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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

DSLR-killer...

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Purple said:
"Motion jpg" is about the output pipeline, which is different in both systems (which is why my predicted camera is more expensive then the Nikon). You do realize those differences, right?
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And what comes out of this "pipeline"? A RAW or jpg file? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motion_JPEG)

What comes out of Red One, Epic, Scarlet, and, I'm assuming, the DSMC, are RAW files.

Not to be offensive or anything... but you might want to pull your pants up. :)
 
Steve Sanacore said:
Tom

I usually agree with you but in this case I think you are a bit over the top. The last generation of 35mm Pro film camera bodies were close to $3000. A digital version with truly state of the art sensors and computing power for $5000 is not that out of line. Maybe the Canon for $8000 is a bit steep but it's still not a big deal for a working pro that needs gear at that level of build quality.

I think comparing an XSI to an top of the line Canon 1D or 1Ds, or Nikon D3 is like comparing an HVX200 to an Arri 435. If you have used them both as I have on a daily basis, I am sure you would agree.

I do agree however that a future RED camera without all the hardware from the old film camera models, may be a great step forward for us all. An electronic viewfinder with a fantastic sensor a generation ahead of Canon or Nikon or (now) Sony, would be right up RED's alley... and a very welcome piece of gear!

Like I always say, these are exciting times...
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Steve,

I am not disagreeing with the steepness of an $8K DSLR, I am disagreeing with the fact that they cannot be upgraded. My PC cost a bundle, but I can always throw in a new motherboard, chip, video card, RAM, Bluray, monitor, etc. I'm disagreeing with not being able to upgrade the sensor or processors when you are dropping $8K on a DSLR. Some may disagree, but that's my opinion.

I never compared an XSI to a 1D-line camera. Never would. We were talking about XSI vs 40D.

BTW, just speaking generally, for those who make a habit out of dissing Canon EF-S 350/400/450D line cameras, keep in mind that 90% of top astrophotographers around the world still rock the legendary 350D. :) Also keep in mind that this is the size and format of the Red One sensor.

I agree with you: these are exciting times! In fact, this week has been particularly exciting with all the new Canon rumors, Red DSLR killer, etc.
 
Jason Ing said:
New Canon rumors?
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"I've been told that Canon has a new "miracle sensor" coming that has the ability to sense the proper ISO needed for several "zones" within a photo at once. IE, the bright sky will get ISO 50, while the shaded area under the brim of a person's hat may get ISO 400....all automatically to allow the entire image to be correctly exposed. Something similar to in-camera, one-frame only HDR results.

This tip was free...so take it for what you paid for it!"
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http://www.canonrumors.com :)
 
I will feel a lot better if Jim concentrate on RED ONE and make it a functional product with all necessary accessaries, work flow software, owners manual etc. By keep announcing new products every week, his attention will be divided and nothing will ever get done.
Introducing a new DSLR is futile. Canon and Sony and Nikon have that market cornered. Nobody is going to dislodge them.
 
Jannard said:
...
1. Have the best sensor program.
...
Jim
Click to expand...

1: Hate to rain on the parade here but I havn't seen anything from Red to rival the sensor in the D3/D700 for a DSLR. For a start its much bigger than anything Red (full 35mm, not Super35 etc) have made or announced to date and the quality is simply stunning, not to mention the low noise high ISO abilities. The way I see it is Red is lucky Nikon didn't put a HD-SDI output of the D3 because it could be a better video camera than RED1 for 1080p...

If you follow the DSLR forums you'll notice over an over to most pro's, they arn't all that interesting in resolution anymore. Few need (or want) more than the 12MP & we have and shoot in lossless compressed RAW. We don't need RedCode in a DLSR because we have a pure RAW. We don't need 100fps in DSLRs, few really need more than 5fps. Who wants to deal with all those frames anway, not photographers. We want more dynamic range though...

If you want to send a rocker up the photographic market go after a full size sensor medium format system with current DSLR prices.

We'll see what happens but I am no where near as excited by this camera as I was by RED1.

Just expressing my thoughts, I'll be happy to be prooven wrong.
 
GuyB said:
1: Hate to rain on the parade here but I havn't seen anything from Red to rival the sensor in the D3/D700 for a DSLR. For a start its much bigger than anything Red (full 35mm, not Super35 etc) have made or announced to date and the quality is simply stunning, not to mention the low noise high ISO abilities. The way I see it is Red is lucky Nikon didn't put a HD-SDI output of the D3 because it could be a better video camera than RED1 for 1080p...

If you follow the DSLR forums you'll notice over an over to most pro's, they arn't all that interesting in resolution anymore. Few need (or want) more than the 12MP & we have and shoot in lossless compressed RAW. We don't need RedCode in a DLSR because we have a pure RAW. We don't need 100fps in DSLRs, few really need more than 5fps. Who wants to deal with all those frames anway, not photographers. We want more dynamic range though...

If you want to send a rocker up the photographic market go after a full size sensor medium format system with current DSLR prices.

We'll see what happens but I am no where near as excited by this camera as I was by RED1.

Just expressing my thoughts, I'll be happy to be prooven wrong.
Click to expand...

Heh, Heh - if that does not get Jim fired up.....
I have a Nikon D200 - I love shooting timelapses with it.
I have rented RED for some shoots and love the quality.
Since I already deal with still frame sequences I took that knowledge
with me when I started editing RED footage. I would love to know
if the upcoming Scarlet/RED DSLR will have time-lapse capabilities?
I am sure it will. Long exposure times are a must.
I have the D90 on order. I am getting it mainly as a backup and 2nd to the D200.
Many times while shooting timelapses I wished I had
a 2nd to do a different angle. I consider the video in the D90 to be a toy
but know I can leave the DV camera at home.
 
ThydNostrum said:
I will feel a lot better if Jim concentrate on RED ONE and make it a functional product with all necessary accessaries, work flow software, owners manual etc. By keep announcing new products every week, his attention will be divided and nothing will ever get done.
Introducing a new DSLR is futile. Canon and Sony and Nikon have that market cornered. Nobody is going to dislodge them.
Click to expand...

Want to bet?

Jim
 
GuyB said:
1: Hate to rain on the parade here but I havn't seen anything from Red to rival the sensor in the D3/D700 for a DSLR. For a start its much bigger than anything Red (full 35mm, not Super35 etc) have made or announced to date and the quality is simply stunning, not to mention the low noise high ISO abilities. The way I see it is Red is lucky Nikon didn't put a HD-SDI output of the D3 because it could be a better video camera than RED1 for 1080p...

If you follow the DSLR forums you'll notice over an over to most pro's, they arn't all that interesting in resolution anymore. Few need (or want) more than the 12MP & we have and shoot in lossless compressed RAW. We don't need RedCode in a DLSR because we have a pure RAW. We don't need 100fps in DSLRs, few really need more than 5fps. Who wants to deal with all those frames anway, not photographers. We want more dynamic range though...

If you want to send a rocker up the photographic market go after a full size sensor medium format system with current DSLR prices.

We'll see what happens but I am no where near as excited by this camera as I was by RED1.

Just expressing my thoughts, I'll be happy to be prooven wrong.
Click to expand...

Sorry to disagree with you. And the RED ONE sensor does not represent RED's sensor program today. That was just our 1st try... two years ago. What are you trying to accomplish? Answer that question, then compare sensor programs. Trust me when I tell you that no one has a program in place like ours. Now... camera building is another matter and more subject to debate.

Also... what would you do with a D3 with HD-SDI out? Time-lapse?

Jim
 
I will also say that or DSMC is the most beautiful thing we have done. Maybe the "most desirable object in the world". :)

Jim
 
Thank you for opening up this discussion as it has been a topic I like to discuss amongst fellow photographers.
We release a podcast once a week (normally) and the emerging requirement for existing press photographers to shoot video is becoming apparent.
The need for stills is now more prevalent amongst video and cinema guys as well.
The problem has been having these guys conceive of a device that will do both jobs. Their problem is one of ergonomics for different jobs.
From video or cinema the requirement to be shooting for an extended time on a tripod or shoulder mount and from stills photographers, the ability to be very portable.
What I hope is that RED will solve these problems as well as provide better imaging in the process.
We at photogeek.tv salute the efforts and look forward to the outcome.
 
Jannard said:
I will also say that or DSMC is the most beautiful thing we have done. Maybe the "most desirable object in the world". :)

Jim
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Jim, please don't forget to make the Epic #2 :) Seriously, I'd love to have some teases about what Epic will do/accomplish. I love our RED One, it's opened more doors than you can imagine. I've been talking up the Epic like there's no tomorrow, I'm excited by the DSMC, but I really want scarlet and Epic to kick butt and take even more names.
 
I think that when the leader of most companies talk it can be taken with a grain of salt. Jim Jannard's history and his products speak for themselves. I was going to buy a D3 this weekend to add to my D300. I have decided after reading all this today NOT to do that. I can wait. I know the product will be what he says it is. Can I get a free pair of Oakleys with mine please!! :) The only bad part is the 12 months of drooling, waiting from when I see the specs till I can buy it.
 
Jannard said:
...

Also... what would you do with a D3 with HD-SDI out? Time-lapse?

Jim
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ah, maybe just capture it uncompressed 10bit to a FlashXDR.

What are you going to do with a 4MP blurry motion frame from a video camera, oversharpen and print 6x4?

I have still to see a camera concept from RED which comes close to my needs and I am afraid I am not holding my breath for this DSLR either.

You have great products for specific types of shooters, but there is a huge market that has no interest in these products.

RED/EPIC etc, not going to shoot a concert or wedding with that...
Scarlet, sorry, no way, why would I want to shoot a concert with a camera that I have seen to date. I don't need REDRAW for a wedding, concert etc Dealing with 25 or 35Mbps data is bad enough for storage/achiving. There is a reason a rifle is more accurate than a pistol, smaller isn't always better (and its a big reason why consumer footage is always so shakey, the cameras are too small...)

None of these cameras suites covering special event productions, stage productions or sports etc

I am not going to get caught up in the hype & marketing of an 'announcement' with absolutely no details at all. Nothing from Red to date suites my needs, why would I suddenly think the next one will based on a forum post about a 'killer' product but no actual information?

I'll keep an open mind for sure, but its not like the road travelled so far is gold lined so I am not counting those chickens before they hatch.
 
Chiming in late as I'm on location, and pardon my French, but F*ck Yea!

Bring on the ever-lasting-frame-stopper!!!
 
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