HYDROGEN Update July 25th.

[Kyle Jones]

I bought the aluminum model. Should I upgrade to the titanium model (for everything that I'm thinking above)?

As of now, there has been no announced operational difference between the Al and Ti versions of the Hydrogen. In fact, aluminum has a couple of advantages in this application:

-It is lighter weight than titanium.
-It is a better conductor of heat (and therefore would perform better as a heat sink).

Titanium's primary advantage is:

-It is stronger.

In the end, titanium is way better for things like lens mounts because heat dissipation isn't a primary concern and strength is key. However, for use as a case for a portable electronic device, titanium's advantages are not utilized as well as aluminum's, even though it is a more costly material to manufacture with.

 

[Philip Lipetz]

But it will have at least a module lens mount, if not an adapter for legacy lenses. So the aluminum versus titanium question still persists. Also will be need more than one hydrogen for new shooting modes?

 

[Med D]

So the guys who ordered Ti are sure there will be functional differences, the guys who ordered Al are sure there won't be. Meanwhile RED is trying to figure out which approach will yield the best combination of income and happy buyers. Either way one group will be disappointed. Have to say after watching the "Epic-M" evolution I am going for the cheaper option.

 

[Adrian I]

So the guys who ordered Ti are sure there will be functional differences, the guys who ordered Al are sure there won't be. Meanwhile RED is trying to figure out which approach will yield the best combination of income and happy buyers. Either way one group will be disappointed. Have to say after watching the "Epic-M" evolution I am going for the cheaper option.

I went with the Ti but not because I think it will be in any way technically superior to the Al. Mostly because of speshul snowflake syndrome tbh, plus it sounds cooler.

 

[Brandon Veen]

They are not so generous over here. I? As looking at doing that on the note, if the deal meant I was paying like upto $29 a month unlimited ontop of the price.

I'm not sure where you live, Wayne, but for US Carriers at least if we in the future saw one of them stocking Hydrogen similarly to an iPhone or Samsung, they've all gotten rid of 2 Year Contracts, so it would be 24 Monthly Payments (or a 30 Month option on AT&T) for roughly $50 a month for Aluminum and $62.50 for Titanium.

Unlimited Plans with these Carriers, however sits around $60-$80 currently, but gets "cheaper" as you add more lines. It's the same price regardless, but for people who don't buy their phone outright (the vast majority), if RED has them in an AT&T/Sprint/Verizon Store, a person on a Single Line Unlimited Plan is gonna be paying around $110-130 a month.

That, of course, can be lowered by down payments though. As for getting a better deal than outright and a cheap prepaid option, it's about the same since Prepaid Unlimited is $60/mo for Cricket, $65/mo for AT&T Prepaid, and $80 for Verizon Prepaid.

Edit: Just figured out you're Australian, so most of what I said doesn't really apply, although if any of the carriers do the 24 Month installments and were to get Hydrogen in-store, and they aren't marked up after a USD to AUD conversion, you're probably looking at a $65/mo Aluminum and a $80/mo Titanium.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

Okay, since I'm on board, a few questions (ideas?) have arisen.

Can this phone do SLAM?

Will it require 2 cameraphones to do 3D? 4 cameraphones to do holographic video?

If 8 cameras are arranged in a cube facing inwards, would the H4V codec be able to encapsulate the entire volume to the stream? Seamlessly?

Will the other cameras have to be RED brand if desiring to do holographic video?

Does it have inside out positional tracking?

Could it be used as a high quality 3D scanner of objects and environments?

It sounds heavy, so it wouldn't be very practical to wear as an HMD (with head mount "module")?

Will the Holographic system replace the need for a green screen?

Will the H4V CODEC be made available to 3D app developers and game engine creators before the phone is released?

Is the H4V CODEC representable in a 3D app, thus making it manipulatable in post? Is it seen as 3D point cloud data, or ... ?

Is this going to completely up-end the VFX industry?


Will the H4V CODEC be viewable in other AR/VR HMD devices?


I bought the aluminum model. Should I upgrade to the titanium model (for everything that I'm thinking above)?

Thank you for your inventiveness, Jim! I couldn't afford the original RED camera when it came out 10 years ago. But I never lost hope that some day something revolutionary would hit, and I'd be lucky to be a part of it.

Here we are.

Good questions Dillont, they will have to answer those. Most of those things if they don't support, might be supportable in third party software.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

I'm not sure where you live, Wayne, but for US Carriers at least if we in the future saw one of them stocking Hydrogen similarly to an iPhone or Samsung, they've all gotten rid of 2 Year Contracts, so it would be 24 Monthly Payments (or a 30 Month option on AT&T) for roughly $50 a month for Aluminum and $62.50 for Titanium.

Unlimited Plans with these Carriers, however sits around $60-$80 currently, but gets "cheaper" as you add more lines. It's the same price regardless, but for people who don't buy their phone outright (the vast majority), if RED has them in an AT&T/Sprint/Verizon Store, a person on a Single Line Unlimited Plan is gonna be paying around $110-130 a month.

That, of course, can be lowered by down payments though. As for getting a better deal than outright and a cheap prepaid option, it's about the same since Prepaid Unlimited is $60/mo for Cricket, $65/mo for AT&T Prepaid, and $80 for Verizon Prepaid.

Edit: Just figured out you're Australian, so most of what I said doesn't really apply, although if any of the carriers do the 24 Month installments and were to get Hydrogen in-store, and they aren't marked up after a USD to AUD conversion, you're probably looking at a $65/mo Aluminum and a $80/mo Titanium.

Ohh, you make me feel bad. Yes, the markup in US doller equivalent could be drastic, plus the phone has to be government certified and tested for sale here (expensive)

 

[Elsie N]

As of now, there has been no announced operational difference between the Al and Ti versions of the Hydrogen. In fact, aluminum has a couple of advantages in this application:

-It is lighter weight than titanium.
-It is a better conductor of heat (and therefore would perform better as a heat sink).

Titanium's primary advantage is:

-It is stronger.

In the end, titanium is way better for things like lens mounts because heat dissipation isn't a primary concern and strength is key. However, for use as a case for a portable electronic device, titanium's advantages are not utilized as well as aluminum's, even though it is a more costly material to manufacture with.

One possible difference would be that with everything else the same, the Titanium version could have the ability to rule all the Aluminum models. That is, if you were doing a multi-cam shoot, you could reserve a Ti model to act as the unifying phone or camera for operating all the others. That would justify the difference in price.

But as I posted in another thread, Aluminum version could theoretically be self powered until it used up all its available Aluminum. '-)

EDIT: Just had a thought... what if the Hydrogen Ti is issued as capable of sensor swaps, like the RED cameras. That would make the difference worthwhile, while making the Hydrogen the only upgradeable phone on the market.

THAT would create a market that instantaneously shoots Hydrogen 1 up the ladder of "must-have" tech.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

As Jim is reading this:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showth...-performance&p=1750919&viewfull=1#post1750919

When combined with a Cellular Automata (CA) circuite, most things and maybe most of the video encoding can be done with a 1000th or less processing energy consumption, with high clocked circuites performing the other things that CA can't at the moment. At this stage of silicon, this is a benefit to mobile devices However, marketable CA products are still under development, but something out there is bound to be doable waiting to go to market.

 

[Josh Tyron]

As of now, there has been no announced operational difference between the Al and Ti versions of the Hydrogen. In fact, aluminum has a couple of advantages in this application:

-It is lighter weight than titanium.
-It is a better conductor of heat (and therefore would perform better as a heat sink).

Titanium's primary advantage is:

-It is stronger.

In the end, titanium is way better for things like lens mounts because heat dissipation isn't a primary concern and strength is key. However, for use as a case for a portable electronic device, titanium's advantages are not utilized as well as aluminum's, even though it is a more costly material to manufacture with.

I ordered mine in Ti so that when my mom and everyone else also gets one I can still feel superior.

 

[Matt Bai]

Would love an update, sneak peak, subtle photo of a button. Don't leave us 'users hanging. arty:

 

[Phil Holland]

Would love an update, sneak peak, subtle photo of a button. Don't leave us 'users hanging. arty:

I think the next time we'll see "something" will be early-ish September.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

When the IFA show is on, maybe? I have a IFA thread in offtopic.

Looks like the galaxy note 8 is a wash. They are saying great camera but not much about it, 6.3 inch, still no 4k screen. Just k notion of f1.7 and something else (ausdroid has a picture of a brochure for it). Hopefully it has the Samsung liquid lens for larger format sensors, but.unkesd you are going to situate the cameras vertically fir horizontal solution, and have another dual on the other axis, what dues it matter.

Still trying to find out about that 4 camera phone picture saw. Doesn't seem to be the iPhone one after all.

 

[Matt Bai]

I think the next time we'll see "something" will be early-ish September.

You've seen the Holo display. Modules. Any more thoughts you can say or previews... crickets around here.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

Crickets on mushrooms.

 

[Axel Mertes]

https://www.slashgear.com/samsung-plans-just-revealed-new-holographic-ar-glasses-18495777/

Samsung patents AR glasses. Not holographic displays itself, but an inbetween thing.

 

[Malik Tigrine]

Can't wait! When using it as a monitor it would be cool to have a wireless module so there would be no cables. Then you could just pop it off a phone holder to go from camera monitor mode to foolcontrol mode while walking around.

Who told you that you can use it as a monitor?

 

[Eric Lange]

https://www.slashgear.com/samsung-plans-just-revealed-new-holographic-ar-glasses-18495777/

Samsung patents AR glasses. Not holographic displays itself, but an inbetween thing.

There are still view accommodation vs. focusing vs. convergence problems /issues with stereo AR type glasses.

A "Holo/4 view" glasses free display like HYDROGEN is a lot more casual / less intrusive/ less dorky (perhaps)?



And anyway why does everyone's "Reality" need "Augmenting" anyway?


If your Reality is already really awesome then why does it need 3d arrows and advertising splattered all over everything to "Augment" it, (inserted into your field of vision) as you walk down the street?

OR if your Reality really sucks then again why do want inserted info graphics everywhere you go? (If your world and world view is bleak you can't polish a "Turd" with Augmented reality info graphics... [Unless they are really "Snarky" info graphics... ].

Is it the case that everything in the physical world is now rendered as a YELP review or the shortest route to the next Starbucks ?

"This hotdog-stand will give you amebic dysentery ... This museum is boring as f*ck... This sidewalk is full of trash ". (labeled 3d arrows pointing at real trash littering the street)... "The bank teller at the third Kiosk is a solid 10 ! "

I can't help feeling that if Umberto Eco was still alive he would have something to say about all of this?

 

[Adam Montville]

Who told you that you can use it as a monitor?

Press release: http://downloads.red.com/hydrogen.pdf

Command Central: The HYDROGEN ONE will not only be the control center for the HYDROGEN system, it will also integrate into the professional RED camera program, working together with Scarlet, Epic, and Weapon as a user interface and monitor.

Which in itself is pretty remarkable, considering just a 4.7in RED Touch is $1,450.

 

[Wayne Morellini]

Or is it remarkable that a 4.7 inch display costs $1450?

Eric, practicality. Look at Terminator. This building that building, street, the place your after, a good eating place, that underground water mains or power line. I'll admit, a lot more useful from pactical reasons for professional use than personal maybe. Look ok at hololens, yeah I want the 3D design floating there in front of me. This is the real practical usefulness I envisionaged. But outside practical usefulness, Pokemon go? :smiley: Angry birds on 3D rendered structyres based on the structure you are looking at, ohh better go down the patent office :smiley: I was interested in our local council constructing a VR tour of our local sites around the city, rendered how they used to look. That could be done on phone too. But that would fit a AR tour. VR itself, is a bit sucky, until you to all matrix like immersion, it is limited by your practicality of getting around and performing body functions, AR is much better in my opinion at least you can take a wiz, even if it does tell you "Your private member has now shrunk one inch in the last 10 years" each time. "You are now eligible to run for Parliament for the xxxxxx party" (an English thing). So, VR is much more a game and spcialist thing.