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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

RED WEAPON - Info and Data Sheets

Then within each group it will be by date and time stamp of your order placed.
 
Great info!

its good also that the early adopter part is not factoring. It's seems like the correct evolution.
 
Before the chaos I was considering making my first Red Purchase. Now I just can't decide the smartest path. I was planning to purchase an Epic MX then upgrade to Dragon before the year is out. If I want to catch the upgrade train it looks like that is a bad idea. Would it be wise to go Scarlet Dragon before NAD then Weapon later? Or will a SD purchase now be unwise if I cant go weapon at NAD? So maybe wait until after the announcement to go SD, then weapon when I can? Might there be a price difference? Thanks for the help!
 
I was really hoping that Scarlets weren't going to be last again, but I completely understand why. I ordered the dragon upgrade seconds after it was available in the store and it was finally upgraded this last October. Oh well. I guess I'll have more time to save up for it.
 
Andrew R Lewis said:
Before the chaos I was considering making my first Red Purchase. Now I just can't decide the smartest path. I was planning to purchase an Epic MX then upgrade to Dragon before the year is out. If I want to catch the upgrade train it looks like that is a bad idea. Would it be wise to go Scarlet Dragon before NAD then Weapon later? Or will a SD purchase now be unwise if I cant go weapon at NAD? So maybe wait until after the announcement to go SD, then weapon when I can? Might there be a price difference? Thanks for the help!
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If I was new to the Red ecosystem at this point I would likely purchase a Red Dragon (Epic or Scarlet) as the Mysterium-X upgrade path is coming to an end in the next few months. Weapon upgrades begin at NAB, but that is just the beginning. You'll have some time before you "need" to upgrade to Weapon. Epic Dragon and Scarlet Dragon are going to be part of Red's main camera line-up for some time to come.


Michael Patterson said:
I was really hoping that Scarlets weren't going to be last again, but I completely understand why. I ordered the dragon upgrade seconds
after it was available in the store and it was finally upgraded this last October. Oh well. I guess I'll have more time to save up for it.
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It's the way things are and it's the way things have been in the past. It makes a lot of sense in reality, but if Red didn't do this in a tiered way they would be buried under cameras.


David Battistella said:
Great info!

its good also that the early adopter part is not factoring. It's seems like the correct evolution.
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Cheers David. Just trying to "bolt down" the proper info here. There's a lot of discussion outside of Reduser that is alarmingly unclear, but that the benefit of this forum. The info is right here and straight from Red.
 
If I was new to the Red ecosystem at this point I would likely purchase a Red Dragon (Epic or Scarlet) as the Mysterium-X upgrade path is coming to an end in the next few months. Weapon upgrades begin at NAB, but that is just the beginning. You'll have some time before you "need" to upgrade to Weapon. Epic Dragon and Scarlet Dragon are going to be part of Red's main camera line-up for some time to come.
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As a newcomer to the forum it is greatly appreciated that such a respected member of the Red and Filmmaking community quickly address' my concerns. Thanks Phil! A quick follow up:

1) Would it be wise to wait until after the Red announcement at NAB to purchase a Scarlet Dragon or go ahead and do it now? I won't be able to afford the Weapon upgrade immediately after the purchase.

2) There is a much larger demand for Epic MX packages in the Dallas area where I live than Scarlet packages. I'm still not sure exactly where Scarlet Dragon fits in. Any incite will be helpful.
 
Andrew R Lewis said:
As a newcomer to the forum it is greatly appreciated that such a respected member of the Red and Filmmaking community quickly address' my concerns. Thanks Phil! A quick follow up:

1) Would it be wise to wait until after the Red announcement at NAB to purchase a Scarlet Dragon or go ahead and do it now? I won't be able to afford the Weapon upgrade immediately after the purchase.

2) There is a much larger demand for Epic MX packages in the Dallas area where I live than Scarlet packages. I'm still not sure exactly where Scarlet Dragon fits in. Any incite will be helpful.
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Cheers Andrew. Happy to help.

1. I personally purchase cameras sooner than later to begin the road of "return on investment". I don't think Dragon's price is dropping anytime soon if that's what your'e asking.

2. Your local market will tell the story and inform your moves. Most people "know what Epic MX is" and that might be part of that. Reach out to some local Scarlet Dragon owners perhaps?
 
Hi Phil, you mentioned all the RED battery options for Weapon but will it have a power in feed like the Dragon/Epic/Scarlet and take Anton Bauer or a LiPo as we've done in the past?
 
Phil Holland said:
Just got really, really official word as there has been some confusion regarding Mysterium-X upgrades.

You cannot have Epic or Scarlet Mysterium-X and pay for the Dragon upgrade and never physically send the camera in and then pay up from the Epic/Scarlet Dragon up to Weapon. This should be a given as it's been explicitly stated, but there's been a few who have been confused.

Weapon is a Dragon upgrade.

There is no direct to Weapon path from Mysterium-X. You must upgrade your camera to Dragon as there are "things" needed for the Weapon upgrade.

Additionally, Serial Number is not a factor in the Weapon upgrade. Fulfillment will be based on the camera type you are trading in, meaning this priority:

1. Carbon Dragon
2. Epic-M Dragon
3. Epic-X Dragon
4. Scarlet Dragon

Then within each group it will be by date and time stamp of your order placed.

This is official, so plan accordingly.
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Just saw this. I suppose Jarred's post about serial number, within a camera category is no longer valid. Unfortunate for very low serial numbers, for sure, especially those that bought the early Crbon Fibers. Will the low serial numbers perhaps have an earlier ordering priority time slot?

Thank you very much

Fury
 
Now I'm really glad I didn't opt for the Scarlet-X to Epic-X trade in like I was planning, given this information of not being able to upgrade MX directly to Weapon and Dragon upgrades ending before I would have ever had the cash to double upgrade.

Looks like Scarlet Dragon it is.... for now.
 
So... after June 2015 I am stuck with my Epic and Scarlet MX Cameras with no more pathways to either upgrade , or trade in / buy an epic or scarlet dragon or even a weapon.... :-(
 
Just got back to the hut over here.


Nick Fury said:
Just saw this. I suppose Jarred's post about serial number, within a camera category is no longer valid. Unfortunate for very low serial numbers, for sure, especially those that bought the early Crbon Fibers. Will the low serial numbers perhaps have an earlier ordering priority time slot?
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I took a look at Jarred's post that you are referring to, but I can say that this info is straight from Red.

Being a Carbon Dragon owner you're front of the line to be queued in reality over M, X, and Scarlet owners and based on your time stamp/date of your order placed.

I wouldn't sweat the gritty details of if you're one of the first 10 or whatever. It's going to be a zoo the day Red opens up pre-orders for Weapon, many folks are just going to want it based on what I've seen. Just make sure you're one of the early dudes.


Eric Morceau said:
Now I'm really glad I didn't opt for the Scarlet-X to Epic-X trade in like I was planning, given this information of not being able to upgrade MX directly to Weapon and Dragon upgrades ending before I would have ever had the cash to double upgrade.

Looks like Scarlet Dragon it is.... for now.
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In this case and at this point in time I'd say you're correct on that call. Down the line you can still move up to Weapon once that makes sense for you.


Anthony Littlechild said:
So... after June 2015 I am stuck with my Epic and Scarlet MX Cameras with no more pathways to either upgrade , or trade in / buy an epic or scarlet dragon or even a weapon.... :-(
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Correct. And Jarred said "around June", but I'd keep that date since it's all that's been mentioned. There's been two years for people to continue to be on the upgrade path from Mysterium-X to Dragon. They can't keep an upgrade line open forever. It's just not really possible.
 
i think its unfair to say its been two years for the mx-dragon upgrade when for most its been less than a year.... i believe they started doing epic-x upgrades in may of 2014, and epic-m's started around january 2014
 
During the Dragon upgrade I tried hard to get as early a number as possible on camera 1 in hopes it would be meaningful for future upgrades.

May not fight the crowds so hard this time as it appears all future upgrades will be a free-for-all, time-stamp madhouse. The new sensor upgrade in future may be worth the madness, but I'm happy to keep shooting with my current Dragons while the earliest off the assembly line act as beta testers for the new platform.

I do reserve the right to change my mind when more details are released. '-)
 
Nick Fury said:
Just saw this. I suppose Jarred's post about serial number, within a camera category is no longer valid. Unfortunate for very low serial numbers, for sure, especially those that bought the early Crbon Fibers. Will the low serial numbers perhaps have an earlier ordering priority time slot?
Click to expand...

It's all about when the camera was purchased as serial numbers are not directly indicative of that. So if you were first in line to get an EPIC-X, then you would have been first in line to upgrade to Dragon when the EPIC-X cameras started to be called up, and you would be first in line to get Weapon once they start calling the EPIC-X Dragon cameras in.

I would say that RED makes the serial number stickies in sequential batches. However, when it comes to assigning them, it seems to be random or whatever ones get pulled at that time from a larger group to stick on cameras. They quit with the directly sequential camera numbering somewhere around RED One #3000 -- why advertise to the competition how many they have sold?

I took delivery of my EPIC-M about 10 days after Ketch got his #8 -- mine is #875. Nearly 4 months later a friend of mine got EPIC-M #267 (IIRC, it's 260-something for sure). My original RED One was #1110, it allowed me to EPIC-X #105 via Stage-2 upgrade, even though I saw a handful of EPIC-X cameras with much higher numbers delivered before mine.


So I'll get called for Weapon upgrade with my EPIC-M pretty early on in the EPIC-M group. And they will notify all of the EPIC-M group *AFTER* the Carbon Dragon customers and *BEFORE* they call EPIC-X people.

I wasn't shooting as much after taking the EPIC upgrades, so I sold my EPIC-X #105 to a local RED-shooting friend. I wonder where that places him in the Weapon upgrade queue? In the past, the original invoice date and time was to stay with the camera, even after transferring owners...
 
Brodie Gwilliam said:
i think its unfair to say its been two years for the mx-dragon upgrade when for most its been less than a year.... i believe they started doing epic-x upgrades in may of 2014, and epic-m's started around january 2014
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That's about right. I got to shoot with a hot off the production line Dragon Carbon in December '13 and was able to get my EPIC-M converted to Dragon and back home by mid-January '14. Seems Dragon upgrades for EPIC-X started in April/May... That's when I sold my EPIC-X. Sent it in for the Dragon upgrade and did the ownership transfer and everything at the same time.
 
Brodie Gwilliam said:
i think its unfair to say its been two years for the mx-dragon upgrade when for most its been less than a year.... i believe they started doing epic-x upgrades in may of 2014, and epic-m's started around january 2014
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I totally agree with this. They really didn't start busting out the Epic-X upgrades until around May last year. I guess you can claim that the carbon fiber cameras had been out for just a little bit before that. You can track it all here. http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?97899-WHO-TOOK-DRAGON-UPGRADE It just feels like the dragon upgrades are gutting cut off so soon, I guess its time to scramble for cash.
 
Phil Holland said:
Correct. And Jarred said "around June", but I'd keep that date since it's all that's been mentioned. There's been two years for people to continue to be on the upgrade path from Mysterium-X to Dragon. They can't keep an upgrade line open forever. It's just not really possible.
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I also agree that it's been quite a short time for the upgrade from MX to Dragon, and the two year quote is not quite accurate, which Brodie summed up more specifically.

Brodie Gwilliam said:
i think its unfair to say its been two years for the mx-dragon upgrade when for most its been less than a year.... i believe they started doing epic-x upgrades in may of 2014, and epic-m's started around january 2014
Click to expand...

I guess it's all beside the point, RED need to do what they need to do, and if that is cutting off MXs mid year, then so be it. I don't want anyone to take this as a complaint, it's just frustrating for the littler guys like me who need the time. I wonder if RED would consider rolling over most of their upgrade facilities to Dragon -> Weapon, while keeping a smaller (slower) system for people who are a little behind. Who knows if that's even possible. Would be nice though.
 
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