Help A soldier out...

[H Dewey]

... there is no reason to limit the God knowledge power to an organic, human bipedal form.

As long as I am that organic, human bipedal form there is EVERY reason to limit the God knowledge power to it. The only reason to create AI is to escape this planet before our Sun goes super nova.

Throw in human cloning / eugenics and you will have two species of humans. You think a guy like Trump wouldn't go for picking kids out of a genetic catalog? I'm looking at you Eric. Probably will be an App for billionaires to specify their kids attributes. So the movie script has to address that inevitability as well ;-)

I don't actually see a problem with that. We need super intelligent ambitious individuals from preferred genetic interference and we need people happy just to be... happy consumers of what the "Supers" create. And so what if they create perfect-looking people? They will attract other perfect-looking people. Personally, I look for actors that are flawed. Perfection to me anyway, is boring.

Edit: if you want to see the future for average humans: look inside Amazon's warehouses and the distribution of wealth and power within that company. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=urWtlOVhg_4

Yes, they are somewhat needy of one another. And your way (robotic AI) will do away with the need for both.

 

[Sabovic Adis]

You will have to clarify what "Man" means.

To whom? God? Till now all attempts were in vain...:rofl:
Human, that's self-explaining and self-explanatory. No further clarification needed. :biggrin:

Does "Man" have to be carbon based ? Maybe the evolution of what is considered "Mankind" won't be a cell base organism at all. Maybe "Man" will be a silcon AI based entity with a "soul" that can update and repair itself indefinitely and go much further beyond us into time.


"Man" will be the machine that goes beyond.

Human isn't just a natural construct (not that You now think it's unnatural) but social as well. There's more to human than meets the eye, knowledge being just one of those things.
And I know me, man! :biggrin:

 

[Zeb B]

To whom? God? Till now all attempts were in vain...:rofl:
Human, that's self-explaining and self-explanatory. No further clarification needed. :biggrin:

Human isn't just a natural construct (not that You now think it's unnatural) but social as well. There's more to human than meets the eye, knowledge being just one of those things.
And I know me, man! :biggrin:

Human might be self evident now, as were fruits, vegetables and livestock before GMO's, but at what point of hacking the DNA does it become a replicant or a synthetic lab creation? I say we're close to that point of a dual species split (in carbon organic form) then exceeded by an inorganic form soon after that with AI. How did that second place finish work out for the Neanderthals? Winner takes all

The shit we used to say was uniquely human is getting checked off by the minute. The mile makers that AI was supposed to reach a dozen years from now are being passed today. Soon the machines will be able to teach the machines without the limiting 8hr workday dim witted humans can provide. Again, AI can do 20,000yrs of human computing is a minute or some shit.
http://www.nytimes.com/1997/07/29/science/to-test-a-powerful-computer-play-an-ancient-game.html

Use cross country truck driving as an example of what's to come. If you put a human in the truck you are limited to the time they can drive (10hrs with breaks), their mental state, drug use, anger issues, external pressures, attention span, honesty, eyesight with two eyes . . . etc etc. You have a self driving semi truck you can go coast to coast without stopping, carry more cargo (don't need a cab/sleeper) and with a very predictable risk factor and at a hugely reduced operation cost. That doesn't just put the truck drivers out of work - that puts every small town truck stop out of work as well. Huge economic displacement with no alternatives. Markets will seek ultimate efficiency. As will AI. We are all 'truck drivers' in the future.

 

[Zeb B]

As long as I am that organic, human bipedal form there is EVERY reason to limit the God knowledge power to it. The only reason to create AI is to escape this planet before our Sun goes super nova.

I don't actually see a problem with that. We need super intelligent ambitious individuals from preferred genetic interference and we need people happy just to be... happy consumers of what the "Supers" create. And so what if they create perfect-looking people? They will attract other perfect-looking people. Personally, I look for actors that are flawed. Perfection to me anyway, is boring.

Yes, they are somewhat needy of one another. And your way (robotic AI) will do away with the need for both.

I'm guessing that you are joking that the answer is to escape the planet. We've done that many times before. Like when we used to literally throw our shit into the streets of Europe and completely fucked over the environment there we had the idea of settling the virgin New World. Then did the exact same thing. No matter where you go - there You are. Wouldn't take long to fuck over Mars

Unless you were invited to Davos this year, the second human species will not be your choice and certainly not done for your benefit. But, again, I read this comment as tongue in cheek.

Yes, once whoever obtains perfect AI they will have no need for Amazon warehouses or consumers. Maybe just some simple peasants to praise them or play sports for them like Kim Jong Un has.

 

[H Dewey]

I'm guessing that you are joking that the answer is to escape the planet. We've done that many times before. Like when we used to literally throw our shit into the streets of Europe and completely fucked over the environment there we had the idea of settling the virgin New World. Then did the exact same thing. No matter where you go - there You are. Wouldn't take long to fuck over Mars

Unless you were invited to Davos this year, the second human species will not be your choice and certainly not done for your benefit. But, again, I read this comment as tongue in cheek.

Yes, once whoever obtains perfect AI they will have no need for Amazon warehouses or consumers. Maybe just some simple peasants to praise them or play sports for them like Kim Jong Un has.

Actually, a departure from my usual self, I was being completely serious.

And by escaping the planet, I didn't mean going to Mars... I meant getting WAY away from Earth as the Sun gets closer to its end. And yes, at that point in time we will need to become Singular... that is, man and machine as one. That way, we can send our computerized consciousness on light year journeys with no need for food other than energy for our machine-selves.

We don't need to reach that state any time soon. We do just fine as human beings. Of course there will be some who argue that AI can better serve humanity and make our lives better. Bullshit! Technology can do that without going all AI on us. Those poor downtrodden workers at Amazon? They live better than the middle class of the last century. Not only that, but they do meaningful work. Ask people who do not have a job or cannot work. See where their self-esteem levels are.

I wasn't invited to Davos and didn't feel slighted in the least. I am actually coming around to the idea that giving the large corporations tax breaks is in my best interest. Why? Because they research, invent and produce things that make my life better. And if John/Jane Q Public cannot afford their devices, they will just have to make them less expensive so we can if they want to reach a wide segment.

I'm saying I'm unlikely to rub elbows with the rich and famous. No skin off my knees as I don't genuflect.

The way I see it? Their loss. (Guess I'd better put a smiley here so you can know that I am (maybe) with tongue in cheek.

 

[Sabovic Adis]

Human might be self evident now, as were fruits, vegetables and livestock before GMO's, but at what point of hacking the DNA does it become a replicant or a synthetic lab creation?

Never! Tell Mengele he can kiss that shit good by...:rofl:

It's not just about genetics, not only about physics (No, human ain't just a bag of protons and electrons. Think emergence, as in thesis/antithesis => synthesis. Or simply ask Hegel, he'll know this stuff). Human is social construct (amongst other things), a social being. Not just natural one. :biggrin:

I say we're close to that point of a dual species split (in carbon organic form) then exceeded by an inorganic form soon after that with AI. How did that second place finish work out for the Neanderthals? Winner takes all

Well, Neanderthal ain't exactly human, just humanoid. Close. A relative...:blush2:

The shit we used to say was uniquely human is getting checked off by the minute.

Yet we still stand strong. :muscle:

The mile makers that AI was supposed to reach a dozen years from now are being passed today. Soon the machines will be able to teach the machines without the limiting 8hr workday dim witted humans can provide. Again, AI can do 20,000yrs of human computing is a minute or some shit.
http://www.nytimes.com/1997/07/29/science/to-test-a-powerful-computer-play-an-ancient-game.html

Use cross country truck driving as an example of what's to come. If you put a human in the truck you are limited to the time they can drive (10hrs with breaks), their mental state, drug use, anger issues, external pressures, attention span, honesty, eyesight with two eyes . . . etc etc. You have a self driving semi truck you can go coast to coast without stopping, carry more cargo (don't need a cab/sleeper) and with a very predictable risk factor and at a hugely reduced operation cost. That doesn't just put the truck drivers out of work - that puts every small town truck stop out of work as well. Huge economic displacement with no alternatives. Markets will seek ultimate efficiency. As will AI. We are all 'truck drivers' in the future.

There is a purpose we make robots. Or A.I.s, if You will. There is a need that needs to be satisfied. Without purpose we don't move our muscles.
My point is: someone needs them freakin' A.I.s...:rofl:...and all "we" have to do ("we", that didn't make them) is learn how to use them properly, so we don't harm ourselves, or get harmed standing in their way.
But we already had the industrial revolution, didn't we?! :biggrin:

 

[Zeb B]

Actually, a departure from my usual self, I was being completely serious.

And by escaping the planet, I didn't mean going to Mars... I meant getting WAY away from Earth as the Sun gets closer to its end. And yes, at that point in time we will need to become Singular... that is, man and machine as one. That way, we can send our computerized consciousness on light year journeys with no need for food other than energy for our machine-selves.

We don't need to reach that state any time soon. We do just fine as human beings. Of course there will be some who argue that AI can better serve humanity and make our lives better. Bullshit! Technology can do that without going all AI on us. Those poor downtrodden workers at Amazon? They live better than the middle class of the last century. Not only that, but they do meaningful work. Ask people who do not have a job or cannot work. See where their self-esteem levels are.

I wasn't invited to Davos and didn't feel slighted in the least. I am actually coming around to the idea that giving the large corporations tax breaks is in my best interest. Why? Because they research, invent and produce things that make my life better. And if John/Jane Q Public cannot afford their devices, they will just have to make them less expensive so we can if they want to reach a wide segment.

I'm saying I'm unlikely to rub elbows with the rich and famous. No skin off my knees as I don't genuflect.

The way I see it? Their loss. (Guess I'd better put a smiley here so you can know that I am (maybe) with tongue in cheek.

If you're not flying on your own private jet right now . . . there will be no seat for you, or your children, on these consciousness star journeys. The future will be no different than the present in that regard. Point about Amazon is that there are no workers and, as a result of automation, the middle class will be extinguished in a generation or so. AI will accelerate this.

Large corporate profits are not the source of what makes human existence better at any level. It is a further concentration of wealth which is well documented as being the exact opposite of for the greater good of humanity.

http://www.oecd.org/social/in-it-together-why-less-inequality-benefits-all-9789264235120-en.htm

 

[Zeb B]

and all "we" have to do ("we", that didn't make them) is learn how to use them properly, so we don't harm ourselves, or get harmed standing in their way

You will have no use or purpose in deciding how or when those who control AI will use it. The concept of how we are all going to get one vote on how to use this awesome power is a bit naive. Those in power will decide our fate.

 

[Sabovic Adis]

You will have no use or purpose in deciding how or when those who control AI will use it. The concept of how we are all going to get one vote on how to use this awesome power is a bit naive. Those in power will decide our fate.

Aren't we in power?

 

[Jacek Zakowicz]

You will have no use or purpose in deciding how or when those who control AI will use it. The concept of how we are all going to get one vote on how to use this awesome power is a bit naive. Those in power will decide our fate.

Now I know where the saying "Murphy was an optimist" comes from ;-)

 

[Zeb B]

Now I know where the saying "Murphy was an optimist" comes from ;-)

Coming from the crankiest person on RU . . . that kinda hurts my feelings ;-)

 

[Jacek Zakowicz]

The truth hurts sometimes -I know a thing or two about that haha ;-)
BTW is that an official title? can we vote?

 

[H Dewey]

BTW is that an official title? can we vote?

Sorry Jacek. AI doesn't allow voting.

 

[Sabovic Adis]

Let me rephrase this:

Aren't we in power?

Is there a higher power? :rofl:

 

[Jacek Zakowicz]

Democracy, nomocracy, meritocracy, its getting confusing...;-)

 

[Zeb B]

Democracy, nomocracy, meritocracy, its getting confusing...;-)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBvIweCIgwk

our final form

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-dBpodyhy4

 

[rand thompson]

An Anime clip from the 90's "casshan: Robot Hunter" about a scientist who creates and android robot to protect the environment. The android determines that human beings are the biggest risk to the environment and need to be exterminated. The scientist's creates a superior Android as a fail safe just incase the other android got out of control. However, the superior android required a human soul which was given to it by the scientist's son upon his death.


warning!!cheesy acting alert.

 

[Zeb B]

The truth hurts sometimes -I know a thing or two about that haha ;-)
BTW is that an official title? can we vote?

 

[Zeb B]

An Anime clip from the 90's "casshan: Robot Hunter" about a scientist who creates and android robot to protect the environment. The android determines that human beings are the biggest risk to the environment and need to be exterminated. The scientist's creates a superior Android as a fail safe just incase the other android got out of control. However, the superior android required a human soul which was given to it by the scientist's son upon his death.


warning!!cheesy acting alert.

That's cool! Reminds me of when they talk about invasive species in Hawaii . . . they never mention the worst of them . . . ;-)

 

[Patrick Fougere]

Well this thread took an interesting turn....