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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

KOMODO....

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Phil Holland said:
Agreed, but I'll play super devils advocate :)

Long Duration Live Streaming or Doc filmmakers who can't stop for nobody.

But 100% agree, I'll be exploiting how small I can make Komodo more than anything.
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Haha

To me it's just a matter of standardization between different cameras. And to had weight in the back for those who will use Komodo as an A-Cam on their shoulder (even if its not designed for that... We've all seen the shoulder rigs for DSLRs :p)
 
Thad K Donovan said:
I am brand new to the forum, but I've been watching this thread for weeks. I thought I'd throw in my two cents as someone who seems to have slightly different needs than many of the camera ops I've read here. It might even help RED address the market segment that I am in.

I film corporate, tourism, and indie film projects. They are good quality, but not Hollywood quality. I have mostly used Sony's FS7, but have switched to Blackmagic this year. I have two P4Ks and one P6K. I keep one P4K permanently mounted on a Ronin gimbal, the other P4K permanently mounted on a 600mm lens, and the P6K for all other uses. So think about that for a second. I bought two additional cameras purely to avoid the inconvenience of having to change lenses and rigs. That is incredible that we can do that these days.

For all my needs, the P4K/P6K are plenty good enough in terms of quality. My lenses are more of a problem than the cameras (Rokinon Cine DS set). Having said that, I would love to advance to the next level in terms of image quality. That's where RED seems to separate itself from that lower tier. Assuming that is true, I am hoping that the Komodo can be my new A cam. I know for a lot of you, it would be more of a B cam or a specialty/crash cam, but for me it would be my A. I could also see buying multiple Komodos over time. I totally understand that simply upgrading sensors/codecs isn't going to deliver Hollywood quality in and of itself, but I know where the (small) limitations are in my current equipment.

Most of the RED cameras are out of my price range. I could justify the Raven, but in terms of features, specs, I don't feel like I'd be gaining much on the FS7. Yes, the IQ would be a bit better, but I'm holding out for an even smaller form factor via the Komodo. I never use the FS7 any more because the BMPCs match or exceed it in terms of quality and they are much more convenient to use.

My personal wish list for the Komodo:
6K
48 fps or better (I do lots of slow mo, so it's mandatory)
whatever the best RED codec/color science available, otherwise Braw is plenty good for me
As good or better low light performance relative to BMPCs
S35 or better (FF preferred). Anything less than S35 and I'm out

I don't care about an integrated monitor (other than something for changing settings). I have several good external monitors. I also don't care about Hydrogen unless it does something magical that my current phone or monitors can't do.

Built-in XLR audio of some sort would be nice (the BMPCs have mini-xlrs which work great for my needs). However, I'd be fine with only scratch audio as I'd use the Komodo mostly for higher end work or indie films which would have separately recorded sound.

So I'm crossing my fingers that Komodo fits the bill. So far it looks promising. I know RED may not target my segment, but to me there's no reason why they shouldn't. I want the best image quality I can afford in a compact package. If a RED product suddenly becomes affordable and compact, I'm a potential customer, and there's a lot more like me out there.
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Welcome Thad! Regarding your list:
I think 6K and S35+ are confirmed.
48fps in 6K is unlikely, more likely in 4K (but then you are no longer using a S35 sensor. I'm hoping for 48fps+ in 5K, but not sure if that is realistic.
I have a feeling the colour and low light will be very good.
 
Phil Holland said:
Slow Rolling Shutter = very bad news.

Decently fast readout times with Rolling Shutter = pretty ideal for motion picture use.

However, in the land of handheld, gimbal, and faster movement filmmaking Rolling Shutter is a real pain even at higher readouts.

Global Shutter solves those concerns in those instances, which happens to be how a lot of filmmakers work these days.

Also, if Komodo's image quality is there at speed, it potentially be used in instances where things like "headless" cameras exist in today's workflows.

DSMC2 is small, but this has the potential to be really small.

The Komodo picture is becoming pretty clear to me. I have a few hopes/wants, but I 100% see where this fits in.
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Phil, can you perhaps explain something to me? If rolling shutter is such a big problem, why are people not just using the motion mounts global shutter mode? Is there a difference between 'fake' global shutter and sensor-based global shutter? Is it just the ~1.5 stop light loss, or is there some other trade-off?
 
Komodo + iphone 11 pro = perfect combo. Cant wait to see what you have in stored for us Jarred. I am excited that the Komodo isnt locked to Hydrogen(android only devices).

I am beyond grateful to have seen it in person. Very impressed.
 
Robert Hofmeyr said:
Phil, can you perhaps explain something to me? If rolling shutter is such a big problem, why are people not just using the motion mounts global shutter mode? Is there a difference between 'fake' global shutter and sensor-based global shutter? Is it just the ~1.5 stop light loss, or is there some other trade-off?
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Motion mount comes with artifact when shooting very open. And its not a true global shutter. What it does well is sinewave the exposure over the frame. But yes that comes with a lightloss and you need to be stopped down to not get the artifacts which gives you even more exosure limits. But for those situations when it fits, it works well.
 
Christopher bell said:
Komodo + iphone 11 pro = perfect combo. Cant wait to see what you have in stored for us Jarred. I am excited that the Komodo isnt locked to Hydrogen(android only devices).

I am beyond grateful to have seen it in person. Very impressed.
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Lucky guy ;) does Jarred promise you to lock you down into the red dungeon if you tell us something more ? ^^
 
Björn Benckert said:
Motion mount comes with artifact when shooting very open. And its not a true global shutter. What it does well is sinewave the exposure over the frame. But yes that comes with a lightloss and you need to be stopped down to not get the artifacts which gives you even more exosure limits. But for those situations when it fits, it works well.
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Thanks Björn.
 
One thing I’m excited about the Komodo is that there seems to be something going on with mobile phone/ platforms connectivity. having purchased the iPhone 11 Pro recently and knowing it has a kickass CPU and GPU makes me dream of streaming, encoding, playback and even capture/ editing on IOS for incredible new ways of producing and distributing content… There could be an interesting small revolution going on with the Komodo if something like this is pulled off...

If this happens, a Komodo Mobile specific Redcine X for photos and videos needs to be done. Red Team? Bueller?
 
Sergio Perez said:
If this happens, a Komodo Mobile specific Redcine X for photos and videos needs to be done. Red Team? Bueller?
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The Komodo and Hydrogen combo only means that the Phone recognizes the Komodo as it's camera. Meaning that you can stream and shoot to the phone's internal codec, not R3D in the phone. So a Redcine-X on the phone wouldn't be able to tap into R3D files and becomes meaningless as an app if you're thinking about editing RAW.
 
Sergio Perez said:
If this happens, a Komodo Mobile specific Redcine X for photos and videos needs to be done. Red Team? Bueller?
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Sending RAW to a phone (other than maybe stills or frame grabs) would be overkill. The new iPhone is powerful (for a phone), but it's still no match for editing 6K RAW.
 
Ryan Genova said:
Sending RAW to a phone (other than maybe stills or frame grabs) would be overkill. The new iPhone is powerful (for a phone), but it's still no match for editing 6K RAW.
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It's also so unrealistic and impractical since your phone's storage would be eaten up in a heartbeat.
 
Christoffer Glans said:
It's also so unrealistic and impractical since your phone's storage would be eaten up in a heartbeat.
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I expect we will see some form of encoded video similar to what is passed to the SDI output at user selectable resolutions up to 4k. Maybe uncompressed baseband RGB that is encoded by a phone app for streaming or proxy recording.
 
David Rasberry said:
I expect we will see some form of encoded video similar to what is passed to the SDI output at user selectable resolutions up to 4k. Maybe uncompressed baseband RGB that is encoded by a phone app for streaming or proxy recording.
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As I posted previously - IF they are in fact sending MIPI CSI-2 out of the brain - you could run that into a mobile device and the mobile device would “see it” as the mobile devices camera. At that point - you are just sending an RGB image (which could be LOG) direct to the processor in the mobile device. So you can leverage all the image processing and compression in the mobile devices - and also leverage whatever API/SDK exists for that mobile device. So ... on an iPhone 11 for example, you would be H265 UHD record or stream. But mobile processor have lots of other goodies now - like ... 4K HDR portrait mode video, computervision ISP for object detection / segmentation, etc. - I have no idea if Komodo will facilitates this - but it’s 100% possible with existing tech and you will see a greater “integration / marriage” between cinema cameras and mobile devices simply because of what technology is getting rolled into these mobile processors - and the depth of folks creating mobile apps.
 
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Would be interesting to see integration with an iPhone to simultaneously capture depth data from the phone camera array. Something something machine learning and then we can do something something something interesting with the depth data and Komodo? haha.
 
Mark L. Pederson said:
As I posted previously - IF they are in fact sending MIPI CSI-2 out of the brain - you could run that into a mobile device and the mobile device would “see it” as the mobile devices camera. At that point - you are just sending an RGB image (which could be LOG) direct to the processor in the mobile device. So you can leverage all the image processing and compression in the mobile devices - and also leverage whatever API/SDK exists for that mobile device. So ... on an iPhone 11 for example, you would be H265 UHD record or stream. But mobile processor have lots of other goodies now - like ... 4K HDR portrait mode video, computervision ISP for object detection / segmentation, etc. - I have no idea if Komodo will facilitates this - but it’s 100% possible with existing tech and you will see a greater “integration / marriage” between cinema cameras and mobile devices simply because of what technology is getting rolled into these mobile processors - and the depth of folks creating mobile apps.
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Smart apps and 3rd party software signal processing in pro cameras is the next frontier...
 
I was checking out the specs on the Sony Xperia 1, which includes DNG raw as a supported still image format and has a 4k 21:9 HDR OLED display with a three camera setup similar to the iphone. It will take up to a 1TB micro SD card according to reviews, though the Sony spec says 512GB.
 
1TB mSD cards from Samsung and Micron are currently in device testing and will be released next year, with the Android 10 phones. The SanDisk Extreme 1TB cards are only made in small, randomly shipped batches and are pretty much unavailable for the most part, likely because SanDisk wants to stockpile good cards. There should be no issues with device support, so long as the phone or tablet is running recent Android and has 4GB or more of RAM with larger amounts being better for video recording. The SX1 has 6GB, so it's right at the ideal position for using a 1TB card.
 
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