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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

RED V-Raptor [X] 8K VV

Kemalettin Sert said:
Hey Phil great write up.
Im curious what happens if you do a rolling shutter test with EH enabled? Is it still less than 1 ms?
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There is no rolling shutter on the camera with or without EH. But you do have a faster exposure time with the EH data, which is why they are doing their temporal method of processing to combat some of the potential motion blur related issues during fast movement.

The curious thing for me is there's clearly a range of motion that works very nicely with EH. I've been rendering out shots of me waving my hand around and all that at different speeds and some rather more controlled motion to put up on one of my 8K screens. For me it's about knowing exactly where and how to use.

At the top end of a well exposed image, meaning you're likely just retaining point sources like lamps, flames, maybe a hot window, the sun it is one thing. When you "rely" on it taking up say 1/3rd to 1/2 your waveform, that's when extreme care must be taken with the motion.
 
Phil Holland said:
At the top end of a well exposed image, meaning you're likely just retaining point sources like lamps, flames, maybe a hot window, the sun it is one thing. When you "rely" on it taking up say 1/3rd to 1/2 your waveform, that's when extreme care must be taken with the motion.
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Excited to try it for myself, but this is a very useful starting point for me as a way to think about it. (I'm not planning to buy the camera, but see it as an attractive rental-- which means that my advance testing would be pretty shallow.) Thank you!
 
Phil Holland said:
You need to toggle on the colors in the GIOSCOPE menu. They are disabled by default.
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Thanks. Would you know where the firmware can be found? I don't see the beta option that used to be on the Red download page. Also what is the best way to turn on and off the cameras power remotely? Like in a gimbal.
 
Remington Chase said:
Thanks. Would you know where the firmware can be found? I don't see the beta option that used to be on the Red download page. Also what is the best way to turn on and off the cameras power remotely? Like in a gimbal.
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Anything Beta, just requires you to search for Beta. GIOSCOPE is in current Raptor builds and for a while, so it should be in your VRX.

DSMC3 has a switch heavily inspired by the Jetpack for DSMC2. If you set it to on and send power to the camera, it boots up. If you pull power, it shuts off. Actually a very welcome design and hardware improvement that isn't talked about much, but it's helped a great deal on many shoots for me.
 
Phantom Track

So today I spent some time at ROE testing this new feature. I'm writing about it here, because this workflow will 100% be new to people.

How Phantom Track works in camera is when enabled, it halves your max frame rate and is recording two separate streams back to back. You get two separate R3D sequences in one RDM folder. When these are loaded into various programs, both clips are seen and they are named separately. RED's naming convention for their R3Ds uses something like X006_C001_02079U_001. That is magName_cameraAndTake_randomizedClipID_R3Dsegment. R3D's are written in 4GB chunks, which is why you have multiple segments and also why if you lose power during a take, you likely have a good chunk of the shot. In the cameraAndTake bit, the Phantom Track is identified as X instead of C. It's that simple.

Monitoring is pretty cool and I submitted about 3 feature requests on top of what we have now. You can individually monitor each track via the SDI ports and you can assign them.

This being Global Shutter, we didn't need to adjust the Sensor Sync in this case, but we did experiment a bit. Proper Virtual Production is Genlock SYNC and we did exactly that. ROE's GhostFrame tech allows for two phased signals on the wall to pushed out. Phantom Track allows for you to film both at the same time and have them from the same camera. Lots of VFX related reasons to want something like this ranging from a separate tracking sequence, pulling a clean matte, volumentric effects, relighting, compositing, etc.

Some frame grabs and smartphone grabs of the day:
phfx_RED_VRX_phantomTrack.jpg
 
Phantom Track seems pretty cool. Are those the same frames from the Phantom Track of your hand waving? Not sure how fast your hand is moving but that one inch difference is significant for moving shots assuming it would be the same for EH shots, for Phantom Track it does not matter.
 

RED V-RAPTOR [X]: Global Shutter meets 8K VistaVision (fullframe)​



bY TELTEC moving.picture.experts



In German Unfortunately


 
The 24-105 2.8 isn’t good on the x raptor or x Komodo because all the correction is done by canon camera software only on canon cameras? If so, that’s a real bummer.
 
Kemalettin,


I've been checking for the exact same thing everyday. They will probably post it when I'm not looking for it.
 
I think CineD does give better tests than many others out there but their conclusions (even with IMATEST software) are still open to interpretation.

I sometimes feel like IMATEST can be somewhat conservative and CineD's decision to toss aside a stop in measured highlights from the previous V-Raptor test was a little questionable.

I understand their reasoning (they felt the last stop "lacks all color information") but that judgement underlines the need to have your own standards as some might evaluate what a usable stop is based on perceived detail (however technically incomplete the color channels might be) rather than what the testing software measures in the color channels.
For example, differences in luminance levels is still a factor in rendering highlight detail.


On that note- the 1st image published during the V-Raptor X announcements was a XLYA 21 test which I imagine was a preemptive move by RED given the perception by some that they "overrate" their cameras.

The idea of "paycheck" stops"vs "gravy" stops is a good approach though even that evaluation can vary.
ymcinema.com

Cinema Cameras Dynamic Range Comparison: “Paycheck Stops" vs.“Gravy Stops" - Y.M.Cinema Magazine

DR (Dynamic Range) is one of the most crucial factors regarding image quality and capabilities of cinema cameras. High DR indicates high sensor’ technology and the camera’s abilities. However, there is no secret that cinema cameras manufacturers are taking advantages by showing the “Gravy Stops”...
ymcinema.com ymcinema.com

That's the beauty of filmmaking (and parts of life) as it can be as much scientific as it is subjective.

Also look forward to what Phil Holland, CVP, and others might show.

Brian Timmons
BRITIM/MEDIA
 
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Mike P. said:
So what's stopping RED from allowing the new blending algorithm/option with legacy HDRX streams (and hence have some of, if not all, the benefits of the new Highlight Extension)? Seems they're more similar than originally guesstimated and if the blending is done outside the camera anyway, there is no reason it shouldn't work.... Worst case, you'd have to limit your HDRX bracket to +3 on DSMC1/2, but most don't go beyond that anyway because of the motion artefacts.



Are you sure you weren't exposing HDRX wrong; your A-track should be set to a normal/regular exposure based on the scene/ISO/etc (using false colour or gioscope or a light meter) while the X-track captures 1~to~6 extra highlight stops as protection beyond that base exposure. I've never noticed any additional noise when using Simple Blend (magic motion stopped working in IPP2, likely because of a gamma mis-match as it wasn't designed for Log3G10, but that's clearly been fixed with Highlight Extension)...
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I think its opposite if I remember correctly. Your A track is your long exposure. To make use of HDRx you need to to have overexposure in the A track then you got the x track with a fraction of the A track exposure to recover highlights / extend the range.
 
Brian Timmons said:
I think CineD does give better tests than many others out there but their conclusions (even with IMATEST software) are still open to interpretation.
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Well, what you say is sortof true, but misses the larger point. Which is that their tests are STANDARD. They are one entity, doing ALL the tests the same way. Sure, RED can post an image of a Xyla chart, but they aren't telling us what the SNR is, or what other protocol they may have used. For me, the CineD tests are invaluable, as they are all the same. I don't have to rely on one manufacturer saying "X number of stops" against another manufacturer's "Y number of stops." That's the whole point ... it's a standard.

Regarding highlight recovery, I think they covered it very thoroughly, and accurately. Going from being a non-RED owner to a RED owner, I found that everything they published was true, and most importantly, true relative to how they had evaluated my previous camera.

Again, that's the whole ballgame ... a STANDARD test. Yes, these are creative tools, but they exist in the physical world and have definable physical traits.
 
Hi everybody, just got my hands on the new Raptor X and played around with the EH Option.

Maybe I miss something, but when I am using RED Cine X (Beta Version 62) I could switch the EH Option ON/OFF, but the histogram nearly changed like nothing to sometimes very minimal. When I toggle the EH Option in camera I could see a way more visible change in the histogram.

And when I playback any kind of Raptor X Clips via RED Cine X, all clips seems to be double playback speed. (2x faster) .

When I playback files filmed with the Raptor X ( without EH option recorded, because they doesn't work at all for now ) in Davinci Resolve the are playing back at normal speed.

Any idea somebody !?
 
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