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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

DSLR-killer...

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Jannard said:
BTW, my collection includes about every format you can think of up to 8x10. .......
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I bet you not just own and use them. you might be dissect half of those collection, abuse them to their limit.

Now i have the reason not to buy D90. I'll stick with my D40 and old minolta srt. I'll wait jim prophecy

Maybe i should stop smoking...
 
GuyB said:
You can take your troll accusation and shove it where it deserves to go. If you can't accept a bit of healthy debate and discussion go home to mommy. Not every one is a blind fanboy, some of us have a mind of our own we choose to actively use.

I clearly said I don't know his photographic background, thats why i ASKED! Its not exactly clearly published. It's a pretty simple discussion to follow, try to keep up.
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Don't try to play innocent and say you just "asked" a question. You said a lot of other things as well. So if it's such a simple discussion to follow, why can't you follow your own conversation?

You could have just simply asked, "Hey, Jim, have you done any professional photography?"

And you'd get your answer. And without all the crap that followed. Wow. Imagine that.
 
Jannard said:
I seem to have an obsession... :) One of 10 personality disorders... but who is counting?

Jim
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An admirable trait.

Along with being obsessive, and a perfectionist, I have trouble reading at normal speeds and have "slight issues" with brain wave activity.

When I achieve my goals and step up to your level, I would love to have you over for dinner. White or Red? Lemme guess... :)
 
Jannard said:
hehe... I shot every Oakley ad for over 20 years. Also the Oakley commercial that can be seen on the Oakley website. I own over 1000 cameras. So maybe we had better hear your qualifications?

BTW, my collection includes about every format you can think of up to 8x10. 3D, Arri's, Leicas (including Oscar Barmak's original cameras), Hasselblad (every model including moon cameras), Fuji 6x17, Linhof, Alpa, Nikon rangefinder (actually, every Nikon ever made), Minolta, Contax (German and Japanese), Bolex, Rollei, Mamiya, Canon from the beginning, Photosonics, Sinar, Olympus, Pentax, Mitchell, Sony 950, Panasonic Varicam... you get the idea. I have shot almost every one of them.

My qualifications for the camera industry include a passion that is unmatched (as far as I can see) for over 35 years. So much for my qualifications...

Jim
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Thanks Jim, but Deanan's short answer was more than adequte to state that you know how a professional photographer works. Not everyone knows your life storey and I didn't see anything wrong with asking. I am sure if I made such bold statements as you are people would question my experience. Oh wait, you already did and I didn't even make any claims, see what I mean...

My experience is not really relevant as I am not the one making claims of the death of a mainstream professional industry strandard tool without providing any actual information, but all I think you need to know is that I shoot special event video and photography proffessionaly on a regular basis so I know what tools I want and I know when I see a tool that isn't what I need.

I remember when Red was first announced in similar way, wow, it seemed great, I got all excited, for sure I would get one as my next camera. Then details started flowing and the product came out and it is absolutely nothing like anything I need in any way, it is totally the opposite of being the best tool for my video production requirements but is pretty awsome at what it does, so perhaps you might forgive me if I just wait until I see something of what this unit is going to be before I get all excited like some of the fan boys around here. Once burnt, twice shy. I'll sing your praises high enough based on real information, not speculation.

Cheers

Guy
 
Jannard said:
Want to bet?
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Sure.

I agree -- introducing a new DSLR is futile.

That *is* why RED is skipping that stage and doing something else, right?


Except I do hope it still has an Optical viewfinder, otherwise I likely won't even consider it myself...

Not for stills anyway. EVF is fine for movie/video/digicine work, but I hate the idea of an EVF as the primary viewport for still photography.
 
Jason Ing said:
Don't try to play innocent and say you just "asked" a question. You said a lot of other things as well. So if it's such a simple discussion to follow, why can't you follow your own conversation?

You could have just simply asked, "Hey, Jim, have you done any professional photography?"

And you'd get your answer. And without all the crap that followed. Wow. Imagine that.
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Who's playing 'innocent', not me, my posts are there to read as written (other than an edit for a typo or spelling), I was following my thread until you lot took it sideways...

1: I did just ask the question

2: Tom is the one that that added all the crap that followed and you are perpetuating it.

I havn't edited any of my posts so I stand by everything I have said as completely above board and appropriate. Not everyone who doesn't just waste bandwith blowing sunshine up someones posteriour is a troll you know. Some people have real questions.

The only 'stories' of Jim's backgound I had heard was he just had a interest in video production and wanted to stick it to the man because of the hugely inflated prices of Pro video gear. I had never heard anything about him working in photography. Of course I knew I didn't have all the info so I asked, but just a statement that he owned a few pro cameras didn't tell me anything, heck, I know a few Doctors that own D3s etc that wouldn't know how to use them out of P mode, they only own them because the can. You could shoot all the movies in Hollywood and still not know how a professional photographer works in the field (and there are many fields too).

You can take my post as genuine or not, it really doesn't matter to me.
 
GuyB said:
My experience is not really relevant as I am not the one making claims of the death of a mainstream professional industry strandard tool without providing any actual information, but all I think you need to know is that I shoot special event video and photography proffessionaly on a regular basis so I know what tools I want and I know when I see a tool that isn't what I need.

I remember when Red was first announced in similar way, wow, it seemed great, I got all excited, for sure I would get one as my next camera. Then details started flowing and the product came out and it is absolutely nothing like anything I need in any way, it is totally the opposite of being the best tool for my video production requirements
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Yawn...I thought this species was extinct...it's like sighting a coelacanth, only decidedly less remarkable...not as pretty as the coelacanth, either...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/185000/images/_185239_dinowide.jpg

Jim, is the change in EPIC in any way related to the development of this new camera?

Just fishing for clues, to beat the metaphor a little further...
 
ThydNostrum said:
Canon and Sony and Nikon have that market cornered. Nobody is going to dislodge them.
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Dont know, reminds me to much of American politics.
You are led to believe that there is a difference in the 'parties', (i.e. Dems/Repubs, etc.) but at heart its much of the same.

Same with the DSLR market.
Sony is God over it, even though it looks like Canon rules the roost.
After all, there is always that one feature which would have made the leap over all the other cameras which gets left out.

What one camera doesnt have, (and could easily have had), the other has.
Much like Sonys low end DSLR market where they give you 3 cameras around the same price, but missing functionality here and there.

The above applies to Canon, Nikon and Sony as a whole.
This one misses that, but another one, priced a bit higher has what the other brand didnt, and so forth.

No one is going anywhere and with them the market is stuck.

From how I understand it, Sony supplies the 'big' canon lord of DSLRs with chips for the canon video cameras. Something most DSLR owners appear not to know as they think Sony is about 'games' only.

Also, Sony give Nikon chips for the DSLRs.
Yes, you may say Nikon designs and Sony makes.
You would think after years of doing that they would have a clue of how to make their own chips work as good if not better than Nikon.

So Sony feeds into Canon (albeit on the video side, which is more hidden to those who worship Canon) and then Nikon on the photography side.

No matter how the fine details all connect, the point is simple.
Neither company has the incentive or reason to blow the other out of the water.

Neither of the 3 companies - Sony, Canon, Nikon, will ever wipe one or the other off the face of the map, as they are to close in business as it is.
Its more like the political landscape of America, as pointed out in the beginning of the post.

Now here comes RED.
So far everything they have been about and shown is pretty progressive.
Reminds me of Apple and what they used to stand for...quality and progressive technology.

Now its not as progressive...(would take time to explain where Im coming from), and the quality control issues are really obvious when you watch the history of some of their products...as a former Apple fan boy I missed a lot of this, but that is because it takes time with a product to see its trends.

Dont get me wrong, I still own Apple and plan to upgrade soon to a new system if they can work out certain quarks with Nvidia and the laptop screen issues, etc. ;)
Outwardly they represent change...still pretty objects, though going from metal to the cracking iphone plastic...well...
reminds me of Obamas call for change and then he hires an insider as V.P.

Point is, all of this - from politics to products we buy, represent where we are as a collective mass...or rather where our collective thinking is.

We are on the verge of greatness in this world. (look at the cooperation it took to get CERN up and running), but we still have the sillyness which holds us back. (Look at the Russia, Georgia, U.S. bit.) And on a lower scale what corporations do...leak out technology to make sure they have something to sale you years down the road.

Its an old model and an old way of thinking.

I have said a bit, and a lot would need more of an explanation as words are really easy to misunderstand as we interpret it through our mental grid system which was built up by our surrounding milieu. ;)

But here is to RED...the concept is great...they have the momentum...will they stay on top and continue what they started? Or will they become the superficial change which is sweet on the outside, but starts tearing down and breaking form the cheaper parts they use?

As of now, its looking good. So I cant wait to see Scarlet and this new DSLR.

My apologies for my long bit of babbling. ;)

Peace

dAlen
 
GuyB said:
Thanks Jim, but Deanan's short answer was more than adequte to state that you know how a professional photographer works. Not everyone knows your life storey and I didn't see anything wrong with asking. I am sure if I made such bold statements as you are people would question my experience. Oh wait, you already did and I didn't even make any claims, see what I mean...

My experience is not really relevant as I am not the one making claims of the death of a mainstream professional industry strandard tool without providing any actual information, but all I think you need to know is that I shoot special event video and photography proffessionaly on a regular basis so I know what tools I want and I know when I see a tool that isn't what I need.

I remember when Red was first announced in similar way, wow, it seemed great, I got all excited, for sure I would get one as my next camera. Then details started flowing and the product came out and it is absolutely nothing like anything I need in any way, it is totally the opposite of being the best tool for my video production requirements but is pretty awsome at what it does, so perhaps you might forgive me if I just wait until I see something of what this unit is going to be before I get all excited like some of the fan boys around here. Once burnt, twice shy. I'll sing your praises high enough based on real information, not speculation.

Cheers

Guy
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So you are a wedding photographer?

Jim! Heard about your announcement from engadget and all I could say is HELL YEAH! You can bet Nikon, Sony, Canon all heard your announcement loud and clear. Regardless if you score a major hit or just bring out a solid camera you'll be pushing the industry towards being innovative again. I only wish there were versions of you in every industry!
 
"but all I think you need to know is that I shoot special event video and photography proffessionaly on a regular basis"

Jim showed you his - now let's see some of your wonderful "special event video" & "proffessional (sic) photography?"
 
I was just asking myself why do we always have to use pixels,I know it sounds crazy ,but is there a way to use a special sensible electronic plate like film emulsion,I mean when light thru the lens hit the plate an image is form and then converted to electrical signal to the processors, instead of getting stick to a plate full of pixels and hence limited,why can't we build a new material which can electronically and chemically be sensible thus forming an image on it's surface then interpreted by the electronics of the system..hmmmm i know i know it's crazy...but it could be something revolutionary...(please excuse my english)
 
Tom said:
Steve,

I am not disagreeing with the steepness of an $8K DSLR, I am disagreeing with the fact that they cannot be upgraded. My PC cost a bundle, but I can always throw in a new motherboard, chip, video card, RAM, Bluray, monitor, etc. I'm disagreeing with not being able to upgrade the sensor or processors when you are dropping $8K on a DSLR. Some may disagree, but that's my opinion.

I never compared an XSI to a 1D-line camera. Never would. We were talking about XSI vs 40D.

BTW, just speaking generally, for those who make a habit out of dissing Canon EF-S 350/400/450D line cameras, keep in mind that 90% of top astrophotographers around the world still rock the legendary 350D. :) Also keep in mind that this is the size and format of the Red One sensor.

I agree with you: these are exciting times! In fact, this week has been particularly exciting with all the new Canon rumors, Red DSLR killer, etc.
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Funny because I am an astrophotographer too. I also have and love my XTI. Other than firmware I don't think it's practical to upgrade the high end DSLRs. It seems the major upgrades incorporate all new mechanics as well as new sensors and electronics. I also think the latest level of pro cameras, (Canon Mk3's and Nikon's D3 and D700), they may be adequate for quite a while for any pro job. I have found on my last three bodies that wear and tear (I wore out the shutter on one of my 5Ds last year), came about the same time as new models. 2-3 years is about the life of a mechanical body if you are busy shooting.

Now if Jim starts making digital camera bodies without moving parts, then the ability to upgrade will work well. I am all for it and will be first in line for one as long as it used a Nikon or Canon lens mount - or maybe a totally universal mount like P+S is working on.

Can't wait to see what happens.
 
jim, the pool commercial is cool on the history page.
remembers me of an very old clip i did years ago on ibiza/spain, but we did not shoot arri, we did shoot dv (bugdet zero) :sad:

but quite similar in a way :wink:
 
and i wud also love taking pictures with my new Red DSMC like am doin with my DSLRs here are some of my pictures http://www.flickr.com/photos/7645949@N08/ but with a revolutionary camera,,don't want to stick Canon babystep progression...thx Jim for changing this industry..my tribute to you..long live RED
kunal2 said:
I was just asking myself why do we always have to use pixels,I know it sounds crazy ,but is there a way to use a special sensible electronic plate like film emulsion,I mean when light thru the lens hit the plate an image is form and then converted to electrical signal to the processors, instead of getting stick to a plate full of pixels and hence limited,why can't we build a new material which can electronically and chemically be sensible thus forming an image on it's surface then interpreted by the electronics of the system..hmmmm i know i know it's crazy...but it could be something revolutionary...(please excuse my english)
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I just realized how ignorant I am.
I've been reading on this forum for about a year, I met Ted at ILM in San Rafael last year during a workshop, I watched tons of posted grabs and trailers and I'm reading this thread over and over again thinking "Who the hell are these guys anyway? Red1, Wow! Scarlet, coooool, bye bye HVX! But going after Nikon, that's freaking awesome. Who can back them and believe in them and give them that much freedom? A government? This Jim is more available and passionate than any young startup creator, he answers questions faster than any boss ... when one gets an answer. What the hell are these references to Oakley? ... "
Ok well I just discovered Jim's history, so I'm even happier about what's happening because all this is unlikely to be swallowed by a big corporation and end up in a drawer like we've all seen it happening so many times in the past with technologies that are not welcome by the big sharks who like to suck up on their customers selling them the crumbs of the perfect products they already have in their safes because they make more cash that way :biggrin:
 
GuyB said:
Scarlet, sorry, no way, why would I want to shoot a concert with a camera that I have seen to date.
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I don't get this statement; do you mean that you haven't seen? The single most appealing aspect of scarlet to me is its concert videography potential... I imagine myself showing up to a gig with one pelican case, 3 cameras inside, a bunch of CF cards and bam..

it would be f'n sweet!
 
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