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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

No excuse for 5K@24P on Scarlet

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Peter Majtan said:
That is clearly not the answer to this at all. While I hope to buy my own Epic brain soon - I would still want my Scarlet to provide this frame-rate / resolution combo to better match with the Epic and to provide better source image for post.
The issue is that this is clearly possible with the given HW - it only requires firmware to be written.
RED - I hope - is clearly not a company that will not "allow" functions capable on a given HW just to separate from other product models...

PS: Never mind those who simply can not afford Epic - right? :reddevil:
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So you pay 20,000 less and you think you are getting 5k? Bhahahahh
 
Price Drop is what it is...thats not what this thread is about. Its the incesent need to have more and more and the unwillingness to want to pay for it. Its all a bit like children. I wasnt mocking anyone, i was just doing the same as everyone if you took it as mocking then you too see my point. Want what an epic does buy an epic if i want what a phantom does ill buy a phantom...
 
sergio arguello said:
Price Drop is what it is...thats not what this thread is about. Its the incesent need to have more and more and the unwillingness to want to pay for it. Its all a bit like children. I wasnt mocking anyone, i was just doing the same as everyone if you took it as mocking then you too see my point. Want what an epic does buy an epic if i want what a phantom does ill buy a phantom...
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Bingo!
 
Samir Patel said:
I would not expect anything to be done about this until Dragon has been released anyway. I would expect at that point RED could release a firmware for Scarlet to improve it to at or better than R1 specs (of course by then R1 would be completely sold out anyway) and then Epic users would simply have an option to purchase Dragon for $6000 if they wanted to distance themselves from Scarlet.
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It seems that both Epic and Scarlet will have an upgrade path, and its been claimed that the Scarlet's will be more expensive. We have to wait and see about that. And by the way, people who paid for an Epic will have priority to technology, like sensor upgrades etc.
 
Since WE are on this Topic. Since the The RED ONE is Going to Be so Darn Popular, Give US the Option to Upgrade to the DRAGON sensor as Well.
 
Bryan Moore said:
So you pay 20,000 less and you think you are getting 5k? Bhahahahh
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The biggest laugh is that Epic is no more $20K more expensive then Scarlet. And actually, YES, whoever is buying Epic now, that's pretty much what they're doing.
 
sergio arguello said:
Price Drop is what it is...thats not what this thread is about. Its the incesent need to have more and more and the unwillingness to want to pay for it. Its all a bit like children. I wasnt mocking anyone, i was just doing the same as everyone if you took it as mocking then you too see my point. Want what an epic does buy an epic if i want what a phantom does ill buy a phantom...
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Dude, we don't want 120fps @ 5K, neither 150fps @ 4K, nor 300fps @ 2K. Dude, if we want an Epic, we'll get a $19K Epic. We are NOT asking for an Epic.
 
sergio arguello said:
Price Drop is what it is...thats not what this thread is about. Its the incesent need to have more and more and the unwillingness to want to pay for it. Its all a bit like children. I wasnt mocking anyone, i was just doing the same as everyone if you took it as mocking then you too see my point. Want what an epic does buy an epic if i want what a phantom does ill buy a phantom...
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Very well said!! I am not trying to put anyone down, but I was in the market for Scarlet, then after price drop I dropped Scarlet and took a loan out for EPIC. If RED now tries to kill Epic market even more by making Scarlet like Epic, then it would be a huge disappointment and many people may leave the company (including me). IMHO, don't ask for freebies. I took a risk by taking a loan because I wanted the best specs, so should other scarlet owners if they want to upgrade. As someone mentioned earlier, its like buying a Volkswagon and asking the company to put Bentley features in it... If RED now offers 5K in Scarlet + more frame rates, then people like me who are just buying Epic would be at a loss. There has to be a separation b/w the two cameras. I am sure when Dragon comes out, Scarlet would get a major upgrade, but so will Epic. If the lines are blur, why would anyone bother to get an Epic and would just for 2 Scarlets instead..
 
The camera that I paid for is the same price now. However the Epic was never sold for $19K. Usually the price and features/capabilities of an item are tied together. So, pushing up the features OR pulling down the price, is very much related. That's how business and competition works. Forget about how much you paid for your cameras, I'm sorry but that is not relevant anymore. If the Epic's current hardware can do more, it will do more. Also from the Red's company position. It seems that the Epics features/capabilities and price is very competitive right now. However the Scarlet doesn't seem to be so much. So if Red want to be more competitive at Scarlet price point, I guess they have to give more in order to attract more customers. But that's for them to decide. :)
 
Scarlet is capable of 4K in 1:1.9 ratio. (4096x2160=8847360px)
We just want the same number of pixels, but in 1:2.35 ratio.
So we want a 4.5Kws (4559x1940=8847360px) with the same frame rate than actual 4K.
And 5Kws (5120x2133px) just at 24fps.
 
Ayan Pratap said:
Very well said!! I am not trying to put anyone down, but I was in the market for Scarlet, then after price drop I dropped Scarlet and took a loan out for EPIC. If RED now tries to kill Epic market even more by making Scarlet like Epic, then it would be a huge disappointment and many people may leave the company (including me). IMHO, don't ask for freebies. I took a risk by taking a loan because I wanted the best specs, so should other scarlet owners if they want to upgrade. As someone mentioned earlier, its like buying a Volkswagon and asking the company to put Bentley features in it... If RED now offers 5K in Scarlet + more frame rates, then people like me who are just buying Epic would be at a loss. There has to be a separation b/w the two cameras. I am sure when Dragon comes out, Scarlet would get a major upgrade, but so will Epic. If the lines are blur, why would anyone bother to get an Epic and would just for 2 Scarlets instead..
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Ayan don't worry so much. Epic will always be Epic. Every good company knows how to protect their higher end products. At the moment however, Epic costs only twice the price of a Scarlet, and does 10 times more.(ie: 12fps @ 5K vs 120fps @ 5K) In the mean time competitors are introducing products very threatening to Scarlet.
 
You know, this is like buying a Ferrari street car and saying that there is no reason Ferrari shouldn't give you the same performance available on their Formula 1 race cars.
 
My guess is that 80-90% of the Epic users shoot 5k 24/25 89/90% of their time.

Opening that for scarlet, wouldn't really make sense...
 
David W. Jones said:
You know, this is like buying a Ferrari street car and saying that there is no reason Ferrari shouldn't give you the same performance available on their Formula 1 race cars.
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Actually, it's like if i've got a ferrari street car, and they are selling a formula 1 race car for half the price of mine now. Scarlet vs red one is a new problem here. Nothing bad at trying to discuss and resolve it.
 
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How can EPIC be 20 grand more when it cost 19? People seem stuck in the past. Electronics evolve very fast, and epic has Dragon coming which will make the EPIC a whole new beast. It would be amazing to get the scarlet to 120fps at 2 or 3 k. Hopefully build 4 brings some goodies, or it may make sense to boost the scarlet spec when EPIC gets dragon, to not leave scarlet to much in the dust.
 
As a Scarlet owner I do think 5K motion belongs exclusively to Epic at that moment. If Scarlet was able to do 5K up tp 30fps, productions would only rent Epics if they were planning higher than usual framerates. And Epic owners already have to (probably) adjust their renting rates.
EDIT: Gunleik was faster :)

4.5K would be a great option, though it still doesn't quite hold up with RED's 4K delivery idea - but it would be a positiv sign.
 
I think it is less about Epic vs Scarlet and more about the market vs the Scarlet. Of course those that invested in a Scarlet want the camera to stay relevant. Sony's new F5 for example will shoot in 120fps in 2K scaled, not windowed and have 4k capabilities (for an extra fee) plus pro In and Out features built in for an estimated equivalent price. Epic owners don't have the same issue. The Epic is by far the strongest camera in it's category for price and performance.

We all love RED for what they have done to the industry. Most of us are fanboys. Most of us don't want to consider buying a Sony camera. We want to continue supporting RED. The question is:
If the Scarlet hardware is capable of supporting firmware-updated features that will keep Sony one step behind should it be updated to do so? I'll love the Scarlet either way. There is no harm in discussing these things. At the very worst it is fun to think about.
 
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