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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Red Scarlet vs. BMC fightclub!

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Matt Ryan said:
I'm still confused why they are comparing the Scarlet to the BMC...for price range and features shouldnt the BMC be compared with say a 5D Mark III? More in the same price range and target market. This format of "comparison" is ridiculous because it's just about cheapest out of the box... Apparently both cameras are "heavy," (i guess compared to a dslr?) and both can adapt to some of your old dslr kit. Ridiculous format... One is $3,000, the other $9,000...theres no way the Scarlet will ever win when it's about being the cheapest to get up and running...


I'm also 100% certain Josh has never shot on any of these cameras...his comments speak to his lack of hands on experience since he only talks tech specs or other peoples work.
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Because BMC produces high grade digital cinema image. It's "3K for 3K$" and so on... I'm sure you are familiar with the last one.

It's not about cheapest out of the box. It never was. It's about the cheapest setup to get properly working unit for digital cinema that provides outstanding image quality.

There's a reason why Jarred started bmcuser.com and why he bought the first BMC out from the person that got it first in the forums. By the way, he paid a lot more than the retail price. That's how bad he wanted it.
 
Josh Snyder said:
I'm on bmcuser with username Josh. You can go and look at my posts there too. You might even find some posts where I praise EPIC. Though you will ignore those like you do here.
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High praise:

Josh said:
RED is like religion and if you don't agree with them the holy God Jim Jannard will swing the ban hammer and send you to eternal flames of Digital Cinema Hell™.

Digital Cinema Hell™ and all other trademarks, service marks, trade names logos, and product names of RED used on this site are trademarks or registered trademarks of Red.com, Inc. in the USA and other countries.
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http://bmcuser.com/showthread.php?2236-Europe-Shipments&p=41791#post41791

Finished rendering. Back to work.
 
Josh Snyder said:
There's a reason why Jarred started bmcuser.com and why he bought the first BMC out from the person that got it first in the forums.
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Can I ask why he did want it? I'm not in the loop? I know the CEO of Aston Martin (ok, General Motors) drives a Porsche. But not because it's better - just different. Having held a BMCC it's truly a thing of beauty and design. Whether it gets anywhere is a different matter - but then I've always been a Lotus man, and hence the analogy! (grin)

But seriously, had Jarred published his game plan??

SK
 
@ Martin

Can you pass me some popcorn please. Lol

I agree with Matt , why are we comparing Scarlet with BMC ?

The BMC is great camera but it aint no Scarlet . So what are we comparing sensor, file format, data rate or price? Because where I sit Scarlet looses out in 1 comparison only.
 
Brandon J.F. said:
High praise:



http://bmcuser.com/showthread.php?2236-Europe-Shipments&p=41791#post41791

Finished rendering. Back to work.
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Nice job once again not quoting the posts where I praise EPIC. I guess it's my job to provide the message that was posted before that one:

nick I agree. But for some films the cleaner and sharper image that EPIC produces is better choise. For example EPIC was great choise for the newest Underworld and Prometheus. I can't really say that there is better camera between the two (Alexa and EPIC). It's just that one works better for one film and the other one works better for another film.

I have to say that R1 in Finchers (and few others) productions do look really "filmlike". Social Network and The Girl With A Dragon Tattoo both looked great and didn't scream digital at all.
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Simon Knight said:
Can I ask why he did want it? I'm not in the loop? I know the CEO of Aston Martin (ok, General Motors) drives a Porsche. But not because it's better - just different. Having held a BMCC it's truly a thing of beauty and design. Whether it gets anywhere is a different matter - but then I've always been a Lotus man, and hence the analogy! (grin)

But seriously, had Jarred published his game plan??

SK
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Does the CEO of Aston Martin own and post on Porsche forum?

Do you really think Jarred bought the BMC for that kind of extra money just so he can start shooting with it asap? Do you really think RED team hasn't inspected every little component and detail inside the BMC?

Mike Garrick said:
@ Martin

Can you pass me some popcorn please. Lol

I agree with Matt , why are we comparing Scarlet with BMC ?

The BMC is great camera but it aint no Scarlet . So what are we comparing sensor, file format, data rate or price? Because where I sit Scarlet looses out in 1 comparison only.
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Image quality. You know, the most important thing in camera?

Though there are many things equal, Scarlet looses on weight and SSD options.
 
Eric Santiago said:
I have to admit that over the weeks (after reading his posts), he is getting better at his posts.

If you read his earlier work, he almost comes across as fake and simple minded (not being an ass just stating how your posts read to me).

Of late, his posts are almost very confident and concise almost too professional sounding (IMHO).

I am going to say this again as I've stated before...are we being punked?

Is this guy a professional FUD forum person that gets paid to do this?

I am not kidding.

Ive been hanging at BMCUser and BMD forum since the start of the BMCC craze and I honestly have not seen this guys name (as Ive experienced it here at REDUSER).

Josh fess up, you are a FUD bot right?

No honestly!!
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I'm sorry but this post made me laugh. So there's a conspiracy theory now? What's up with all the BMC hating anyways? I have to admit, reading some of the comments by "professionals" was really shocking. Remember that the president of RED went out of his way to own one so relax, it's just camera. There's no conspiracy here.

Can't afford an Epic now, buy a Scarlet. Can't afford a Scarlet now, buy a BMC.
 
Josh, maybe Jarred tries to buy all the BMC's to use them for the dragon upgrade. The conspiracy plot thickens....
 
Or maybe red has perfected time travel and sent the BMC back to 2004 so Jim and his crew can reverse engineer it to create the red one, and thus any and all good projects shot on reds cameras should not give credit to them but BMC... let's not even begin to assume that some of the look has to do with the art direction framing choices makeup costumes or grading that's just pure nonsense everyone knows it all comes down to what camera you shoot, and if you make the wrong choice you will forever be shunned from the production world.

ah well my daily renders are done I'm off to get drunk... play nice!
 
Stephen Matthews said:
How about this, no one comment on the BMC anymore, and hopefully troll Josh will fade away like distant memory, or even loose the troll and grow to be a welcomed contributor to this forum. The main issue seems to be having a discussion that does not focus on inane talking points and moot issues, all the while ignoring and misunderstanding the real issues that are being brought up. Not to mention the repetition of other peoples words that are not based in experience but in bile and hatred(from their own misteps) directed towards red for some unknown reason that can not possibly justify the onslaught. The only reason he is here now was one over the top comment about BMC so perhaps we shall have to be the ones who guard our words and play nice, as it seems he does not know how or refuses too.

Josh I wish you all the best, good luck in your future endeavors, and for the love of everything in this world listen to those who came before you double check everything anyone say's see with your own eye's through your own footage before you lambast something, and it would be better if you never lambasted anything. The content creation business is vast and wide with many different needs and wants, the differences you describe between scarlet and others only benefits us, CHOICES, you like the BMC great, you like the fs700 great, you liek your HVX/DVX wonderful, now go out and work practice your craft. Pitting camera's against each other is for rental houses and camera companies I pick my camera then I want to learn it's limits and it's trick's and want to discuss it on a forum away from pointless discussions about what camera to purchase when people don't understand their needs from their wants or are willing to have a rational discussion. we can all have our perfect camera for now so how about just respecting that and staying on BMCuser if you hate red so much and try not to jump each reduser who say's something bad about BMC, as I'm certain you or the bmc community would not appreciate redusers jumping down their throats any time someone even mentioned red in a slightly bad light... which happens a lot over there but FUD is to be expected from those who close their minds on any board.

Remember fads come and go but talent always remains, red was the fad once and the backlash created the likes of you, I'm scared to think of the self entitlement and rudeness that will result from this next backlash from people expecting to get their miracle camera.

What is wrong with people, why the need to be some combative and hateful, so uncivil, resorting to ad hominem and FUD. This business is all about working with people, people you might not like or get along with or be very different from, you are going to have to learn to interact with people better or else you will be in big trouble in life in general as well.

Have a nice day, I understand your passion, I don't understand your approach. it's your life to screw up not mine so I understand if you tell me to f off. I'd say take a breath close the computer and grab whatever camera you have at your disposal be it cell phone or alexa and go out and shoot something, put together a short, and then remember we are all in this together for the same reason, we love making beautiful moving images and luckily for us there is a very wide definition of what people consider a beautiful moving image.

Have a happy and prosperous new year
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I haven't ignored anything. I have replied to every comment and arguement with valid points and have seen most ignoring the thread after that. Go figure.

I don't hate RED or any other manufacturer. I don't hate any camera model either. But a lot of people here seems to. I like EPIC a lot, I like BMC a lot, I like Alexa, Gopro, 5D, Phantom you name it. I even like Scarlet. I just happen to think that it's not the best deal to get for digital cinema at the moment.

You seem to have difficulties to see that every arguement is started by ignorant RED fanatic who starts calling camera made by someone else (in this case BMC) something only soccer moms would use or similar. The hatred here towards other cameras is furious. It has always been and there are big names in the business who have said publicly that RED is like religion. "Scientology crazy" was how Bloom described RED community. How can you too be so blind towards the ones who furiously bash everything not RED in here?

It really looks like your post is pointed for the wole RED community and not me.

I have passion for truth. No, I won tell you to f off and I haven't told anyone to but many have told me to. and I'm the bad guy?

I've got pm's (yes more than one) from people who agree with me, but it seems that most are afraid to post their opinions publicly. Afraid to post their opinions in a public forum. Only at reduser.com.
 
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Yes SSDs are costly but have u costed a 400ft role of Film of either 35mm or 16mm plus processing plus digital transfer ? And it's a one way process. Shoot 6.1 on 64 ssd gives you about 30mins. Hence shoot twice on a ssd is cheaper that film . Shoot 4 times on the same Ssd is even cheaper. Shoot 20 times on a Ssd price is now down to $40 or so per half hour . How much cheaper do you want to go?

& yes Scarlet weight compared to HDSLR is a lot more, but have you felt the weight of cine Zoom? Epic/scarlet weight by industry standards is pretty light on ...BMC also weights in similar to the above , so where do you go from there?
 
Sinh Tran said:
I'm sorry but this post made me laugh. So there's a conspiracy theory now? What's up with all the BMC hating anyways? I have to admit, reading some of the comments by "professionals" was really shocking. Remember that the president of RED went out of his way to own one so relax, it's just camera. There's no conspiracy here.

Can't afford an Epic now, buy a Scarlet. Can't afford a Scarlet now, buy a BMC.
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No hating here Sinh.

Love the 2.5K RAW frames I've seen in the past and present.

Great price great company if you take away the drama of the release.

Only hating the noise some make around here.

Lacking contribution just like my reply now.
 
Mike Garrick said:
Yes SSDs are costly but have u costed a 400ft role of Film of either 35mm or 16mm plus processing plus digital transfer ? And it's a one way process. Shoot 6.1 on 64 ssd gives you about 30mins. Hence shoot twice on a ssd is cheaper that film . Shoot 4 times on the same Ssd is even cheaper. Shoot 20 times on a Ssd price is now down to $40 or so per half hour . How much cheaper do you want to go?

& yes Scarlet weight compared to HDSLR is a lot more, but have you felt the weight of cine Zoom? Epic/scarlet weight by industry standards is pretty light on ...BMC also weights in similar to the above , so where do you go from there?
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Obviously SSD's are superior to film. SSD prices were just one of the things where BMC has the upper hand.

Scarlet with Canon mount, side SSD, side handle and Redvolt weighs twice as much as BMC. One of the biggest praises EPIC and Scarlet have gotten is the low weight. Now when something lighter came up that's suddenly too light. EPIC and Scarlet just happen to weight exactly the correct ammount.
 
Josh Snyder said:
I haven't ignored anything. I have replied to every comment and arguement with valid points and have seen most ignoring the thread after that. Go figure.

I don't hate RED or any other manufacturer. I don't hate any camera model either. But a lot of people here seems to. I like EPIC a lot, I like BMC a lot, I like Alexa, Gopro, 5D, Phantom you name it. I even like Scarlet. I just happen to think that it's not the best deal to get for digital cinema at the moment.

You seem to have difficulties to see that every arguement is started by ignorant RED fanatic who starts calling camera made by someone else (in this case BMC) something only soccer moms would use or similar. The hatred here towards other cameras is furious. It has always been and there are big names in the business who have said publicly that RED is like religion. "Scientology crazy" was how Bloom described RED community. How can you too be so blind towards the ones who furiously bash everything not RED in here?

It really looks like your post is pointed for the wole RED community and not me.

I have passion for truth. No, I won tell you to f off and I haven't told anyone to but many have told me to. and I'm the bad guy?

I've got pm's (yes more than one) from people who agree with me, but it seems that most are afraid to post their opinions publicly. Afraid to post their opinions in a public forum. Only at reduser.com.
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he pulls me back in... Josh I'm not defending the misactions of some people here but to be honest it's to be expected here this is their forum, what is not expected is other camera fanboyisim. As I stated in all other camera forums in our own little corners we trash talk it happens, some rant and rave, it's all in how you react to them, and you have reacted in kind, making things much worse.

I wish people could be more rational and balanced everywhere on every subject but that is not going to happen, let alone when thousands of dollars are tied up. So how about we accept the ranters and ravers for what they are and move on. yes you are right the post is more for the whole community and not just red users because as it seems you are not willing to play nice or even reply to my PM as it seems you only care to make a public display. SO you do not address any real counterpoints people bring up and all you do is continue to harp on the same very subjective conclusions you have come too... I'm sorry but you have lost me and many others here declaring, I'm stating facts, and that you are the one making the points no one would address, no matter how much you type it, does not make it true.

Your argument/discussion would be much more acceptable if you did not resort to hyperbole and dealing with the lowest common denominator. If all these haters are so wild and out there why even address their points why stoop to their level if not to only become like them or potentially worse as you have most likely now spawned others to take up a campaign against BMC just despite you.

It's a shame such wonderful camera's such passionate young people, these communities should be tied at the hip sharing with each other supporting each other but no it has to be yet another us and them scenario.... I'm tired of it. You can turn anything into an argument or a negative if you are so inclined, but why, isn't a fruitful healthy exchange with respect and understanding much more useful to all parties?

once again all the best, no hard feelings, now back to my beer!
 
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