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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Birger Lens Mount Reservations

Chris Kenny said:
Erik, should people who reserved have gotten confirmation by now? We reserved by fax on Dec. 6. (Name on the order is my business partner's, "Pierce Varous".)
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No. Only the first few days of reservations, and a few of the 100% deposits, have been processed. A few in the later category was processed as some expressed need to process payments for tax or other reasons by year end. Please note, the last category did not get an earlier time stamp, just some slightly earler processing.
 
Thanks for the info - Don't let negativity get to you - people are very excited for your fine product and thats what causes the tension - it seems a few words go a long way to keeping it at bay.
 
Thanks, Erik! We appreciate the update, and are extremely excited about the mount.

Any word on whether EF-S lenses will work OK with the Canon mount? I"m specifically looking at the EF-S 17-55mm F2.8 IS, reviewed here:

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0602/06022113canonefs1755f28g.asp

I know L series is best, but for those of us on a budget, EF-S lenses are mighty attractive.
 
Jaime Vallés said:
Thanks, Erik! We appreciate the update, and are extremely excited about the mount.

Any word on whether EF-S lenses will work OK with the Canon mount? I"m specifically looking at the EF-S 17-55mm F2.8 IS, reviewed here:

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0602/06022113canonefs1755f28g.asp

I know L series is best, but for those of us on a budget, EF-S lenses are mighty attractive.
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It looks like an EF-S lens that Erik has on the camera. 10-22 or 17-55 I'm sure they'll work just as well as the L series lenses
 
fergus said:
It looks like an EF-S lens that Erik has on the camera. 10-22 or 17-55 I'm sure they'll work just as well as the L series lenses
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10-22 is on the camera. Problem with the 10-22 is the variable aperture, so zooming, without correcting for exposure in post is kind of out. And for this to be truly workable, it will need the, yet to be announced (so don't ask me any questions about it) zoom motor, so that the focal length information (and resulting aperture) can be provided accurately to the camera. And this also means the /i interface to the camera needs to be fully fleshed out by RED. Promising. But for now think about this lens as a variable prime. We still have some adjustments to the control loop to optimize for smooth focus with this lens. Don't go out and buy one until we bless it. It is just a touch below the "L" lenses in mechnical quality - but it does have the right kind of motor. I used this lens (among others) to collimate a camerabody today. And it tracks focus with zoom very well.

We will pick up the 17-55 next week. This lens is fast, cheap, and in a really good focal range. I expect it to be approximately the same quality as the 10-22 with the same caveats. (i.e. don't buy it yet, but a really high priority to make work)

I don't have a lot of good zooms here this week, so one of the other lenses used to check the back focus was the 28-135 IS. It tracked focus with zoom from 1.5M to infinity, but really fell out of focus in the first meter. This lens is an early generation IS, and mechanical construction sucks. So it probably is of limited interest anyway.

This camera body (first 100 serial number, not X) was about 0.25mm short. The other beta camera (city named, upgraded) required no shimming, and the back focus was spot on. I am interested to see where the next camera (aqua's) comes in next week. Our Beta mounts have been +0.00mm -0.02mm, and this is what we will measure/shim them out to at final test.

The assembly to the camera is really easy, as is dissassembly of the PL mount. If calibration of the camera's back focus ends up being needed, we will offer a shimmed solution. This is one of those religious matters, we think shims are the way to go, others think threaded mechanisms are better. Shims don't drift. If any shimming is neccessary, a good zoom lens (or two if you are anal), a tripod, a two test charts (drawn with a Sharpie if you want), and about fifteen minutes is all you will need. If this is necessary, it will only have to be done once per camera.

If anybody has a camera that they want to spare for a few days so we can get a reasonable statistical sample of back focus, so we can determine exactly where the numbers are falling out, please email me. Also, if anybody has a camera that they might want to make available for a few weeks, email me, interesting bribes might be paid.:biggrin:
 
birgerEngineer said:
We will pick up the 17-55 next week. This lens is fast, cheap, and in a really good focal range. I expect it to be approximately the same quality as the 10-22 with the same caveats. (i.e. don't buy it yet, but a really high priority to make work)
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Cool stuff. I'm assuming most people would use it as a variable prime, as opposed to zooming while recording. At least the aperture doesn't change in the 17-55. If it works well with your Canon mount, it just might become the main lens on my camera! But I'll definitely wait to hear your reports on individual lenses before buying anything.

Thanks for the info!
 
Hey Eric, don't give up on that 10-22. It is a nice option for super wide, and variable prime is all I need! (hey the superwide snap-zoom is not in fashion, anyway)

I'm waitin' with my Canons : )

I know you guys get burned on answering this, but any inkling of an idea when they might deliver?
 
birgerEngineer said:
10-22 is on the camera. Problem with the 10-22 is the variable aperture, so zooming, without correcting for exposure in post is kind of out. And for this to be truly workable, it will need the, yet to be announced (so don't ask me any questions about it) zoom motor, so that the focal length information (and resulting aperture) can be provided accurately to the camera. And this also means the /i interface to the camera needs to be fully fleshed out by RED. Promising. But for now think about this lens as a variable prime. We still have some adjustments to the control loop to optimize for smooth focus with this lens. Don't go out and buy one until we bless it. It is just a touch below the "L" lenses in mechnical quality - but it does have the right kind of motor. I used this lens (among others) to collimate a camerabody today. And it tracks focus with zoom very well.

We will pick up the 17-55 next week. This lens is fast, cheap, and in a really good focal range. I expect it to be approximately the same quality as the 10-22 with the same caveats. (i.e. don't buy it yet, but a really high priority to make work)

I don't have a lot of good zooms here this week, so one of the other lenses used to check the back focus was the 28-135 IS. It tracked focus with zoom from 1.5M to infinity, but really fell out of focus in the first meter. This lens is an early generation IS, and mechanical construction sucks. So it probably is of limited interest anyway.

This camera body (first 100 serial number, not X) was about 0.25mm short. The other beta camera (city named, upgraded) required no shimming, and the back focus was spot on. I am interested to see where the next camera (aqua's) comes in next week. Our Beta mounts have been +0.00mm -0.02mm, and this is what we will measure/shim them out to at final test.

The assembly to the camera is really easy, as is dissassembly of the PL mount. If calibration of the camera's back focus ends up being needed, we will offer a shimmed solution. This is one of those religious matters, we think shims are the way to go, others think threaded mechanisms are better. Shims don't drift. If any shimming is neccessary, a good zoom lens (or two if you are anal), a tripod, a two test charts (drawn with a Sharpie if you want), and about fifteen minutes is all you will need. If this is necessary, it will only have to be done once per camera.

If anybody has a camera that they want to spare for a few days so we can get a reasonable statistical sample of back focus, so we can determine exactly where the numbers are falling out, please email me. Also, if anybody has a camera that they might want to make available for a few weeks, email me, interesting bribes might be paid.:biggrin:
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Thanks for the input. We the Nikkorists/Nikonists hope the same care from you. Especially on the new full frame 14-24mm & 24-70mm plus the 70-200mm zooms.

Doc Holliday said:
Hey Eric, don't give up on that 10-22. It is a nice option for super wide, and variable prime is all I need!
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Of course, that 10-22mm is gold on the Canon side. Beyond being Nikkorist/Nikonist. It's not easy to figure out yet which Birger mount is the best bet. If Nikon or Canon. A part of us hope for Erik's help on this relevant choice.
 
I'm probably putting myself in the hot seat here, but I thought I'd mention this because I know a lot of you will appreciate it.

I did lens tests two days ago. Among the lenses I tested were the 16-35 and the 24-70.

I shot through them with a Brevis adapter and an HVX200. (Yes, I recorded my tests, and yes, footage will be available soon.)

I was primarily looking for breathing characteristics. The good news? Both lenses barely had any breathing. When I say barely, I mean barely.

With the 24-70, I had to look at the footage carefully to even see it at all.

If I were just watching a movie and there was a rack focus pulled through this lens, I don't think I would notice the breathing. It's that good. (At least I thought it was.)

And the 16-35 was very close to the 24-70.

I say this because if (hopefully when) the Birger comes out, and does smooth, repeatable, stepless focus pulls, the broadcast and cine lens industry may be left wondering what hit it.

Of course, that's just my opinion. I'll try to get that footage up ASAP.

-Thor
 
Thor Wixom said:
I say this because if (hopefully when) the Birger comes out, and does smooth, repeatable, stepless focus pulls, the broadcast and cine lens industry may be left wondering what hit it.
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That's how I see it as well. If (and it's a big IF) the Birger mount works as advertised, then I feel it will have a huge impact in the independent film world. The big boys in Hollywood will never give up their Zeiss and Cooke lenses, but for most of us in the trenches, this will be as big a revolution as the RED ONE itself!
 
Eric, I appreciate the update and I have full confidence that the mount design that Birger settles on will be no less than phenomenal. But I think that most people on this thread, myself included, are not asking for full specs on the final design. I'm not even asking that you charge my card until you feel ready to do so. All I want to know is DID YOU RECEIVE MY ORDER THAT SENT ON NOVEMBER 26?
 
Emanuel said:
Thanks for the input. We the Nikkorists/Nikonists hope the same care from you. Especially on the new full frame 14-24mm & 24-70mm plus the 70-200mm zooms.
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Adding the Nikon DX VR 18-200mm too!
 
Thanks for clarification, Eric. I have complete trust in your upcoming Canon mount. It is a revolution for the independents out there and gives the chance to own a couple of zooms and a set of fast primes at VERY reasonable costs! I'm curios to see the test results from the pre-beta units.

The only thing I'm a little worried about: Have you received my orders? I Emailed my orders (Octamas AG is the company name) of 2 Canon mounts on 27th November. So far neither was my credit card charged nor got I an confirmation mail. I think a lot of us would appreciate a short confirmation mail.

Cheers
 
I really like the way that Canon lens looks on the Red One with your mount!
I too would very much like to know if you received our faxed order for SMC Productions.
 
This superwide Tokina will rock indeed.
 
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