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October 30th Announcement Feedback

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So its official Fixed Lens scarlet is S35 then.
(you guys re-did the brain chassis?)
No way a 2x mm lens will be wide enough on a 2/3 inch camera.
Well it will certainly justify the price increase to scarlett dreamers.
A 25-200 seems like an amazing reach. F3-4.5 ish isnt unobtainable at this price point.
It will also, with red gunner, assuming it functions like a zoom controller, make mixed shooters like Gibby (or me) very happy.
We have dreamed of s35 ENG lenses for some time.
Wicked "B" or "C" camera too.
Thanks for listening.

I could be wrong though...
 
Ivan Cortazar said:
Actually, what it would be a great thing from Red is to announce a list of compability Red to Epic-x accesories? Red battery belt? top mount, craddle???
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I believe it has already been mentioned that the only current accessories that will not be compatible are the top mounts. Even the baseplate and related accessories (like your Allstar dovetail) will be compatible, provided you buy a "riser" adapter for the Epic. You should then be able to keep your current rods set up.
 
RED ONE retaining value after Epic-X

RED ONE retaining value after Epic-X

Because of Stage 1 and Stage 2 vs. the initial perception of trading in the RED 1. A lot of people had got used to the idea of parting with their RED 1 and getting a New Epic-X.

Therefore the amount of Used RED 1's for sale immediately after execution of their Stage 2, mostly is foreseeable.

I'm seeing the 8500 number tossed around- Mainly due to the sudden flood of used cameras for sale.

IF- 4500 in free upgrades to the Epic-X were removed and shifted towards, getting an Epic-X with fewer free modules, and a free upgrade of Mysterium-X sensor on your RED 1- basically shifting the rewards, not costing any more to RED, I feel a lot of people would say, hell- I want to hold on to this NEW RED with Mysterium-X sensor.

Eliminating the flood of used RED 1's, translating to retention in value- leading up to the day when RED1's if they're still sold, would come with an automatic Mysterium-X sensor.

Thoughts.
 
Eric Haase said:
RED hasn't even explained what the Touch Focus feature really is or how it works. I asked the specific questioned and it was overlooked or ignored. And people are saying how great it is or how bad it is because it will eliminate a focus puller. I think everyone should trade in their Jump to Conclusions Mats for Epics. I'd love more detailed information of what this feature really is and what it can and can't do.
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I guess its too early since the announcement to use any sarcasm, I've seen several posts taking my original statement seriously...I do realize 1st AC's aren't going to be replaced with a touchscreen, the same way I realize anyone who doesn't like it can stick a follow focus on the camera anyway...lighten up people, its going to be a long year. :w00t:
 
Vladimir Eugene said:
Thoughts.
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Thoughts, well I would say that the offer is very unusual and amazing. Can't think of any other company (director) who would have even thought of anything similar.

My guess is, since the economic situation is cool and Jim can't adopt a role as a benefactor for all people in the business, RED has/had to find a compromize between fairness and managing in business. Consequently, it sounds like a wise move not to try to get all R1s back to California but instead to come up with such stages decreasing the amount of R1s returning back to RED.

In the end of the day, there are no free lunches and it is in everybody's advantage that RED manages decently in the business. Otherwise they had to collect the money somewhere else, say by increasing the prices of accessories. Such kind of implicit profit making is bit akwards from the customers' point of view. Just think of companies selling inkjet printers and making a big share of their profit by selling ink for an incredible price.
 
If fixed is s35, then maybe its 4k for 5K.
A limited feature set, but wicked non-the-less.
I mean what do you do with 5000+ Red ones being returned? LOL.
Given that Nikon and Canon have produced working s35 and FF 1080 cameras (abet with faults), Red has to step up.
Canon may introduce Raw video soon too, fix the bulls*&^ jello effect etc. These guys put new cameras out every year.
There's still a market for 2/3 removable though. ENG glass/controllers have their place.

Wait till November...
 
Jarred,

Just curious if there is going to be a first "TATTOO Day" akin the the first "RED Day" when the first set of RED ONE's went out.

I remember that was a great experience. Not that you guys aren't 100x busier these days...

Torrey
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I think you missed my point. I was stressing NOT that RED should give more in any way- nor make a good attempt not to take back 7000 cameras, but perhaps consider repackaging their current offer. I think more people would retain their current RED ONE's and not try to offload them if they moved some benefits from the Epic-X modules and transfered them towards the RED 1 Mysterium-X upgrade program.

vlad


Lauri Kettunen said:
Thoughts, well I would say that the offer is very unusual and amazing. Can't think of any other company (director) who would have even thought of anything similar.

My guess is, since the economic situation is cool and Jim can't adopt a role as a benefactor for all people in the business, RED has/had to find a compromize between fairness and managing in business. Consequently, it sounds like a wise move not to try to get all R1s back to California but instead to come up with such stages decreasing the amount of R1s returning back to RED.

In the end of the day, there are no free lunches and it is in everybody's advantage that RED manages decently in the business. Otherwise they had to collect the money somewhere else, say by increasing the prices of accessories. Such kind of implicit profit making is bit akwards from the customers' point of view. Just think of companies selling inkjet printers and making a big share of their profit by selling ink for an incredible price.
Click to expand...
 
Martin Garrison said:
I am extremely disappointed in the Oct 30th announcement. I sold my HVX 170 kit in anticipation of getting Fixed Scarlet and, at the least, expected a REASONABLE RELEASE WINDOW for the FIXED (the kit's WEIGHT plus WHAT IS INCLUDED would have also been nice)

Am I supposed to wait, with only my Iphone, in Red's rope line until Nov. 30th only to be told that 3K for 3K is now 3K for 5K?
OR
that, due to the cold economy, Red is dropping Fixed Scarlet altogether and focusing on high-end Scarlets and EPICs (remember they've dropped Scarlet before)?
Click to expand...

I think you may have to re-think what you expectations are, and come to terms there is no fixed timeline and see these boards for what they are. The chance to participate in the development. If it kills too much, then put it out of you mind until you hear it being released.

I too would really like a fixed date to plan series shoots I have coming up, but it is not going to happen, but have bought it the vision, and when it come it come. Unfortunately I will have to buy a 7D in the process, but will use the lenses on my new red when it comes out. opefully i can sell the 7d in 6 months. It all part of doing business.

There are a lot of us who like these boards, it gives us insight to the job at hand. I would rather know what is coming even though I don't know the when. I think a lot of people hear would agree.
 
On the 2/3 scarlets, does the snap in mic come with the camera brains, or is it to be sold separately? Considering how expensive some of their modules are, I don't want to be paying a lot of extra money of things that should be a necessity in a camera. A built in mic is a given just like the lens has a zoom/ focus ring or comes with a battery. Right?

On a side note, I'm really excited about touch focus tracking and the FLUT control. I've already accepted that I won't get my hands on one of these until at least early 2010. That's not a problem. I have another camera I'm using in the meantime and keep scarlet in the back on my mind. We're bound to get disappointed if we expect something this year. Set the expectations farther away and you can be pleasantly surprised if it comes early.
 
Can we stop changing the Scarlet and release it already? I'm a huge fan of RED but let's freaking get that camera into our hands! For heavens sake!

A year and a half ago we were expecting a 3k camera for around $3k in six months. After six months, a huge announcement was made changing everything about the camera and the design scheme.

A month later, even newer specs and designs were released. We were expecting summer/fall releases the following year. And earlier releases of the other cameras.

6 months later, there's an announcement that it's going to take even longer to accomplish because RED needed to scale back their working hours and the economy was struggling and they couldn't find manufacturers, etc.etc. The 'few month delay' announced has now become 6 months for some of the anticipated camera releases, with the beta of one of them just starting and the release date in the distant future when the beta people feel the camera is ready -- and that's just for the EPIC.

Then we have news recently that the new scarlet has better features, but the price is raised, and we have no news whatsoever of when it's even going to get released. Based on what we've heard, it could be another 6 months before it's even in beta while they finish the epic. I, of course, don't know this for certain.

...But really? I would /still/ be insanely happy to have a 3k camera. I don't need the 5k capabilities for what I'm doing. I would have loved to have had that camera in my hands. Fortunately, I got a great deal on an HVX in the interim which I'll be using even more since I'm not seeing a Scarlet in the near future. Some people mentioned that the Scarlet has changed drastically from it's initial target audience and I agree. But couldn't we have just had the old Scarlet?

Sad face. :(
 
Ok, if Fixed Scarlett is s35 then miniprimes are probably axed.
Perhaps the announcement of a 2/3 ENG lens kit system for removable mount Scarlett.
Not likely though, lots of Canon, Fuji's and Angi's around.
Not cheap in 16:9 though. Zooms make more sense in 2/3 inch market anyway IMHO.
 
Martin Garrison said:
I am extremely disappointed in the Oct 30th announcement. I sold my HVX 170 kit in anticipation of getting Fixed Scarlet and, at the least, expected a REASONABLE RELEASE WINDOW for the FIXED (the kit's WEIGHT plus WHAT IS INCLUDED would have also been nice)

Am I supposed to wait, with only my Iphone, in Red's rope line until Nov. 30th only to be told that 3K for 3K is now 3K for 5K?
OR
that, due to the cold economy, Red is dropping Fixed Scarlet altogether and focusing on high-end Scarlets and EPICs (remember they've dropped Scarlet before)?

It's also conspicuous that nobody from Red is responding to the 100s (1000s?) of posts to Jim's announcement. Why not?

And will this very post may even constitute a "bad attitude" and thus excommunication from Red purchasing.

I will wait one more month but will expect concrete details on Fixed Scarlet (realistic release window, weight of brain, price, included accessories, sample clips of fixed with audio, etc).

I will also be following Canon's and Pani's developments and if they come out with something comparable to Fixed Scarlet I will jump, because I do not appreciate the Boy-Who-Cried-Wolf and trendy rope-line aspects of Red's approach, however "revolutionary" their sensors have been.

PS I have also been offended by the beyond exorbitant pricing of Red's accessories. $250 for a knob? Is this not offensive? To me, this is why the idea of the fixed Scarlet package was/is so appealing to me because I took it as a olive branch to micro-moviemakers such as myself who can not afford all these expensive proprietary add-ons.
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You had a great camera (the 170) which allowed you to make movies and sold it in anticipation of a potential release date and now you're pissed. So you made a bad business decision. You can't blame Red for that.
I'm seeing a lot of people here who want something for nothing. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't believe that Red is in business to provide "micro-moviemakers" with equipment.
Also, to call Red's accessory pricing exorbitant is laughable if you've ever bought any other professional film or video gear.
Shane.
 
Zachary Marsh said:
Fortunately, I got a great deal on an HVX in the interim which I'll be using even more since I'm not seeing a Scarlet
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Did you buy it from Martin? Good move.

Just kidding.

Once you have this camera in your hands, this sad face will just seem like a sad little dream. It will be absolutely worth waiting for --

...any RED ONE owner who waited 18 months or longer to receive their cameras will confirm. And that was just to get my camera. It took them months longer to get it to the breakthrough Build 16, and now the even better Build 20. And the patience required for post solutions...So basically, I waited about 2-1/2 years for it to be the best camera that it can be...and it was worth every incremental step!

So all this Veruca Salt-ish, "I want it now, Daddy" sentiment makes me realize just how important a bomb-proof program is...if RED released even a mildly buggy or less than perfected camera to this impatient next generation of users, they'd be opening a big can of whup-ass on themselves. "Get it right" is really the only option.
 
Meryem Ersoz said:
So all this Veruca Salt-ish, "I want it now, Daddy" sentiment makes me realize just how important a bomb-proof program is...
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I didn't really say that. What I said in essence was "I want the original announced Scarlet that could've been completed by now", and instead they keep changing it and re-making it.
 
the announcement listed prices for electronic nikon, canon, and RED mounts

are we thinking that brains will come with a free non-electronic PL mount or in the case of 2/3" cinema the option for c mount?

either way I'm not worried because if they aren't free they will surely be less expensive than the electronic mounts....or so i would think

any confirmation from red would be appreciated
 
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