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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Monkey Extract Questions

Hey guys,

Not to beat a dead horse if these questions have already been asked in this thread! I am working on a production using Monkey Extract for online from Avid and am wondering what this application is capable of.

- Can Monkey Extract take an EDL from Avid and use that EDL with RedCine? Or do I have to export an XML from Avid FilmScribe? Also, when Monkey Extract creates an EDL/XML for grading, can this take an EDL and turn it into an XML for use in applications that use XML - if that makes sense - it appears to me it will only take the source file, whether it be XML or EDL and make one with the same type. Whenever I try to open that EDL from Monkey Extract in RedCine it gives the "Failed to load construct" error.

- Can Monkey Extract take an EDL from Avid and use that to create a full 2K/4K video of the whole Avid sequence? I ask because we edited our sequence in Avid in 1080p DNxHD (and correct me if I'm wrong, but I think DNxHD is only capable of 1080p max, but perhaps there is a way to edit 2K in Avid?) So we want to create a full 2K online full sequence, but the only way I've found to do that is to render the 2Ks out of Monkey Extract and open the EDL in Color, but then I have to re-render everything and send to Final Cut Pro to do the full export but that seems very superfluous and unnecessary to have to re-render everything. This is disregarding any color grading.

- Is there a way to render out of Monkey Extract and create the new EDL for color grade (from the original Avid EDL), and import this into Final Cut for the online? I tried this but all the media is offline and I can't figure out how to re-link it.

These are my main questions with this incredible application. Thanks a lot for your help!!!
 
Dillon Brown said:
Hey guys,

Not to beat a dead horse if these questions have already been asked in this thread! I am working on a production using Monkey Extract for online from Avid and am wondering what this application is capable of.

- Can Monkey Extract take an EDL from Avid and use that EDL with RedCine? Or do I have to export an XML from Avid FilmScribe? Also, when Monkey Extract creates an EDL/XML for grading, can this take an EDL and turn it into an XML for use in applications that use XML - if that makes sense - it appears to me it will only take the source file, whether it be XML or EDL and make one with the same type. Whenever I try to open that EDL from Monkey Extract in RedCine it gives the "Failed to load construct" error.

- Can Monkey Extract take an EDL from Avid and use that to create a full 2K/4K video of the whole Avid sequence? I ask because we edited our sequence in Avid in 1080p DNxHD (and correct me if I'm wrong, but I think DNxHD is only capable of 1080p max, but perhaps there is a way to edit 2K in Avid?) So we want to create a full 2K online full sequence, but the only way I've found to do that is to render the 2Ks out of Monkey Extract and open the EDL in Color, but then I have to re-render everything and send to Final Cut Pro to do the full export but that seems very superfluous and unnecessary to have to re-render everything. This is disregarding any color grading.

- Is there a way to render out of Monkey Extract and create the new EDL for color grade (from the original Avid EDL), and import this into Final Cut for the online? I tried this but all the media is offline and I can't figure out how to re-link it.

These are my main questions with this incredible application. Thanks a lot for your help!!!
Click to expand...

If you want to grade in Color - why not try the workflow suggested here:

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=37857
 
Ravi Kiran said:
We are currently editing a feature film shot on the RED. Here is our workflow.

1) Shoot 4KHD 23.98fps
2) Transcode to ProRes
3) Edit with ProRes files in FCP

We will grade in Color with the R3D files. I understand that Monkey Extract will allow me to copy just the R3D files used in the film to another drive based on an EDL exported from FCP.

There is a "footage timecode" option in the "Copy RED footage" section for Edgecode or Time of Day. Does Monkey Extract find the R3Ds based on filenames or based on timecode? How does it not get confused by overlapping TOD on multiple clips?
Click to expand...

from an EDL, it uses timecode and reel name. as long as the reels are named differently, timecode overlap is not a problem. the edl has a reel name for each clip.
you can also use XML files.
 
I have an edited sequence in Avid Media Composer 4.0.2.
I would like to use Monkey Extract 3.100 to go to the original files in Redcine 20.0.

When I create the FilmScribe XML in Avid and choose that file path in monkey extract to render, I get a new XML for Redcine in a Redcine folder.

But when I open Redcine and click -new -yes -Load all(choose the folder) and -Open(choose the new xml Monkey made) I get "Failed to load construct.."

No spaces in the filenames path at all. The same situation was happening with CineXML.

What could I possibly be doing wrong? A setting maybe?
 
Dexter Gregoire said:
I have an edited sequence in Avid Media Composer 4.0.2.
I would like to use Monkey Extract 3.100 to go to the original files in Redcine 20.0.

When I create the FilmScribe XML in Avid and choose that file path in monkey extract to render, I get a new XML for Redcine in a Redcine folder.

But when I open Redcine and click -new -yes -Load all(choose the folder) and -Open(choose the new xml Monkey made) I get "Failed to load construct.."

No spaces in the filenames path at all. The same situation was happening with CineXML.

What could I possibly be doing wrong? A setting maybe?
Click to expand...

in redcine, you need to load all the r3d footage BEFORE you load the xml file.
 
Hi Nigel,

I have sent an email to Craig at Rubbermonkey hoping to get a reply.

I open RedCine and click -new -yes for project and continue to -Load all(I choose the folder that the R3D files are in and they load properly in RedCine). I see them in full length.

Then I click -open and find that file in the redcine folder labeled redcine.xml. That's when I get the 'Failed to load Construct...'

It could be a setting in Filmscribe maybe, or in Monkey Extract. I'm not sure. I would like to call in and have someone go through it with me tracing my steps confirming my settings. Possible?

Dexter
 
Hello Nigel,

Remember I posted about controlling the gamma upon rendering out to QT? What I found is that REDLINE seems to output video with 0 to 1023 all the time. Bringing in the clips to Apple Color would display as 0 to 1023, but the same relink XML and the rendered clips imported to FCP, they would be wrapped automatically within 64 to 940. That is what I found about the problem. I can use LUT on the video hardware to display the 0 to 1023 in Apple Color, but it gets cumbersome. Is there anyway to select the video range upon rendering?
 
I created an CMX3600 edl from my sequence (avid symphony) but when I load it into monkey extract it's referencing the right timecode but from the wrong clip. When I isolate the correct clips and move them into a seperate folder on another drive monkey extract will find them but is there a way of avoiding this in the firstplace?. Is this just a bug with monkey extract and cmx3600 edls? I usually use red16 if I can..
 
Dillon Brown said:
Hey guys,

Not to beat a dead horse if these questions have already been asked in this thread! I am working on a production using Monkey Extract for online from Avid and am wondering what this application is capable of.

- Can Monkey Extract take an EDL from Avid and use that EDL with RedCine? Or do I have to export an XML from Avid FilmScribe? Also, when Monkey Extract creates an EDL/XML for grading, can this take an EDL and turn it into an XML for use in applications that use XML - if that makes sense - it appears to me it will only take the source file, whether it be XML or EDL and make one with the same type. Whenever I try to open that EDL from Monkey Extract in RedCine it gives the "Failed to load construct" error.

- Can Monkey Extract take an EDL from Avid and use that to create a full 2K/4K video of the whole Avid sequence? I ask because we edited our sequence in Avid in 1080p DNxHD (and correct me if I'm wrong, but I think DNxHD is only capable of 1080p max, but perhaps there is a way to edit 2K in Avid?) So we want to create a full 2K online full sequence, but the only way I've found to do that is to render the 2Ks out of Monkey Extract and open the EDL in Color, but then I have to re-render everything and send to Final Cut Pro to do the full export but that seems very superfluous and unnecessary to have to re-render everything. This is disregarding any color grading.

- Is there a way to render out of Monkey Extract and create the new EDL for color grade (from the original Avid EDL), and import this into Final Cut for the online? I tried this but all the media is offline and I can't figure out how to re-link it.

These are my main questions with this incredible application. Thanks a lot for your help!!!
Click to expand...

Hi Dillon,

- Can Monkey Extract take an EDL from Avid and use that EDL with RedCine? Or do I have to export an XML from Avid FilmScribe?
Monkey Extract can use Avid EDLs and create a list of shots to extract.
Monkey Extract will then create a RedCine XML that you can use to send some or all of those shots to RedCine.
The RedCine XML will not necessarily be an exact conversion of your Avid EDL to RedCine XML though since the goal there is to render the footage rather than convert the file.

- Also, when Monkey Extract creates an EDL/XML for grading, can this take an EDL and turn it into an XML for use in applications that use XML - if that makes sense - it appears to me it will only take the source file, whether it be XML or EDL and make one with the same type.

That is correct. Monkey Extract will update the EDL or XML that you give it but is unable to convert between EDL and XML

- Whenever I try to open that EDL from Monkey Extract in RedCine it gives the "Failed to load construct" error.
I assume you mean the RedCine XML here.
When creating RedCine XML a bunch of aliases/proxies are created in a directory for you.
You need to load the proxies that are created first. If you load in the original footage directly it will give you this error since the path in the XML points to the proxies, not the original footage.

- Can Monkey Extract take an EDL from Avid and use that to create a full 2K/4K video of the whole Avid sequence? I ask because we edited our sequence in Avid in 1080p DNxHD (and correct me if I'm wrong, but I think DNxHD is only capable of 1080p max, but perhaps there is a way to edit 2K in Avid?) So we want to create a full 2K online full sequence, but the only way I've found to do that is to render the 2Ks out of Monkey Extract and open the EDL in Color, but then I have to re-render everything and send to Final Cut Pro to do the full export but that seems very superfluous and unnecessary to have to re-render everything. This is disregarding any color grading.

I haven't tried this so I can't be sure :)
Monkey Extract renders with Redline (from Red Alert) so if you can create 4K DNx with either Red Alert or Red Rushes then it will also work with Monkey Extract.

- Is there a way to render out of Monkey Extract and create the new EDL for color grade (from the original Avid EDL), and import this into Final Cut for the online? I tried this but all the media is offline and I can't figure out how to re-link it.

Loading EDL back into FCP will always cause trouble. You'll likely need to relink your footage manually.
If you are doing FCP round-trips then you really need to be using FCP XML.
I don't know of any nice way to mix up Avid with FCP.

Cheers
Craig
 
Dexter Gregoire said:
I have an edited sequence in Avid Media Composer 4.0.2.
I would like to use Monkey Extract 3.100 to go to the original files in Redcine 20.0.

When I create the FilmScribe XML in Avid and choose that file path in monkey extract to render, I get a new XML for Redcine in a Redcine folder.

But when I open Redcine and click -new -yes -Load all(choose the folder) and -Open(choose the new xml Monkey made) I get "Failed to load construct.."

No spaces in the filenames path at all. The same situation was happening with CineXML.

What could I possibly be doing wrong? A setting maybe?
Click to expand...

Also, you need to ensure that you load in the aliases/proxies that Monkey Extract creates rather than loading in the R3D files directly. The redcine XML points to the proxies and if you don't use them the XML file will not link to the footage.
 
CJ Roy said:
This may have been covered, but I can't seem to find it. Any estimation on when Monkey Extract will be rocket enabled? Or are you waiting on Redline to be Rocket enabled first?

Thanks.

-CJ
Click to expand...

We will write our own renderer eventually, but this is a long way off yet. We were hoping that Red would provide a rocket enabled redline so that we wouldn't need to but have been unable to get an ETA from them.
 
Olivia Coupe said:
I created an CMX3600 edl from my sequence (avid symphony) but when I load it into monkey extract it's referencing the right timecode but from the wrong clip. When I isolate the correct clips and move them into a seperate folder on another drive monkey extract will find them but is there a way of avoiding this in the firstplace?. Is this just a bug with monkey extract and cmx3600 edls? I usually use red16 if I can..
Click to expand...

Hi Olivia,

This is a problem we have with cmx3600 EDLs in general. Using Red16 template helps avoid this, as does using filmscribe XML. The problem is simply that the tape name in the EDL is short and if Monkey matches the tape name and timecode correctly it thinks it has a match.

If you email me at support@rubbermonkey.co.nz I'll get some details from you and have a closer look.

Cheers
Craig
 
Kaku Ito said:
Hello Nigel,

Remember I posted about controlling the gamma upon rendering out to QT? What I found is that REDLINE seems to output video with 0 to 1023 all the time. Bringing in the clips to Apple Color would display as 0 to 1023, but the same relink XML and the rendered clips imported to FCP, they would be wrapped automatically within 64 to 940. That is what I found about the problem. I can use LUT on the video hardware to display the 0 to 1023 in Apple Color, but it gets cumbersome. Is there anyway to select the video range upon rendering?
Click to expand...

Hi Kaku,

You can change the black & white points in the Monkey Extract render settings, however I'm not entirely sure that is what is causing the problem.
If you load a rendered clip into FCP without the relink XML is it still 64 to 940?

Please email me at support@rubbermonkey.co.nz

Cheers
Craig
 
Hi Craig,
I am looking for a solution to a grading workflow. I'm working on a 2 hour feature and we want to do a one light in Red Alert before going to Color to take advantage of the new color science.

Now using the FCP XML, does Monkey Extract render out the entire video clip, or can you have it render out solely the footage be used (in/out points from the edit)? This is important due to the enormous amount of footage we are working with.

Most importantly, can I then roundtrip back to FCP with the linked media and send to Color seamlessly? I know that rendering full clips should work fine, but we really need to only render in/outs - it would be a huge timesaver.

Thanks,
Matt
 
Matt Weatherly said:
Hi Craig,
I am looking for a solution to a grading workflow. I'm working on a 2 hour feature and we want to do a one light in Red Alert before going to Color to take advantage of the new color science.

Now using the FCP XML, does Monkey Extract render out the entire video clip, or can you have it render out solely the footage be used (in/out points from the edit)? This is important due to the enormous amount of footage we are working with.

Most importantly, can I then roundtrip back to FCP with the linked media and send to Color seamlessly? I know that rendering full clips should work fine, but we really need to only render in/outs - it would be a huge timesaver.

Thanks,
Matt
Click to expand...

Hi Matt.

Monkey Extract will (by default) render only the footage you need using the in/out points in your FCP XML. A new FCP XML will then be created that allows you to relink your new footage in a FCP timeline. After this there is no reason you can't send it to color from FCP.

Limitations on this are:
1> You can't do this using EDL as FCP doesn't import EDL very nicely
2> FCP doesn't like DPX much, so you'll need to be encoding to prores if you are doing round-trips. If you need DPX then you are better off going directly to apple color.
3> some FCP time remap beziers do not translate well when you shorten the source clips so you may need to rework these after rendering.

Best thing is to run some tests.
If you would like a full trial key then please email me at support@rubbermonkey.co.nz
 
Thank you Craig. And I appreciate the trial key offer - I have been looking through the trial you have on the site and it seems to be testing appropriately.

However, I do have one additional question. What is the optimal workflow for utilizing the RedCine renders with an XML back in FCP. I'm just looking for the steps involved. I'm assuming the RedCine renders can be automatically conformed with an XML file - or does it require manual re-linking?
 
Matt Weatherly said:
Thank you Craig. And I appreciate the trial key offer - I have been looking through the trial you have on the site and it seems to be testing appropriately.

However, I do have one additional question. What is the optimal workflow for utilizing the RedCine renders with an XML back in FCP. I'm just looking for the steps involved. I'm assuming the RedCine renders can be automatically conformed with an XML file - or does it require manual re-linking?
Click to expand...

Redcine XML export is not fully integrated, so anything you render out of RedCine will need to be relinked back in manually.
It's just a way to move selected clips out to RedCine. From there we have no control over how (or where) you render them so we can't merge them back into the workflow automatically.

1> Import XML into Monkey Extract
2> Select "Choose Footage to Render" and click through to the thumbnail browser
3> Choose "Export round-trip file" now before selecting footage. Anything set to RedCine or unticked will not be updated in the round-trip XML that is created automatically.
4> Choose which clips will be rendered with Monkey Extract and which will be sent to RedCine XML. Click the RedCine export button to create aliases and RedCine XML. (Remember to load the aliases into RedCine later, not the original R3Ds)
5> Click render to render out everything else with Monkey Extract.
6> Load the XML from step 3 back into FCP. The RedCine clips will be missing since we didn't render them. You'll need to link those in manually after rendering them in RedCine.
 
Gotcha. Thanks for the info. Also, I see now that you can run RSX files through Monkey so that will work great for me actually. I just wanted to access the new color science somehow and have a conformed timeline after that for Color.

So I'll just do the Red Alert tweaks to create the RSX files and render it through Monkey Extract. I just tried a brief test and it worked great. Thanks again for your help!

-Matt
 
Craig,

ME's black and white points are set from 0 to 100. Is there a plan in the future that will be changed to 0 to 1023?
 
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