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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

The Scarlet Speculation Thread!

I think the Scarlet speculation boils down to this:
1. Is this camera going to be a lower-end HVX200 type camera with a smaller chip than Red One and possibly only 2K? OR...
2. Is this camera going to be interchangeable with Red One (i.e. 35mm sized sensor, 4K ability but less feature-packed)?

I'm guessing at the latter, it doesn't really make sense for Red to go for a whole other, lower-end market especially when their offering first dibs to current Red One owners (why would those owners be interested in a lower-end camera that wouldn't necessarily match their Red Ones especially in terms of resolution and DOF?) I see this camera as more like the Aaton A-Minima was to Super 16mm when it came out - fantastically small and mobile, able to be rigged virtually anywhere but with less capabilities than its bigger Super 16mm brothers like the SR3).

David Wyatt.
 
Rob Lohman said:
Hey Wayne, welcome to reduser! Come see us at NAB '08 for the details etc.!



As Jim would say it's going to be BAD ASS :)
Click to expand...

Hope so.

Was the company that provided the technology base for the mysterium sensor ever announced?

Thanks for the invitation.
 
Before I start please know I have no more solid info than any other person outside Red.

There are two words here to work from "Pocket" and "Professional"

I for one do not think Jim minces words so I'm inclined to believe that Scarlet is most decidedly both. From that we can infer a few things...

Pocket means small, like this...
pma2007_canon_tx1_3.jpg

So I don't think we will see a 35mm imager or an interchangeable lens, although c-mount optics might be possible, there are some 1/3" fujinons for the Iconix camera. But I doubt it's a three chip sensor, most likely it's a 1/3" or 1/2" size CMOS.

Professional means 1080P or 2K Redcode RAW
720P is a broadcast format and a prosumer format, even Panasonic is starting to move away from it with the HPX3000 and the Varicam2.
It also means manual iris and focus. Almost assuredly it will record to SD-HC cards. They are plenty big and fast enough for the 2K variety of Redcode and take up much less room in the pocket.

So who and what is Scarlet for then? I suspect that Scarlet is in some ways Red's answer to the SI-2K mini, but Redder. Firstly it's a perfect POV and remote camera for all sorts of interesting shots. Secondly it'll be a lot more discreet than your Red One so if you need to steal a shot you can look just like a tourist with your pocket camera and still get 2K Redcode to mix in with your 4k. I can think of all sorts of reason's you'd want it "but mostly, it's for the reason's we haven't thought of." (Thank you Mr. Sagan)

Price:
Here's were I think that Professional part comes in again. It's not going to be sub $5000, at least I'd be surprised. But it won't be over $10,000 either.
Anyway that's my take on things.

I just can't wait to hold Scarlet in my arms, Err, hands.
 
Evin Grant said:
Price:
Here's were I think that Professional part comes in again. It's not going to be sub $5000, at least I'd be surprised.
Click to expand...

Over $5K for a pocket camera? I don't see it.

I think Red is going to make the most "bad ass" CONSUMER camera - with features professional can use. That, is a big market. That is not over $5K.
 
Offhollywood said:
Over $5K for a pocket camera? I don't see it.

I think Red is going to make the most "bad ass" CONSUMER camera - with features professional can use. That, is a big market. That is not over $5K.
Click to expand...

Hehehe. Always the cheerleader, Mark. :)
 
Offhollywood,
I disagree about your 720p theory... this thing will do 1080 or they can't call it pro. I don't think it'll do full 2K, but 1080 is pretty darn close anyway.

It's Jim's insistence on calling it "pocket" that has me confused. How "pro" can something that small be? Is it one of those deals where it's just marketing speak and the body alone without a lens, battery or anything else will fit into a huge pocket? I just don't know.
________
Colorado marijuana dispensary
 
Pocket
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Pockets hang from belts as 15th-century peasants thresh siligo wheat in a Tacuinum Sanitatis

A pocket is a small bag, particularly a bag-like receptacle either fastened to or inserted in an article of clothing. Cargo pants have pockets with an extra large capacity.

In European clothing pockets began by being hung like purses from a belt, which could be concealed beneath a coat or jerkin and reached through a slit in the outer garment.

The word appears in Middle English as poket, and is taken from a Norman diminutive of O. Fr. poke, pouque, mod. poche, cf. pouch. The form "poke" is now only used dialectically, or in such proverbial sayings as "a pig in a poke," and possibly in the poke-bonnet, the coal-scuttle bonnet fashionable during the first part of the 19th century, and now worn by the female members of the Salvation Army. More probably the name of the bonnet is connected with poke, to thrust forward, dig. The origin of this is obscure. Dutch has poken, pook, a dagger; Swedish has påk, a stick.
 
Ethan Cooper said:
Offhollywood,
I disagree about your 720p theory... this thing will do 1080 or they can't call it pro. I don't think it'll do full 2K, but 1080 is pretty darn close anyway.

It's Jim's insistence on calling it "pocket" that has me confused. How "pro" can something that small be? Is it one of those deals where it's just marketing speak and the body alone without a lens, battery or anything else will fit into a huge pocket? I just don't know.
Click to expand...

Yeah - I think it will be 1080p the more I think about it - BUT the Varicam (720p) is still a professional camera. 16mm cameras are still "professional" -

The RED website does say "professional digital cinema" - so, MAYBE it is a tiny HIGH END CAMERA - THAT might be $5K+ like Evin is suggesting - but that is a MUCH smaller market than PRO-SUMERS, FILM SCHOOLS, SERIOUS HOBBIESTS -

I am VERY curious - (and so are the competitors!! heheheheh) I'm buying one anyway, as WHATEVER the hell it is - it's gonna be cool -

I bit the bullet and picked up a Canon HV20 just to shoot home movies of my son - I am shocked how good the stuff looks for a camera under $1K -
 
Offhollywood has got very similar guesses to what i have. Of course at the odd occasion i get stumped and think "but then again it could be totally different considering the lack of info we have started with" so i take a step back and keep the hopes low so as to not be dashed! haha

So on one hand i want to "keep it real" and guesstimate similar things to what you list. But then the other hand thinks about RED ONE and what it has done to that side of the market and if it was then done RED Style to the "pocket" side of the market. 10x less the cost @ 4x the resolution + Customer Driven Desires and Features.

Hmmm I shall remain low hopes just in case its not as big an effort from the RED Team (not that that is a bad thing they are stellar!). Because with such little info to go off this early in the game it could be anything regardless of a few terms here and there. I know what i'd love RED to do, and thats do to the 2k-8k (pro-sumer to entry level pro) sector what they did to the full on pro sector so such pro features and quality is available at a fraction of the cost even dedicated students and pro-sumers could afford such a feature packed bit of kit!

I'll just have to stay low hoped for a bit longer for some more solid info! But its great reading all the ideas people have :) Oh and even though painful, Jim's teasing dribs of info and phrases are great because Canon/Sony/Panasonic etc would never do it and its getting much more taboo the design and creation process when it should be the opposite this day and age. ala RED

Sorry for the rant. I'm excited (Like Big Kev!)
 
Offhollywood said:
- THAT might be $5K+ like Evin is suggesting - but that is a MUCH smaller market than PRO-SUMERS, FILM SCHOOLS, SERIOUS HOBBIESTS - -
Click to expand...

How much market is there really for all these 4K REDs?

I have been doing some math lately.
In this whole world about 5000 movies are made every year.
Assuming a 2 month average shooting per movie, that will make 10K months a year. That is 850 shooting years. If everybody shoot with RED, (which is not going to happen for another 50 years), then we will need about 1000 REDs to do the job. In 2008, there will be over 5000 REDS in use. Or, in otherwords, there is an over abundance of REDs out there.

All enthusiasm we see on these forums are the result of anticipation of getting their first REDs. By next year this time, all the enthusiasm we see on these forums might turn to gloom and frustration. Boom and Bust. Add to the mix, another 10000 4K 24P Panasonics and Sonys. It will be avalanche following a lomg drought. Everybody will be drowned in 4k 24P and not enough projects to use it on.

I was just thinking aloud. Things may not be as bad. But, it is a thought anyway.
 
chuckt said:
How much market is there really for all these 4K REDs?

I have been doing some math lately.
In this whole world about 5000 movies are made every year.
Assuming a 2 month average shooting per movie, that will make 10K months a year. That is 850 shooting years. If everybody shoot with RED, (which is not going to happen for another 50 years), then we will need about 1000 REDs to do the job. In 2008, there will be over 5000 REDS in use. Or, in otherwords, there is an over abundance of REDs out there.

All enthusiasm we see on these forums are the result of anticipation of getting their first REDs. By next year this time, all the enthusiasm we see on these forums might turn to gloom and frustration. Boom and Bust. Add to the mix, another 10000 4K 24P Panasonics and Sonys. It will be avalanche following a lomg drought. Everybody will be drowned in 4k 24P and not enough projects to use it on.

I was just thinking aloud. Things may not be as bad. But, it is a thought anyway.
Click to expand...

There is always television, fashion, commercials, new media/web & mobile content, documentaries, adult entertainment, film students, etc. etc.

And VERY few films are made with one camera.

But, yeah, the numbers are disruptive for sure.
 
Scarlet Sensor

Scarlet Sensor

Evin Grant said:
But I doubt it's a three chip sensor, most likely it's a 1/3" or 1/2" size CMOS.
QUOTE]

Evin I agree with nearly everything you said. Just to add that 1/3 CMO is not considered as a "professional" format by our national TV (Switzerland) that by the way has very low technical criterions.

So I think minimum is 2k s16mm sensor size.

See you.

Pat


PS: Scarlet is named to reference of a virus : that is visible through apparition or huge amount or RED spots.:shifty:
Click to expand...
 
Offhollywood said:
I bit the bullet and picked up a Canon HV20 just to shoot home movies of my son - I am shocked how good the stuff looks for a camera under $1K -
Click to expand...

I just bought an HV20 for home videos too, It's great for the price. I got it for 750 with a 75 dollar gift card to B&H. I just need to get Adobe to allow us to interpret HDV footage in Premiere like you can in AE, so that I can have 24P.
 
Has ANYONE asked this yet!?:

Where did JUAN from REEL-STREAM GO!?!?!

Is Scarlet a system that can shoot 1080p natively, 60p, and then out of a Gigabit Ethernet connection (Tethered) has the ability to shoot 2k and a host of other uncompressed options.

The HVX + HYDRA option was coming in (with 35mm Adapter) at about 12k, that was going to get you so many different options to shoot with including 2k 60p, uncompressed, etc etc.

Has ANYONE thought that Scarlet might be a similar system? Shoots 1080p natively, but when tethered to a notebook and RED software, you get 2k and even more options for the same price-point? Interchangable lenses?

I don't disagree with the "Pocket" theory that Evin Grant posted because it's completely valid. At the same time, it's pretty WELL-TIMED that REEL-STREAM vanishes and SCARLET is no longer a rumor but official (in the sense that now it has its own sub-forum).
 
Kholi said:
Has ANYONE asked this yet!?:

Where did JUAN from REEL-STREAM GO!?!?!

Is Scarlet a system that can shoot 1080p natively, 60p, and then out of a Gigabit Ethernet connection (Tethered) has the ability to shoot 2k and a host of other uncompressed options.

The HVX + HYDRA option was coming in (with 35mm Adapter) at about 12k, that was going to get you so many different options to shoot with including 2k 60p, uncompressed, etc etc.

Has ANYONE thought that Scarlet might be a similar system? Shoots 1080p natively, but when tethered to a notebook and RED software, you get 2k and even more options for the same price-point? Interchangable lenses?

I don't disagree with the "Pocket" theory that Evin Grant posted because it's completely valid. At the same time, it's pretty WELL-TIMED that REEL-STREAM vanishes and SCARLET is no longer a rumor but official (in the sense that now it has its own sub-forum).
Click to expand...

I had a lot of dialog with Juan, and I know for a fact that he ISN'T working for Red. He's working for a different company now, but as for who bought the technology, I have no idea. All I know is he had several bidders, and he can't say anything about it for the time being (gag order I assume).

Hope that sheds some light.
 
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