. Shouldn't be a lot of overhead for RED, and should not be a concern for those getting the upgrade, because as Jarred said, its a thank-you offer, not a right.

But #1 is most important and looks like it'll be started soon! Excited for all those who can afford to take that route. Me, I'll have to wait for #2 to come my way. My RED is RED-Y.

 

[D Fuller]

Please understand we are a business as well. We need to sell product to continue to do everything we do. I know waiting is hard.. but you need to remember that being able to upgrade your cameras is not a right but a privilege. We love all our customers and our supports that have been with us.. thats why we give you guys the option... at a price point that is more of a thank you rather than a business model. If you are suggesting we need to stop all business and wait for everyone to get their upgrades done I will tell you right now that isn't going to happen and I am surprised that you would suggest as such. If you think its fair for us not to allow new customers to RED have any option to be in the family than you are missing the point of why we started this company.

There is no situation to rectify.. As I said all along , and as we did with R1 to Epic, the timeframe is limited by our customer's time tables.. we have been through this before. We are not going to bump people to the back of the line if their camera is on a rental or create some sort of if you miss this week try next week thing.. The logistics and expense of managing that is not in the cards. We are hitting our schedules with the product timelines we can control.

We are really doing something special here with this whole thank you upgrade program, but it looks like you guys are looking at it like it is an obligation.

But thank you, you helped me make up my mind.

We will be opening up new camera orders to new customers ahead of the upgrade line. If our existing customers have lost appreciation for this whole program , then why wouldn't we.

Jarred, I don't think there's a person on this forum who has lost appreciation for this program. Quite the opposite. Certainly in my own case, the more great reports I hear about Dragon, the more eager and impatient I get for my place in line to come around. I apologize if that impatience occasionally shows up a as frustration. Most of the time I'm fine with it all. The truth is, if you didn't make the camera so damn good, I wouldn't be so damn eager to be using it. And I very much appreciate the price point at which that upgrade is going to happen.

As for whether you open another line, it seems to me that Red needs to do what's good for the company. If the demand is there and you have the capacity, why would you not do it? You have always said that the carbon line has no effect on the upgrade line, and I believe that. Why would this one be any different? If it makes the company healthier, it's good for all Redusers.

 

[D Anderson]

Jarred, I don't think there's a person on this forum who has lost appreciation for this program. Quite the opposite.

I totally agree with Jarreds opinion he needs to service new customers but calling the upgrade path a privilege is plain wrong.

Is it really a privilege or more like something customers saw advertised and then bought and paid for? REDs moto is Obsolesce Obsolete and all their advertising points to that. Clearly the upgrades are a selling point for RED and they DO promote it that way.

So, no, it is not a privilege. Is it a good business idea? Yes.

The day RED stops the upgrade paths they know they will loose a chunk of customers.

 

[Jeff McCoy]

We will be opening up new camera orders to new customers ahead of the upgrade line. If our existing customers have lost appreciation for this whole program , then why wouldn't we.

This is awesome! Even though I'm waiting for an upgrade, it makes no sense to limit the Dragons going out the door.
I say do whatever you guys want. You and Jim are running the show, and no matter what you do- some people will support and some will whine. You make and sell the best cameras in the world... I don't think you owe anyone anything more. After all, you guys know what's best for the company. Any customer should know that what's best for Red will ultimately be best for them. If Red weren't turning a profit, then Red would eventually stop making all this great stuff. Heck maybe I'll just place a new order too. It's about time for a second camera anyway.

 

[paulherrin]

Don't worry Tom. Won't penalize you. Actually..we will upgrade you early. Send me an email. No more rules.

We are all supposed to be in this together. The moment that concept is lost there is no reason to do what we do.

good call

 

[Jarred Land]

I totally agree with Jarreds opinion he needs to service new customers but calling the upgrade path a privilege is plain wrong.

Hey D, Privilege as defined as a benefit... which it is. Only existing customers can upgrade to Dragon ( obviously ) and the order which those upgrades happen and the special priority that we give those customers over everyone else is most definitely a privilege.

We appreciate our customers..... by far, we have the best customers in the world. I am sure we can all agree on that. It is why we do the upgrade program, no matter how much of a pain in the ass it is.

 

[Tim Morten]

I understand Jarred's (and presumably Jim's) annoyance. This upgrade program is an act of unprecedented generosity, as it was for R1. Every other company wants to sell new cameras instead of upgrading them. Unfortunately some people develop a sense of entitlement when they encounter generosity, and that has been clearly reflected in this forum. Those of us who realize how lucky we are just aren't as visible, because we don't nag.

 

[Mark Pedersen]

Please understand we are a business as well. We need to sell product to continue to do everything we do. I know waiting is hard.. but you need to remember that being able to upgrade your cameras is not a right but a privilege. We love all our customers and our supports that have been with us.. thats why we give you guys the option... at a price point that is more of a thank you rather than a business model. If you are suggesting we need to stop all business and wait for everyone to get their upgrades done I will tell you right now that isn't going to happen and I am surprised that you would suggest as such. If you think its fair for us not to allow new customers to RED have any option to be in the family than you are missing the point of why we started this company.

There is no situation to rectify.. As I said all along , and as we did with R1 to Epic, the timeframe is limited by our customer's time tables.. we have been through this before. We are not going to bump people to the back of the line if their camera is on a rental or create some sort of if you miss this week try next week thing.. The logistics and expense of managing that is not in the cards. We are hitting our schedules with the product timelines we can control.

We are really doing something special here with this whole thank you upgrade program, but it looks like you guys are looking at it like it is an obligation.

But thank you, you helped me make up my mind.

We will be opening up new camera orders to new customers ahead of the upgrade line. If our existing customers have lost appreciation for this whole program , then why wouldn't we.

Jarred,

First of all, I'm sorry if my post pissed you off. Not my intent. As a business owner, I totally understand that RED needs to continue to sell product to continue to do what you do. I never suggested anything to the contrary. I'm certainly not suggesting that you stop all business and wait for everyone to get their upgrades. Nor did I suggest that you not allow new customers to RED to have any option to be in the family. That's just plain silly. I'm simply trying (like many here) to understand why Dragon upgrades seem to be taking longer than we expected.

I also fully understand that Red is not obligated to offer upgrades. And in fact I stated in my post that I really appreciate the opportunity to upgrade my cameras. It's an awesome offer, and one of the reasons I love RED and the fact that you do take such great care of your existing customers. So please don't think I or anyone else has lost appreciation for this program. Quite the contrary. We're all really excited about the opportunity to upgrade our cameras and start working with Dragon. In fact, it's the desire to do so that leads to the frustration of having to wait.

So, ok, I get it. New orders take precedence over upgrades. Makes sense from a business perspective. I guess I let the frustration of waiting get ahead of me, instead of trusting that RED is doing the best it can to get cameras out. And for that, I apologize.

I do hope the process continues as stated and that early adopters will be upgraded according to the time stamp on their orders. In the meantime, I'll continue to wait patiently, and gratefully for my Dragons.

Best,
Mark

 

[Joan Poggio]

I have owned my Scarlet for two years now, and love every moment I have shooting with it, and then bringing the images more to life in post. I was blown away by the possibility to upgrade to Epic and then Dragon. But living in Kenya, I just haven't had the opportunity to send my camera for an Epic upgrade as I find myself busy moving from one shoot to the other. Oh boy, I'm really looking forward to Epic, and seriously looking forward to Dragon! No company in the world has the kind of model Red has. Thank you very much for making my dreams easier to achieve, and for having the kind of higher moral and standards that should be replicated by many more companies the world round. Cheers from Kenya www.joanpoggio.com

 

[Antonio Forjaz]

Hi Jarred,

Would it be possible just to let us know how many of us have taken the upgrade and how many have been upgraded, just so we can just get a sense of the numbers we are looking at.

When I ordered my upgrade, I miss understood the rules, and I paid the full amount on the same day I ordered the update.
In the mean time my Bomb Squad Rep explained to me the rules, but my money had already been wired. Having paid in full, so long ago, has been a bit difficult, because in the country I live in, Mozambique, I am required by law to justify the transfer of hard currency (US Dollars) out of the country, and until the Epic arrives, I have to keep on writing a letter to the Bank explaining why my item still has not arrived. They keep on asking me the same question "When" and I my answer is that my item is still not ready, and they are starting to doubt me. I don't want the money back, as that will end up costing me more in bank fees.

Any way, I will keep on writing letters to them until they put me up against the wall, then I don't know what I will do. When that time comes, I just hope I will not goto jail....

Just hope the upgrades go as fast as possible and we all get our Dragons, but in the mean time, the EPIC is already such a great camera, I can't complain, I love shooting with it.

All the best

Antonio

 

[Sidney L. Plaut]

If RED has thousands of dragon sensors ready to go, and the volume of upgrades being done, differs vastly week to week,
because people are not sending in their cameras, and thereby stalling the upgrade-line.... that is
not good for anybody...

a standby option or being able to choose a pre-planned upgrade slot at a certain date, would make a lot of sense, for all parties.