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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

New RED Viewfinder

Stacey Spears said:
Jarred, how is the field of view on the new 1080p EVF? Or rather, how far away is the image? I really liked the original EVF on the RED ONE. The bomb EVF always felt like the image was far away and made it difficult for me to use. Is the new 1080p the same as the bomb EVF in that department?
Click to expand...

+1 We need a FOV for critical focusing and critical framing.
 
I have to agree with Jeff, no offense to RED, but a truly great EVF for high resolution digital capture - from any manufacturer - is an unfulfilled need. The latest Zacuto Gratical has embedded LUTs for popular cameras that improve color accuracy, which improves perceived resolution and makes them much more useful for making decisions on set.

Maybe I'm crazy, but why couldn't RED (or whomever) "borrow" some tech from the mobile phone world and offer a 2160P 5-9" display with decent off axis, high ambient light viewing. Then add a custom "flip down" eyepiece/magnifier with diopter and you've got a 2 in 1 solution (this has been done by others and with well matched optics it should be tight). Presumably any screen from the mobile world would have touch input capability, but to avoid lots of finger grease on the display I'd opt to use the sidekick/foolcontrol whenever possible.

Just asking'

Cheers - #19
 
I'll be honest, I'm a big believer of EVFs being EVFs and screens being screens. I own a SmallHD DP4 and while the EVF hood can be useful it also adds a lot of weight and isn't really comfortable as an EVF. I'm hoping that the Sidewinder/502 combo will change my mind but until then I think RED is making a pretty good decision as is.
 
Blair S. Paulsen said:
I have to agree with Jeff, no offense to RED, but a truly great EVF for high resolution digital capture - from any manufacturer - is an unfulfilled need. The latest Zacuto Gratical has embedded LUTs for popular cameras that improve color accuracy, which improves perceived resolution and makes them much more useful for making decisions on set.

Maybe I'm crazy, but why couldn't RED (or whomever) "borrow" some tech from the mobile phone world and offer a 2160P 5-9" display with decent off axis, high ambient light viewing. Then add a custom "flip down" eyepiece/magnifier with diopter and you've got a 2 in 1 solution (this has been done by others and with well matched optics it should be tight). Presumably any screen from the mobile world would have touch input capability, but to avoid lots of finger grease on the display I'd opt to use the sidekick/foolcontrol whenever possible.

Just asking'

Cheers - #19
Click to expand...
Nice underwear engineering there Blair ;-) just kidding...
The new BMD EVF is pretty great -if you have seen it ...
Full HD , nice eye relief, wide viewing angle, SDI and XLR, 60Hz refresh so no flicker- yep- pretty great I say...
 
Blair S. Paulsen said:
Maybe I'm crazy, but why couldn't RED (or whomever) "borrow" some tech from the mobile phone world and offer a 2160P 5-9" display with decent off axis, high ambient light viewing. Then add a custom "flip down" eyepiece/magnifier with diopter and you've got a 2 in 1 solution (this has been done by others and with well matched optics it should be tight).
Click to expand...

Isn't that what SmallHD built with 502 and the EVF eyepiece attachment?

The Zacuto group buy is very interesting. I would probably go for it, but really need to pay for Weapon. :) That and the Video Devices PIX E5H would be really cool to have for use on a Letus Heilx. Too many cool things! I really wish the RED 7" LCD had the drag around feature while zoomed-in along with all the scopes.
 
I'm essentially saying that the SmallHD approach is darn clever and just needs to be taken to the next level. Start with a 2160P image, get the eyepiece/magnifier optical performance up and Bob's your Uncle. (BTW Jacek, I go commando ;-)

Cheers - #19
 
It seems to me that all camera manufacturers are in need of a good EVF. I have issues with the fact that my operators on this feature cannot see focus or reflections in a critical manner which was always their area. Not off EVFs or 7 inch monitors in ambient light. Only when I am watching my 25 inch Sony OLED can I see everything that they should be able to see.
1080p is but one factor.... Where the eyepiece focuses for the op is another, refresh is another as is color acuity ...

I believe RED is addressing all of these.
 
Peter Lyons Collister said:
It seems to me that all camera manufacturers are in need of a good EVF. I have issues with the fact that my operators on this feature cannot see focus or reflections in a critical manner which was always their area. Not off EVFs or 7 inch monitors in ambient light. Only when I am watching my 25 inch Sony OLED can I see everything that they should be able to see.
1080p is but one factor.... Where the eyepiece focuses for the op is another, refresh is another as is color acuity ...

I believe RED is addressing all of these.
Click to expand...

Agree and I know/feel where you are coming from. There's some pretty incredible "values" out there in EVF-land, but locking critical focus (my main concern) has been "iffy" on most products available today.

I'm really, really happy with the color and picture on the newer RED 7.0" LCD Touch however. That's a freaking joy to use, operate, and pull from. They did real good there.
 
Phil Holland said:
Agree and I know/feel where you are coming from. There's some pretty incredible "values" out there in EVF-land, but locking critical focus (my main concern) has been "iffy" on most products available today.

I'm really, really happy with the color and picture on the newer RED 7.0" LCD Touch however. That's a freaking joy to use, operate, and pull from. They did real good there.
Click to expand...

Phil,
Did you ever complain about a Red product?
 
Is there an official line on this new EVF? At NAB was it an actual working prototype? Did anyone get an eyeball into it? Or was Red making a statement on intention that intends to build a new EVF? Has there been any announcement or hint on availability and pricing? So many questions.
 
Blair S. Paulsen said:
I have to agree with Jeff, no offense to RED, but a truly great EVF for high resolution digital capture - from any manufacturer - is an unfulfilled need. The latest Zacuto Gratical has embedded LUTs for popular cameras that improve color accuracy, which improves perceived resolution and makes them much more useful for making decisions on set.

Maybe I'm crazy, but why couldn't RED (or whomever) "borrow" some tech from the mobile phone world and offer a 2160P 5-9" display with decent off axis, high ambient light viewing. Then add a custom "flip down" eyepiece/magnifier with diopter and you've got a 2 in 1 solution (this has been done by others and with well matched optics it should be tight). Presumably any screen from the mobile world would have touch input capability, but to avoid lots of finger grease on the display I'd opt to use the sidekick/foolcontrol whenever possible.

Just asking'

Cheers - #19
Click to expand...

The new Small HD EVF is just as good - same resolution, same smooth image rendition - and way cheaper.
 
Still too many questions

Still too many questions

Robert Ruffo New said:
The new Small HD EVF is just as good - same resolution, same smooth image rendition - and way cheaper.
Click to expand...


Robert,

What are you comparing the Small HD EVF too? The original Red Bomb LCD EVF or OLED version or to something else? Or did you manage to get an eyeball into the new Red EVF?
 
Tom Gleeson said:
Robert,

What are you comparing the Small HD EVF too? The original Red Bomb LCD EVF or OLED version or to something else? Or did you manage to get an eyeball into the new Red EVF?
Click to expand...

Was comparing to new Zacuto - which looks exactly the same as new Small HD EVF. Both are excellent, are in fact the best EVFs I have ever seen on any camera. But, both look exactly the same in terms of image quality, so why pay so much more for Zacuto becomes a very good question.

I have the Bomb LCOS - and weird motion artifacts can be an issue, as is not altogether super high resolution, but it's not bad, and it's very small and light and does not require its own power. Downside is unless you have the right somewhat expensive module, you must first disconnect the touch screen (while Small HD uses the HDMI or HD SDI port) and that +1 module hogs the HDMI port, which we use 100% of the time for remote video transmission.

I have not seen the new Red EVF from Red, and it's likely great, but it still leaves you with the single monitor output on Epics problem (which if I remember correctly has been addressed on Weapon).

I never pull my own focus, never do any shoulder shooting, and we always have large screens on set, so really Red's Bomb is good enough for me for now, for the few times it's a better solution than the touch monitor for on-board framing (again, your own situation may be very different). That said, I'm considering buying the Small HD EVF for our ACs, because it can work with a Parralinx or Nyrius. I'll ask them if they would like that.
 
Strange RED dont give much attention to monitoring when arri even developed an OVF.

We need a 2k resolution with optically variable field of view to be able to make our job.
I mean not all Epics are mounted on a crane or a steady or have "video cities" with large screen.
Framing the traditional way with op eye on the camera eyepiece is important.

If we have to frame for 4k more detail and immersion is important.

Another feature is magnify while shooting. This is also important to get focus right when filming interviews where the person can lean forth and back for example.

Pat
 
To be fair to Red, Arri didn't have to develop a new optical viewfinder for the Alexa Studio, they just adapted their existing Arricam viewfinder system, glow masks, and ground glasses. It's a lot harder and more expensive to develop precision optics and mechanics from scratch than electronics and software. I also much prefer to operate with an eyepiece while shooting, but realistically I think the days of the mirror reflex viewfinder are pretty much over. And I say this as someone who owns a Moviecam SL, Canon Scoopic 16M, Hasselblad 501c, and Pentax MX.
 
I finally got a chance to put my eye into the new EVF and I must say I was quite impressed with it. Much larger image than bomb, smooth shadows, infinity optic ans super nice design were you can remove the cableless rotating piece and reveal a regular lemo connector to plug your cable in... Well done !
 
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