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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

4K Delivery... get ready.

Rudi Herbert said:
Jeff is very insightful as usual, and though he's right, I don't share his optimism on that timeline.

Yes, BD is now finally getting mainstream acceptance, but DVD still outsells it 3 to 1. Why? Not so much the cost of the player which is a one-time purchase, but the cost of BDs is still very high compared to DVD. To say that the average cost of a BD is $12 is misleading, most of the titles that sell for that much are dumbed down, single discs without any extra features, and then, mostly older titles. The BD average cost is still over $25, compared to $14 for DVD, with most new releases pushing past $35. That's stiff for most people, buying only 3-4 movies for 100 bucks, and makes a strong argument for rentals and pirated copies. It could be said that the high prices of BD are one of the reasons Netflix and others stay in business, cementing one of the mantras of later years: if owning is expensive, then rent. Likewise, the upgrade to widescreen, HD capable televisions has finally become mainstream in the more affluent countries, but that is very much an ongoing process, with millions of buyers upgrading to widescreen , or from 720p to 1080p, or DLP to LCD, or LCD to LED, etc, etc. It is very much a live process, and one where giants like Samsung and Sony are fighting tooth and nail over. So, are we really that naive to think that those millions of people who patiently waited for those TVs to sell for $500 will now trash those units and spend $thousands for 4K Tvs that will be able to play very limited content, which will likely cost $50-60 a title or play over cable at horrendous quality. If you think HD is commonplace, with most cable looking still awfully pixelated and macroblocked, so what will over-the-air 4K look like?
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Well Redray was feeding 4K content at only 15 mb/s over the last 2 years of demos per Stuart .. I dont know of any other codec that can be transmitted with such a small streaming data footprint... that part of it alone enables digital delivery like no other (known) or proposed content delivery mechanism -

4K delivered at 15 mb/s is the game changer
 
Rudi, I don't think I've ever paid more than $17 for a Blu-Ray title. OK, that's not true, my daughter HAD to have Enchanted on release day and I don't mind watching Amy Adams, so I think I might have spent $19. If you're paying $25 for a BD, you need to start shopping somewhere else.

Tim Whitcomb said:
4K delivered at 15 mb/s is the game changer
Click to expand...

Yes it is. Especially with what the ATSC is doing for data rate mandates on UltraHD. ...Just sayin'
 
Jeremy, second that for us down under. At least a couple years back, BR DVD's (new releases) were about $40 AUD. You can now get old school movies for cheaper, but it's all still ridiculous. Eagerly await consumer 4k projection
 
What if Sony's new standard IS RedRay? The timing is right, and they have inroads into theatres and homes... Just a thought, especially since RedRay won't go anywhere without major consumer and pro electronics companies also behind it.
 
REDRAY will lead the new generation of entertainment/resolution, and as always most that can will adopt the new tech.
 
Anthony Rinaldi said:
What if Sony's new standard IS RedRay? The timing is right, and they have inroads into theatres and homes... Just a thought, especially since RedRay won't go anywhere without major consumer and pro electronics companies also behind it.
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Sony is backing tweaked for 4K h.264 (later h.265) and NOT RedRAY for future products. They want absolutely nothing to do with any tech that they don't have a big piece of owning, selling, or creating.
 
Feels a bit like waiting for Apple announcement in the old days. I'm all excited
 
Jarred - Please tell me you have put a lot of thought into the interactive/menu layer. One of my many hats is a professional DVD & Blu-ray author. The DVD spec was antiquated when it came out and and the Blu-ray spec is absolutely horrific to author within and inconsistent to play back. I think Apple's semi-open standards based iTunes Extras is a much much better approach. (As was Microsoft's HDi and Sony's UMD).
 
Tim Whitcomb said:
Content providers are the KEY... whats been the big obstacle to them giving titles to NETFLIX etc? PIRACY

how do we solve PIRACY issue = DRM?

Whats been the challenge of DRM? = TOO EXPENSIVE

DRM = My brothers invention is the BEST solution and just got a patent issued... be prepared to RECLAIM YOUR IDENTITY in 2014... and will provide the most affordable and scalable DRM solution that is privacy centric. Google and the others are trying to enslave the human race digitally.. we hope to change that.

brothers patent here http://websafeid.com


Anyway... the key to all of this (imho)

1. Secure digital delivery = ? (this is my guess as to the mystery partner)
2. Affordable delivery and sensible bandwidth = REDCODE... (15 mps per second kids at 4K, game over)
3. Affordable Encoder/Decoder = REDRAY Home market
4. Affordable PROJECTORS/DECODERS = Red again leading the way and Sony and Christie and the rest already following suit for theaters.

Now as Mike Most has chimed in for the past several years... there are some standards bodies in the way... and my bet is RED did their homework.
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Could not agree more, Tim. And with you being a person who routinely shares extremely cogent posts, that makes me feel pretty good. :) Intellectual property is about to get VERY interesting. I'm looking forward to reading more about the solution your brother authored. And thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Best,

Eryc
 
Tim Whitcomb said:
I dont think many people realize how fucking game changing this is.
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+infinity

There are many of us who have been around for the entire ride...and far before the RED ride left the gate. We get it. And I completely share your spirit. As a matter of fact, a certain song keeps pinging through my head -- something about ding dong and witches being dead.

It is obvious the old system will not be completely dismantled, but there promises to be an opportunity for far more voices to be heard. It is only a matter of time before one of us uses this new age, end-to-end system to produce a breakout hit on the order of a Paranormal Activity/Blair Witch/Gangnam Style...or even a 42 to illuminate a story/idea that should have been broached long ago. We've all seen what word of mouth can do on the Net. It would be awesome if RED were to offer a turnkey distribution solution that allows an indie such as a Tom Lowe to directly profit from his art.

Further, it is highly probable that someone on this very forum will be the first to pull it off. ;) But what happens then? I'm really curious to see the blockades that will suddenly jut up from the earth Brazil-style to insulate the old guard once this scenario plays out. It is a given that distribution, and exhibition, entities will do everything in their power to protect their interests. One way of achieving this, Hollywood will attempt to appropriate talent from the fringes, but inevitably there will be more options than at any point in history. Completely independent artists will be able to personally control and distribute their own IP -- and they'll realize it. And don't get me wrong, my use of the term "Hollywood" has little to do with the artists, and everything to do with the back office execs "brokering" deals. I am all for excising the middlemen as much as possible, and returning the power to the artists -- where it rightfully belongs.

Obviously, progress routinely spurs innovation, such as encouraging developments which lead to differentiated products/services (read: 3D, interactive seating, et al) -- much in the way the advent of television fueled a reaction in motion picture production. However, the fact remains that although many benefits for the indie community will arise, there will also be negatives, and situational awareness demands that the largest possible survey of variables be examined so that unfavorable results can be mitigated whenever possible.

For one, bandwidth will likely become a battleground with large service providers imposing arbitrary data limits, charging obscene rates, or otherwise throttling our ability to propagate content on the Internet. God bless REDCODE's svelte framework in this regard. Imagine individuals being flagged as content creators/distributors for violating ISP imposed limits and getting an enormous bill for your trouble. But on the converse, we already have Google Fiber building a case for the feasibility of gigabit networking, and it doesn't take an Einstein to calculate what a huge boon this would be for indie producers (although I believe one of GF's use stipulations may bar users from hosting servers).

It is difficult to fathom the bureaucratic red tape, and back dealing that could mire an implementation like Google Fiber -- it takes inconceivable amounts of capital and political gerrymandering to alter existing infrastructure to that degree (and no amount of capital can convince some individuals of usability or assist in dispelling FUD -- I'm sure Jim/Jarred/Graeme/et al can attest regarding skin tone BS).

In any case, yeah -- the game is definitely going to change. It has no choice with RED AND all of us around.


Best,

Eryc
 
Sony has taken a different path than we are. They like to try and keep a closed Sony ecosystem.. and that is ok.

We are open.. putting the power in the hands of the content producers , no matter how big or small you are, and the content viewer , no matter how big or small you are.

All we care is that you are shooting 4k, finishing 4K, and watching 4K.

It is the way it should be.
 
Jarred Land said:
Sony has taken a different path than we are. They like to try and keep a closed Sony ecosystem.. and that is ok.

We are open.. putting the power in the hands of the content producers , no matter how big or small you are, and the content viewer , no matter how big or small you are.

All we care is that you are shooting 4k, finishing 4K, and watching 4K.

It is the way it should be.
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I'm afraid we can not do that Sir. You give us dragon sensors and ask us to shoot 4k... I'm sorry but it will not happen. I think sooner than we know 4k well feel like standard def. And who on earth wants to satisfy with the common standards :)
 
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