Sony F5 and F55...

[Craig W. Bickerstaff]

With the F55 (without Recorder) @ 13k more expensive then the EPIC-X is a NO Brainer (pun intended) to go with RED...

Now to add the recorder on the F55 you can add the DRAGON on to the Epic and still the same difference applies, and now people will be even more crazy to go the F55 route.

Two words, Global Shutter. It's a different route but not a crazy one, different priorities and what not.

 

[Fredrik Callinggard]

Two words, Global Shutter. It's a different route but not a crazy one, different priorities and what not.

Hahahha just wrote more or less the same answer in the other thread. LOL

 

[Jay Birch]

With the F55 (without Recorder) @ 13k more expensive then the EPIC-X is a NO Brainer (pun intended) to go with RED...

Now to add the recorder on the F55 you can add the DRAGON on to the Epic and still the same difference applies, and now people will be even more crazy to go the F55 route.

But the F55 basically has a Meizler module built in (at least the 4K/2K broadcast codecs)......... So no, it is not a "no-brainer".... Not for everyone.

When you think about the production landscape, with Alexa, C300 and soon F5/F55.... The Meizler module is now almost a must have item, so needs to be taken into account when pricing up the systems.

 

[Martin Whittier]

But the F55 basically has a Meizler module built in (at least the 4K/2K broadcast codecs)......... So no, it is not a "no-brainer".... Not for everyone.

When you think about the production landscape, with Alexa, C300 and soon F5/F55.... The Meizler module is now almost a must have item, so needs to be taken into account when pricing up the systems.

Well said. I just did a shoot for Discovery and was asked to shoot on a 5DMKII over using my Scarlet. Not having an external recorder of my own they chose h264 from the Canon over Raw from the Red because of the speed of the workflow in Avid. It was tough knowing how much better the footage could look, but this all got me thinking about the need to invest in a proxy recorder but the Meizler module is still too rich for my blood at this time.

 

[Max M.]

and the answer to all your worries is the mini toia module

 

[Troy Bakewell]

Toia Module really needs to happen before these new Sony's ship IMO. That and Dragon (and maybe RedMote Pro even?) and Sony is hurtin. Otherwise hopefully used F3's drop in price. Interesting times.

 

[Enrique Blein]

TOIA MODULE +1 It's crazy how people prefer even a 7D over my camera just because they haven't got a clue about what even Red Cine-X is, I have to do all the transcoding just to convince my clients ("Apple Pro Res? sure, I'll deliver the files...")

 

[Tom.Wong]

TOIA MODULE +1 It's crazy how people prefer even a 7D over my camera just because they haven't got a clue about what even Red Cine-X is, I have to do all the transcoding just to convince my clients ("Apple Pro Res? sure, I'll deliver the files...")

and those are the same clients that don't even know what to do with linear log footage. and end up paying for a transform step anyway just to get dailies that have a look on them. only difference between RED and a camera like alexa or f55 doing linear log internally is that

A. the file sizes recorded are smaller because you aren't recording i 4k/5k
B. the transform/transcode step is faster on the RGB baked files because it isn't downscaling at all or so much, and no heavy wavelet compression to deal with.


if you go head to head raw with these other cameras, it really makes red workflow look quite amazing. free software to do all your work, most robust RAW controls to date, and the only tough part of the workflow is needing a rocket on hand. but i've just learned to accept the fact that there is no perfect system no matter how you spin it. I'm honestly still amazed with what the industry has been able to achieve in a decade.

 

[Simon Falkentorp]

http://nofilmschool.com/2012/11/sony-japan-f5-f55-camera-price-cost/

 

[Björn Benckert]

But the F55 basically has a Meizler module built in (at least the 4K/2K broadcast codecs)......... So no, it is not a "no-brainer".... Not for everyone.

When you think about the production landscape, with Alexa, C300 and soon F5/F55.... The Meizler module is now almost a must have item, so needs to be taken into account when pricing up the systems.

I think it's wrong to look at the meizler as a proress module... it's a lot more than that. I think the proress only module will come from red soon and it will probably cost less than a module that also do wireless and focus motors etc.

Is there anything even like the red mote announced for these sony's?

 

[steve green]

and the answer to all your worries is the mini toia module

Oh man do I need that Toia mini module....And not just for the Prores/Dnx, how about being able to use the EVF and the Touch at the same time! How has this taken so long?

 

[Noah Yuan-Vogel]

Oh man do I need that Toia mini module....And not just for the Prores/Dnx, how about being able to use the EVF and the Touch at the same time! How has this taken so long?

For people itching for prores, what's wrong with velcro'ing a hyperdeck shuttle 2 to your epic/scarlet for $300? They do prores now as well as uncompressed and dnxhd...

As I understand it you can even record 5k 24fps downscaled to 1080p through sdi/hdmi on scarlet with its lower noise/larger sensor area. Might be useful for some, though not for the only-4k-is-enough people.

 

[Jason L]

Oh man do I need that Toia mini module....And not just for the Prores/Dnx, how about being able to use the EVF and the Touch at the same time! How has this taken so long?

You can do the EVF and Touch at the same time, but only with the Pro I/O Module. EVF from the camera and the Touch from the Pro I/O.

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Two words, Global Shutter. It's a different route but not a crazy one, different priorities and what not.

But the F55 basically has a Meizler module built in (at least the 4K/2K broadcast codecs)......... So no, it is not a "no-brainer".... Not for everyone.

When you think about the production landscape, with Alexa, C300 and soon F5/F55.... The Meizler module is now almost a must have item, so needs to be taken into account when pricing up the systems.

Well I guess for me it is a no brainer, since i just bought an other EPIC, even so this one is a Monochrome...


But yea, I can't be generalizing everything for every one, and as the Alexa has its user base so will the F5/55, just not me nor anyone that will be asking my advise...

 

[steve green]

You can do the EVF and Touch at the same time, but only with the Pro I/O Module. EVF from the camera and the Touch from the Pro I/O.

Understood....But the Pro I/O makes the Epic the size and weight of an Alexa, negates one great advantage of Epic.

 

[Greg M]

Understood....But the Pro I/O makes the Epic the size and weight of an Alexa, negates one great advantage of Epic.

actually you just described one of its great advantages...versatility. If you want a compact/lightweight camera, you can strip it down to just the brain without compromising image quality or resolution. But if you want a studio configuration you can add a module option for that.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Touch LCD + EVF will also be possible via the Meizler module -- actually does make the EPIC almost as big and heavy as the Alexa, more so than the Pro I/O, but it's infinitely more capable, IMO... And you can also do the LCD + EVF via the +1 module adapter... if RED ever releases it!!!!

 

[Axel Mertes]

Touch LCD + EVF will also be possible via the Meizler module -- actually does make the EPIC almost as big and heavy as the Alexa, more so than the Pro I/O, but it's infinitely more capable, IMO... And you can also do the LCD + EVF via the +1 module adapter... if RED ever releases it!!!!

Why not release a new 5" touch with a loop through port for attached the EVF there.
Never understood why something like that was never considered.

 

[Casey Green]

Why not release a new 5" touch with a loop through port for attached the EVF there.
Never understood why something like that was never considered.

I would imagine that RED wants to keep these viewing methods completely separate because the LCD(s) and EVF paths would be displaying not only different overlays and data, but in different resolutions. Even if there was a mode that was compatible for both, it probably would be limiting and confusing for users.

+1 module is the answer. Hope to see it very soon.

 

[Greg M]

Why not release a new 5" touch with a loop through port for attached the EVF there.
Never understood why something like that was never considered.

my guess is this is a limitation of the design. The reason the Red LCD's are so small is that some of the electronics are in the body. So its not as simple as a "loop through" like you can with a simple SDI signal.