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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

KOMODO....

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Has it been stated, whether Komodo will allow for an external SSD like the Samsung T5 or is it CFast only?

Using a BMPCC 4K/6K, the Tilta side handle that allows for the T5 to drop in, is really good. Couple that with a battery inside the handle and it's rather compact as well.

To keep pricing down for the Komodo and make it competitive against the BMPCC 4K/6K, these are the things that Red are gonna have to think about. Not everyone who is looking for an entry level Red wants to spend 10k+. They aren't going to want to buy $900 1TB CFast cards, when a 2TB SSD costs $250 and has a similar Read/Write.

Battery Life, Monitors, Storage..etc. These are the things that alot of Redusers are accustomed to anticipating when purchasing Red. Newer shooters that this is sort of targeted at, is not going to like the "Fine Print" style accessories and cost attributed to them.
 
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Lawrence Harding said:
Has it been stated, whether Komodo will allow for an external SSD like the Samsung T5 or is it CFast only?

Using a BMPCC 4K, the Tilta side handle that allows for the T5 to drop in, is really good. Couple that with a battery inside the handle and it's rather compact as well.

To keep pricing down for the Komodo and make it competitive against the BMPCC 4K/6K, these are the things that Red are gonna have to think about. Not everyone who is looking for an entry level Red wants to spend 10k+. They aren't going to want to buy $900 1TB CFast cards, when a 2TB SSD costs $250 and has a similar Read/Write.

Battery Life, Monitors, Storage..etc. These are the things that alot of Redusers are accustomed to anticipating when purchasing Red. Newer shooters that this is sort of targeted at, is not going to like the "Fine Print" style accessories and cost attributed to them.
Click to expand...

First of all, they are not really making Komodo as an "entry level" RED camera, they are just making it as cheap as they can because they are making it as a B or C camera for crews in need of a realiable thing where a DSMC2 is too big, too heavy or too "rolling shuttery".

Second, people who really don't want to invest in a big CFast 2.0 card car always gothe SolidPod route :
pack1_1024x.png

https://store.n.ki/products/solidpod

And finally, IF you're not in a shooting scenario where you need to capture really long takes (like I don't know a concert or an event or whatever), you shouldn't use a too big media card because in case of media corruption, or a card being lost or stolen, you loose way to much of content. That's just my two cents anyway but I prefer a bunch of 128GB cards than one 1TB.
 
Lawrence Harding said:
Has it been stated, whether Komodo will allow for an external SSD like the Samsung T5 or is it CFast only?

Using a BMPCC 4K/6K, the Tilta side handle that allows for the T5 to drop in, is really good. Couple that with a battery inside the handle and it's rather compact as well.

To keep pricing down for the Komodo and make it competitive against the BMPCC 4K/6K, these are the things that Red are gonna have to think about. Not everyone who is looking for an entry level Red wants to spend 10k+. They aren't going to want to buy $900 1TB CFast cards, when a 2TB SSD costs $250 and has a similar Read/Write.

Battery Life, Monitors, Storage..etc. These are the things that alot of Redusers are accustomed to anticipating when purchasing Red. Newer shooters that this is sort of targeted at, is not going to like the "Fine Print" style accessories and cost attributed to them.
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Yeah, people are going to try and claim this as an entry level camera for RED. Affordability does not mean it's an entry-level camera for their DSMC lineup. This camera is not meant for that. This is a companion camera. Yeah, you can use it as an A-Cam if the project calls for it, but they are not going to try and slash off features just to make it competitive with the likes of other cameras. The BMPCC 4K/6K is a fine entry-level cinema camera. This just isn't meant for that. I'm sure this is the misinformation spreading around the pocket forums and FB groups like, "RED IS DEAD" and "MINIMAG LOL".
 
Bastien Tribalat said:
And finally, IF you're not in a shooting scenario where you need to capture really long takes (like I don't know a concert or an event or whatever), you shouldn't use a too big media card because in case of media corruption, or a card being lost or stolen, you loose way to much of content. That's just my two cents anyway but I prefer a bunch of 128GB cards than one 1TB.
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I agree. I bought a 2TB Kippertie Longtake because the price of RED media is still pretty high (it's been performing very well and costs less than 2x 480GB), but in general I like to have no more than 30minutes capacity in the best recording format for any given camera. For a Scarlet W I believe that would be a 240GB card.

In this case I have to switch to doing incremental backups to try to mitigate the risks.

But to stay on topic, Komodo is coming at a time when CFast cards are at their lowest prices and are actually reasonable from the big names. I hope RED will test with some of the smaller names like Angelbird and Egodisk.
 
Phil Holland said:
Incoming rant-long-answer. We've all been captivated by the potential and marketing of faster CFexpress media for sure.

Let's be specific. Namely what most people would be looking for are CFexpress 2.0 Type-B form factor cards. Which is a still pretty new memory format. So new that the actual media that you will be likely be looking to use is still not out yet.
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Don't you think they could have, instead of one CFast 2.0, chosen to implement 2 XQD cards slots?

Pros:
- 440MB/s writing and 400MB/s reading
- Size identical to future CFexpress 2.0 (Komodo compatibility via firmware, like the Sony FX9)
- On the market since 2015, cheap, extremely reliable, low temp.
- Dual card slots means different types of recording possibilities (relay, mirror...)

Cons:
- Partnership with Sony (E mount and Sony BP batteries instead of Canon RF mount and BP-XXXG?)
-Price tag reflecting the partnership?
-Too late?
 
yann LHENORET said:
Don't you think they could have, instead of one CFast 2.0, chosen to implement 2 XQD cards slots?

Pros:
- 440MB/s writing and 400MB/s reading
- Size identical to future CFexpress 2.0 (Komodo compatibility via firmware, like the Sony FX9)
- On the market since 2015, cheap, extremely reliable, low temp.
- Dual card slots means different types of recording possibilities (relay, mirror...)

Cons:
- Partnership with Sony (E mount and Sony BP batteries instead of Canon RF mount and BP-XXXG?)
-Price tag reflecting the partnership?
-Too late?
Click to expand...

Does Arri have dual slots on their Alexas ? I mean, in that realm of CINEMA cameras (YES you can use them for anything... Like anything else... In 2018, I saw Chopard filming Cannes' Red Carpet with a RED Helium 8K) media reliability is kinda more important (in theory ! :p) than dual slots stuff.

And then, I could ague that they also could have put dual slot CFAST like on the C300MKII but it would have made the camera slightly bigger which is against what they are trying to achieve with this product.

And XQD is slow as f*** to offload. Almost 15 minutes for a 128 GB card over USB3 VS 3 to 5 minutes for a 128 GB Cfast2.0 card on the same computer to the same SSD and via the same USB3 port with nothing else running.
(card readers were the Sony USB3 one for the XQD and a Lexar TB2/USB3 one for the CFast)

EDIT : has there been any official announcement that the FX9 will in fact be supporting CFExpress ? I can't find anything. The closest thing I found what "no plans for supporting CFExpress at the moment"...
 
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yann LHENORET said:
Don't you think they could have, instead of one CFast 2.0, chosen to implement 2 XQD cards slots?

Pros:
- 440MB/s writing and 400MB/s reading
- Size identical to future CFexpress 2.0 (Komodo compatibility via firmware, like the Sony FX9)
- On the market since 2015, cheap, extremely reliable, low temp.
- Dual card slots means different types of recording possibilities (relay, mirror...)

Cons:
- Partnership with Sony (E mount and Sony BP batteries instead of Canon RF mount and BP-XXXG?)
-Price tag reflecting the partnership?
-Too late?
Click to expand...

lol. No. Just no. Even XQD is going away in favor of CFexpress (from other companies) as Sony will eventually abandon the format as they got what they were looking for there, so best bet there is to hope some sort of miracle, but I would expect not due to the reasons CFexpress has had multiple delays.

And again, CFast 2.0: Sustained Write 490 MB/s. Reads = Sustained 550 MB/s

I don't need to point out the obvious, but I've already done it multiple times already, Sony is a competitor to RED and Sony won't license E-Mount tech. Hell, half the reason you have various other weird mounts in mirrorless is due to unique licensing issues surrounding that even with companies that partner with Sony on various tech. Canon is also a competitor, but there's always been a lot of love between these two brands dating way back. RED has the unique position at the moment of being the only other camera company supporting RF Mount other than Canon and you're about to see a sea of optics from Sigma and Canon coming for the mount still. Might be more coming once Zeiss figures out their path too. And yes, you can adapt damn near anything to RF Mount.

I own and use Sony mirrorless cameras, dig them. RF is going to be around for a long, long time and it's the earliest of days. Sony absolutely has gained steam in the mirrorless world and Canon was/is wicked late to the party, but keep in mind the most popular and common mount in the world by a significant margin is Canon EF. Canon took their time developing everything to get it right. They've already implemented unique features in a shorter flange depth smart mount. So much so I imagine an E-Mount V2 is on the horizon eventually.

Dual slots works well for the DSLR and Mirrorless world, but based on the amount of professionals that even use that, truly not worth the squeeze. What you do need is intelligence communicating with your media to discern media health and even better having a codec that completes writes when power is pulled, which REDCODE RAW does btw. Bare in mind we don't know anything about what Komodo does, but even in the RED world already REDCODE RAW and ProRes can be recorded at the same time to the same media card. I don't know/think Komodo has the bandwidth for that, it would be impressive if it does, but Komodo is clearly a very optimized small form factor body. It's going to do "some stuff" that it's bigger brothers can do for sure, but certainly not everything as Jarred has mentioned.

We've got a few more years of CFast 2.0 being a standard in this industry, it's not going anywhere for a while. I know it's an "older media format" in the face of the latest technologies, but what's more important is that it's a "matured media format" and widely available and supported. Which is still not something we can truly say about CFexpress until it actually is there.

CFexpress will 100% have market adoption in particular due to the FX9 and C500 MK II, but that's about it at the moment.
 
Phil Holland said:
lol. No. Just no. Even XQD is going away in favor of CFexpress (from other companies) as Sony will eventually abandon the format as they got what they were looking for there, so best bet there is to hope some sort of miracle, but I would expect not due to the reasons CFexpress has had multiple delays.

And again, CFast 2.0: Sustained Write 490 MB/s. Reads = Sustained 550 MB/s

I don't need to point out the obvious, but I've already done it multiple times already, Sony is a competitor to RED and Sony won't license E-Mount tech. Hell, half the reason you have various other weird mounts in mirrorless is due to unique licensing issues surrounding that even with companies that partner with Sony on various tech. Canon is also a competitor, but there's always been a lot of love between these two brands dating way back. RED has the unique position at the moment of being the only other camera company supporting RF Mount other than Canon and you're about to see a sea of optics from Sigma and Canon coming for the mount still. Might be more coming once Zeiss figures out their path too. And yes, you can adapt damn near anything to RF Mount.

I own and use Sony mirrorless cameras, dig them. RF is going to be around for a long, long time and it's the earliest of days. Sony absolutely has gained steam in the mirrorless world and Canon was/is wicked late to the party, but keep in mind the most popular and common mount in the world by a significant margin is Canon EF. Canon took their time developing everything to get it right. They've already implemented unique features in a shorter flange depth smart mount. So much so I imagine an E-Mount V2 is on the horizon eventually.

Dual slots works well for the DSLR and Mirrorless world, but based on the amount of professionals that even use that, truly not worth the squeeze. What you do need is intelligence communicating with your media to discern media health and even better having a codec that completes writes when power is pulled, which REDCODE RAW does btw. Bare in mind we don't know anything about what Komodo does, but even in the RED world already REDCODE RAW and ProRes can be recorded at the same time to the same media card. I don't know/think Komodo has the bandwidth for that, it would be impressive if it does, but Komodo is clearly a very optimized small form factor body. It's going to do "some stuff" that it's bigger brothers can do for sure, but certainly not everything as Jarred has mentioned.

We've got a few more years of CFast 2.0 being a standard in this industry, it's not going anywhere for a while. I know it's an "older media format" in the face of the latest technologies, but what's more important is that it's a "matured media format" and widely available and supported. Which is still not something we can truly say about CFexpress until it actually is there.

CFexpress will 100% have market adoption in particular due to the FX9 and C500 MK II, but that's about it at the moment.
Click to expand...

Indeed. The Kinefinity E-Mount isn't licensed by Sony and therefore is ONLY mechanical. NO pins for data or power.
 
Phil Holland said:
lol. No. Just no. Even XQD is going away in favor of CFexpress (from other companies) as Sony will eventually abandon the format as they got what they were looking for there, so best bet there is to hope some sort of miracle, but I would expect not due to the reasons CFexpress has had multiple delays.

And again, CFast 2.0: Sustained Write 490 MB/s. Reads = Sustained 550 MB/s

I don't need to point out the obvious, but I've already done it multiple times already, Sony is a competitor to RED and Sony won't license E-Mount tech. Hell, half the reason you have various other weird mounts in mirrorless is due to unique licensing issues surrounding that even with companies that partner with Sony on various tech. Canon is also a competitor, but there's always been a lot of love between these two brands dating way back. RED has the unique position at the moment of being the only other camera company supporting RF Mount other than Canon and you're about to see a sea of optics from Sigma and Canon coming for the mount still. Might be more coming once Zeiss figures out their path too. And yes, you can adapt damn near anything to RF Mount.

I own and use Sony mirrorless cameras, dig them. RF is going to be around for a long, long time and it's the earliest of days. Sony absolutely has gained steam in the mirrorless world and Canon was/is wicked late to the party, but keep in mind the most popular and common mount in the world by a significant margin is Canon EF. Canon took their time developing everything to get it right. They've already implemented unique features in a shorter flange depth smart mount. So much so I imagine an E-Mount V2 is on the horizon eventually.

Dual slots works well for the DSLR and Mirrorless world, but based on the amount of professionals that even use that, truly not worth the squeeze. What you do need is intelligence communicating with your media to discern media health and even better having a codec that completes writes when power is pulled, which REDCODE RAW does btw. Bare in mind we don't know anything about what Komodo does, but even in the RED world already REDCODE RAW and ProRes can be recorded at the same time to the same media card. I don't know/think Komodo has the bandwidth for that, it would be impressive if it does, but Komodo is clearly a very optimized small form factor body. It's going to do "some stuff" that it's bigger brothers can do for sure, but certainly not everything as Jarred has mentioned.

We've got a few more years of CFast 2.0 being a standard in this industry, it's not going anywhere for a while. I know it's an "older media format" in the face of the latest technologies, but what's more important is that it's a "matured media format" and widely available and supported. Which is still not something we can truly say about CFexpress until it actually is there.

CFexpress will 100% have market adoption in particular due to the FX9 and C500 MK II, but that's about it at the moment.
Click to expand...

Thank you for making it abundantly clear why there aren't more E-Mounts on other manufacturers' cameras. It gets tiring hearing people ask why X didn't go with an E-mount on their new cams. Lenses are a large and long-term investment. Make wise choices.
 
I'm very happy that Red has a partnership (or at least a licensing agreement) with Canon and not Sony. Better mount, better batteries, better adapters, better lenses, more abundant lenses, better AF (if they are sharing those details), better camera usability, etc. And I much prefer Canon's image and cameras over Sony - So, when I get my Komodo and start buying RF lenses and want a second camera or a complementary camera or a more documentary camera, I can go with whatever Canon will bring out in the future.

Also, don't mind CFast 2.0 as long as I can get some good frame rates in 4k as I own four 512GB cards already - haha.
 
Has anyone used or tested some of these CFast 2.0 cards (like Angelbird or Prograde Digital) that claim sustained writes in the upper 400MB/s range? I'm curious as to whether they really hit anywhere close to those speeds in real applications since none of them are rated for 3:1 on the Pocket 6K, which is 323 MB/s.
 
Ryan Genova said:
Has anyone used or tested some of these CFast 2.0 cards (like Angelbird or Prograde Digital) that claim sustained writes in the upper 400MB/s range? I'm curious as to whether they really hit anywhere close to those speeds in real applications since none of them are rated for 3:1 on the Pocket 6K, which is 323 MB/s.
Click to expand...

I DOUBT (but hey I'm all in for a good surprise :p) that Komodo will do Redcode 3:1 anyway.
 
I would like to see a "positive lock" type RF mount as Red does for Arri PL, Nikon F PL and Canon EOS PL. Hard to tell from the picture' but it looks like it uses spring loading only which can loosen with time.
 
Ryan Genova said:
Yeah, probably true, but I'd assume the media limitations would be the driving factor.
Click to expand...

Naaaaa to me it's not a media problem, more a formfactor issue (heat dissipation and stuff)
Look at the datarates of 6KFF Redcode at 3:1. A CFAST2.0 card wouldn't even flex a muscle.
mJX8xCy.png
 
Really curious as to what you all think as most of you are red users already and more experienced I’m sure.

I’ve been waiting to get a production level camera and have weighed all options (Z-Cam, Kinefinity, BMPCC6K, 1DXmiii, Komodo ect...)

Now I understand we don’t know all the specs however there is a lot of talk about the Komodo not necessarily being an A Cam and more of an addition for RED users. I do a lot of run and gun style shooting (80% of my work) I currently have a 1DXmii and love the auto focus and 1080 120. The reason I’m buying a new cam is to get something more professional for video with RAW and 10bit. The Komodo has been what I’ve been waiting for hands down. As tempting as the BMPCC is I’d much rather a RED with a potential 16.5 stops and phase detection auto focus. Just wondering what you all think and if hopping for 120fps at 1080 with the Komodo is a long shot?
 
I think it stands to reason that if you can get full frame 40fps then prob getting 120fps is probable at 1080 if not at 4k.
 
David Groves 1 said:
I think it stands to reason that if you can get full frame 40fps then prob getting 120fps is probable at 1080 if not at 4k.
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Full Frame = full sensor, not "actual full frame sized" (like in 36x24). Just a bit of precision. The sensor is s35 (slightly larger).

120fps at 4K I won't get my hopes that high but 60 yes. 120fps at 2K/1080p seems doable to me BUT I am not an engineer. :p
 
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