First Look - Schneider Xenon FF-Prime Lenses

[Marcus Friedlander]

The 100's are scarce, that's for sure. If anyone wants to see a shot with the 100, I'll grab something this weekend. 25mm should be shipping very late this month or first part of next month, but there don't seem to be any final production units out in the wild yet and that usually happens when we're about 30~45 days out from first shipment.

135mm should happen early next year, probably April-ish, but I'm guessing. Not sure what was said at Photokina and IBC about it. The 18mm is in the pipeline somewhere too.

If you don't mind I would love to see some frames and possibly a R3D to play with to tide me over. :laugh:

Do you know if they are doing any "full"set (25mm-100mm) or full set (18mm -135mm) deals when they are all fully out?

 

[Phil Holland]

If you don't mind I would love to see some frames and possibly a R3D to play with to tide me over. :laugh:

Do you know if they are doing any "full"set (25mm-100mm) or full set (18mm -135mm) deals when they are all fully out?

I'll ping Duclos Lenses and Hot Rod Camera. I'll let peeps know if they can work out a discount once the full set is out. The Group Buy I organized is more or less done at this point, but I don't mind sniffing around to see what's possible.

 

[Nick Fury]

I was told today to look for the 25 near the end of this year...Others to follow. My set, with the 100mm is out on a job at the moment, but the 100 is quite scarce, at the moment.

The Canon 17-120 is likely getting here before the 25. A few copies of that zoom have made it out to certain networks. Sorry OT

 

[Tom Greenberg]

After not seeing any sign of them during June, July or August, I was told I'd have a 100 in a couple weeks...that was over 6 weeks ago. This launch process has been more than a little frustrating, that's for sure! While I appreciate the magnitude of the task of launching a completely new line, those of us who were early adopters have suffered. Much as I like my Xenons, from a purely financial standpoint, I would have been much better off to spend my money on something else last Spring, and then bought the Xenons once the whole set was shipping.

 

[Matt Gottshalk]

I'll ping Duclos Lenses and Hot Rod Camera. I'll let peeps know if they can work out a discount once the full set is out. The Group Buy I organized is more or less done at this point, but I don't mind sniffing around to see what's possible.

That would be awesome.

Thanks sir.

 

[Joseph Coleman]

Just curious if any of you are seeing the same thing we are? I'll post some stills when I get a chance. But we are using a set of these (35mm,50mm,75mm) and they all are showing very intense chromatic aberation at anything under 5.6 with high contrast shots. At first we thought it was the motion mount causing the purple halos but we just received a standard PL mount and we are still seeing the same issue. We have contacted Schneider and they were not much help to be honest. Basically, told us it was our camera but we have seen it on 2 epics now. Again, I will post photos ASAP. I just wanted to hear from you guys if your seeing a large purple halo around say white shirts in the sunlight or anything of that nature below 5.6.

 

[Phil Holland]

Just curious if any of you are seeing the same thing we are? I'll post some stills when I get a chance. But we are using a set of these (35mm,50mm,75mm) and they all are showing very intense chromatic aberation at anything under 5.6 with high contrast shots. At first we thought it was the motion mount causing the purple halos but we just received a standard PL mount and we are still seeing the same issue. We have contacted Schneider and they were not much help to be honest. Basically, told us it was our camera but we have seen it on 2 epics now. Again, I will post photos ASAP. I just wanted to hear from you guys if your seeing a large purple halo around say white shirts in the sunlight or anything of that nature below 5.6.

I can help. Sort of.

What you are describing is exactly where and how axial and transverse chromatic aberrations can occur. The Xenon FF-Primes exhibit this more so than say something like the Zeiss Otus Primes for instance because they are spherical designs with specific coatings versus aspherical designs with a different type of coating. The Xenon FF-Primes aren't Ultra Primes and this is where you will see some of the more noticeable differences between them and higher quality/more expensive cinema glass.

You've probably heard that lenses have a "sweet spot" in terms of optical performance. This is approximately 2 to 3 stops stopped down. So basically for these T2.1 primes you're looking at T4-T6 where you will likely minimize some of this chaos. And in really extreme circumstances a bit further.

There are a few ways to combat it in camera. The use of a low contrast filter and sometimes ND filtration works well.

If you have a second though, I'd love to see some samples just to make sure it's "within reason" though. Either an .R3D snapshot or JPG when you get the chance.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Have to agree with everything Phil said there. I found the CA on the Xenons is not as bad on the Dragon with the new v2 OLPF vs. the older or "low light" OLPF. But it is an effect of the lenses that you have to get a feel for and learn to work with. I think the lenses have enough great attributes to outweigh their tendency to show aberrations in ultra-high contrast settings.

As for shots with the 100, I'm a bit behind. Got caught up with family stuff this weekend and will try over the coming few days to get a couple shots and maybe a short clip online.

 

[Ketch Rossi]

Prepping DragonM8 with the Xenon 100mm... This is btw one of my favorite Portrait Focal...

 

[Fergus Hammond]

Just curious if any of you are seeing the same thing we are? I'll post some stills when I get a chance. But we are using a set of these (35mm,50mm,75mm) and they all are showing very intense chromatic aberation at anything under 5.6 with high contrast shots. At first we thought it was the motion mount causing the purple halos but we just received a standard PL mount and we are still seeing the same issue. We have contacted Schneider and they were not much help to be honest. Basically, told us it was our camera but we have seen it on 2 epics now. Again, I will post photos ASAP. I just wanted to hear from you guys if your seeing a large purple halo around say white shirts in the sunlight or anything of that nature below 5.6.

I have exactly the same issue with my 35mm Xenon. It's enough of an issue that I'm probably going to sell the lens and find something better, even if it's more expensive. Working around the CA issue has been frustrating. (This is on a Sony F5.)

 

[Anton Shavlik]

While many people seem happy with these lenses I've had a lot of issues. The chromatic aberration is distractingly strong, I can't shoot with these lenses at 2k for highspeed on my scarlet without stopping down to T4 or T5.6. Given that 120fps in 2k is very vulnerable to noise and 2.3 stops darker than 24fps already this is a major let down. In some situations even at 5k using these lenses at T2.1 is impossible due to CA.

All my lenses have some fine dust inside visible if you look through the lens with an open aperture, my 50mm also came with a strong green tint and had to be sent back, and my 75mm had its focus mechanism break after a small impact to the lens case it was in.

I very much regret not getting CP2s. My previous lenses were from the Zeiss ZE DSLR series and I have held off on selling them because I am using them more often than the Schneiders.

 

[Bob Gundu]

Crazy stuff Anton. Bad luck I suppose as I shoot wide open on mine all the time without issues.

 

[Anton Shavlik]

Yeah, mostly bad luck. I bought mine via bhphotovideo, I hear Duclos checks their lenses out before sale, is that right? I'll post an example of the CA I'm getting tomorrow, would love to know if it's within expected levels.

 

[Nick Fury]

Yeah, mostly bad luck. I bought mine via bhphotovideo, I hear Duclos checks their lenses out before sale, is that right? I'll post an example of the CA I'm getting tomorrow, would love to know if it's within expected levels.

That is correct and a huge reason, in addition to the maintenance program, to strongly consider them as a lens purveyor. Another reason is that the Buyer can talk to the same salesperson...

Thank you very much

Fury

 

[Brian Merlen]

as a dragon owner does this set make more sense you think vignette wise than buying a s35 set? i was really into cooke s4i mini panchros but this set seems like a better buy since red does have a full frame sensor road map essentially, and assuming dragon is upgradable to said full frame sensor one day, maybe its not a great investment to buy an s35 format set? plus i can't even afford the good s35 sets, they are like unreachable for me it seems so far finance wise...so this set seems appealing, esp if i source from duclos... but I'm not sure if they will rent well vs Ultras or the cooke minis...

 

[Tim Morten]

Love my Xenons (though I still have heard nothing from Filmtools on my 100mm, even though I'm theoretically #2 in line there). CA has been inline with my expectations, coverage is no problem on Dragon, and I find the look very appealing. That said I have a lot of respect for Cooke glass, including the minis... 2.8 is a sacrifice, and the faster Cooke glass is so expensive as to be unrealistic for me... Personally, I think the Xenons are a great choice, and have no regrets investing. Someday I'd love a set of Summicron-C primes, but these will hold me for now!

 

[Matt Ryan]

Used Fury's Xenons on a national commercial. I only used the 100mm for some inserts since our set was fairly cramped. Here are two grabs from the 100mm straight from camera. It's not 100% representative of the 100mm since I had a 1/4 Hollywood Black Magic in front of it...

 

[Matt Ryan]

Ketch, where do we get the variable ND?

 

[Brian Merlen]

Love my Xenons (though I still have heard nothing from Filmtools on my 100mm, even though I'm theoretically #2 in line there). CA has been inline with my expectations, coverage is no problem on Dragon, and I find the look very appealing. That said I have a lot of respect for Cooke glass, including the minis... 2.8 is a sacrifice, and the faster Cooke glass is so expensive as to be unrealistic for me... Personally, I think the Xenons are a great choice, and have no regrets investing. Someday I'd love a set of Summicron-C primes, but these will hold me for now!

well if red pushes out a full frame sensor . next, which is on their former roadmap supposedly...it almost makes more sense for me to grab these, and a set of DS rokinons for low budget work...and avoid expensive s35 overall... the cooke mini s4i set is super slow, which bothers me...ultras aren't a lot more... S4i is so expensive you may as well buy S5 if your going to commit that kind of money, or masters, or summicron or summilux... but my primary concern is red will probably put out a full frame sensor next, and the current one i have already won't cover at 6k FF on most high end set wide angles, so at what point am i just spending 6 figures on glass that vignettes on me lol? i wish higher end full frame glass was an option but this set seems to beat canon or zeiss offerings..

 

[scott devitte]

well if red pushes out a full frame sensor . next, which is on their former roadmap supposedly...it almost makes more sense for me to grab these, and a set of DS rokinons for low budget work...and avoid expensive s35 overall... the cooke mini s4i set is super slow, which bothers me...ultras aren't a lot more... S4i is so expensive you may as well buy S5 if your going to commit that kind of money, or masters, or summicron or summilux... but my primary concern is red will probably put out a full frame sensor next, and the current one i have already won't cover at 6k FF on most high end set wide angles, so at what point am i just spending 6 figures on glass that vignettes on me lol? i wish higher end full frame glass was an option but this set seems to beat canon or zeiss offerings..

My opinion- As a personal lens set Xenon does not beat Canon, basically a stop slower and there are problems if you read through the threads, and test them in high contrast situations. There was a lot of "me too" in the runup to the release of these. Canon CN E and the ef ls (think Foolcontrol) and the enormous variety of specialty lenses will cover 97% of what you need to do. When David Fincher calls-rent.