Will RED offer new SENSORS for EPIC-X camera BODIES in the future?

[Martin Stevens]

Will RED offer new SENSORS for my EPIC-X camera BODY in the future?

I ask because I already upgraded my EPIC-X camera BODY to have the DRAGON sensor in it, but want
to know if in the future NEW and BETTER sensors from RED will be offered by RED to go into my EPIC-X camera BODY?

I am not looking to know about upgrading my EPIC-X camera BODY to another more advanced body like the WEAPON.

ALSO..... if I upgrade to a WEAPON MAGNESIUM Camera BODY, will RED offer new S35 size (not VistaVision) SENSORS
that are better than DRAGON for the WEAPON MAGNESIUM Camera BODY in the future?

It would be nice to know this info now, because I'm not sure I would pay to upgrade to a WEAPON Magnesium body
if it is only the WEAPON Carbon Fiber BODY that will have new sensor upgrade options.

 

[Andy White]

There's a debate going on here about a Dragon to Weapon body/tech move ('lite version) http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?130699-Observations/page14

My view is the Epic/Dragon form factor is now EOL. How long RED keep the Epic/Dragon body, it's hard to say... but (in my opinion) there'll be zero chance of any new sensor inside the old body, as all RED tech will be based on the new components of the Weapon.

My hope for Weapon was a move to a new body (with more integrated peripherals) - not Prores etc. It seems that 'might' happen (fingers crossed) ad this would be a way for RED to get us all over to the Weapon eco system and body... without the expense of everyone going full-on Weapon.

This way, most will have new Weapon bodies - and we'll all be able to upgrade (or not) to new sensors/configurations during the Weapon lifespan (from experience that'll be 3-5 years, I'd presume).

 

[Tyler Dreher]

There's a debate going on here about a Dragon to Weapon body/tech move ('lite version) http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?130699-Observations/page14

My view is the Epic/Dragon form factor is now EOL. How long RED keep the Epic/Dragon body, it's hard to say... but (in my opinion) there'll be zero chance of any new sensor inside the old body, as all RED tech will be based on the new components of the Weapon.

My hope for Weapon was a move to a new body (with more integrated peripherals) - not Prores etc. It seems that 'might' happen (fingers crossed) ad this would be a way for RED to get us all over to the Weapon eco system and body... without the expense of everyone going full-on Weapon.

This way, most will have new Weapon bodies - and we'll all be able to upgrade (or not) to new sensors/configurations during the Weapon lifespan (from experience that'll be 3-5 years, I'd presume).

Wrong. Jarred has said the dragon will be able to get the new sensor it will just be more expensive as it will require additional electronics.

 

[Martin Stevens]

Wrong. Jarred has said the dragon will be able to get the new sensor it will just be more expensive as it will require additional electronics.

The DRAGON is not a camera body.

 

[Josef Gatti]

It's a bit of a weird one, as now we have to think of RED as a 3 camera lineup (1. Weapon 2. Epic 3. Scarlet). So it doesn't make too much sense to only continue developing the top tier line of their camera systems. Time will tell, however Jarred mentioned that "all dragons" will be able to continue upgrading in the future. I believe this is what Tyler was referring to.

Problem with a few of your questions is, they're at least a year or so away from actually being able to be answered. I wouldn't stress, RED will not abandon Epic and Scarlet Dragon owners, I'm 100% sure of that.

 

[Martin Stevens]

It's a bit of a weird one, as now we have to think of RED as a 3 camera lineup (1. Weapon 2. Epic 3. Scarlet). So it doesn't make too much sense to only continue developing the top tier line of their camera systems. Time will tell, however Jarred mentioned that "all dragons" will be able to continue upgrading in the future. I believe this is what Tyler was referring to.

Problem with a few of your questions is, they're at least a year or so away from actually being able to be answered. I wouldn't stress, RED will not abandon Epic and Scarlet Dragon owners, I'm 100% sure of that.

I'm trying to have clarified "Jarred mentioned that "all dragons" will be able to continue upgrading in the future", as this could simply mean that the upgrade is from one camera body to another camera body. I really want to know about Sensors going into camera bodies as an upgrade path.

 

[Daniel Reed]

I'm pretty sure red follows a tick tock method, that is sensor, body, sensor, body

I am under the impression no new hardware tech will be introduced to accomidate changes inside the epic casing

 

[Josef Gatti]

Here is the information I've spent 10 mins digging up. I response to the question posed by Peter:

Jarred - since you are in the answering mood ;o) - can you confirm that all three cameras (Scarlet, Epic and Weapon Dragons) by being part of the same current sensor family - will be eligible to upgrade to the next sensor technology beyond Dragon in one way or another?

Thank you...

Jarred replied this:

Yes I am... sorry had to be in the booth today... ready to answer away

And yes.... All Dragons will be able to advance to the next round.

This is as good of an answer as you're going to get when we are so far away from the next sensor.

 

[Phil Holland]

Will RED offer new SENSORS for my EPIC-X camera BODY in the future?

I ask because I already upgraded my EPIC-X camera BODY to have the DRAGON sensor in it, but want
to know if in the future NEW and BETTER sensors from RED will be offered by RED to go into my EPIC-X camera BODY?

I am not looking to know about upgrading my EPIC-X camera BODY to another more advanced body like the WEAPON.

ALSO..... if I upgrade to a WEAPON MAGNESIUM Camera BODY, will RED offer new S35 size (not VistaVision) SENSORS
that are better than DRAGON for the WEAPON MAGNESIUM Camera BODY in the future?

It would be nice to know this info now, because I'm not sure I would pay to upgrade to a WEAPON Magnesium body
if it is only the WEAPON Carbon Fiber BODY that will have new sensor upgrade options.

It's a tricky thing Martin. And here's how I look at it without having a completely clear crystal ball into the future.

The RED DSMC V1 style of body that Epic and Scarlet utilized allowed for Mysterium-X and all it's functions.

The Dragon Sensor upgrade available for that same style of DSMC V1 body wasn't just a simple sensor drop in solution. It did require new hardware just to support the new tech found there.

The Weapon body is what I'm calling DSMC V2, though I'm sure that's not officially happening. It is significantly more powerful than the previous "brains" under the hood. For now it's using the Dragon Sensor and paving the road for the Dragon 8K Sensor upgrade in Weapon Carbon Fiber bodies.

1-3 years down the line when we get a new sensor there will be new technology. There are some who really, really what higher frame rates. There's some who just want the new sensor tech. There's going to be new processing power needed for those future paths and I suspect Weapon's "innards" are part of that equation if high speed is in our future.

However, the real problem is that it's too early to tell. Dragon has long lasting legs and RED will be getting more out of it with Weapon.

This is without even considering or talking about modules and the future of various other features in the camera.

I have a suspicion that all Weapon bodies will support the new sensor tech whenever it become available, but it's not clear if the "OG" DSMC guts can even support it because we don't know a thing about it or when it will land.

But it sounds like "all Dragons" can go to the next round, which we'll have to see exactly what that means when the time comes.

 

[Martin Stevens]

Thanks Phil.

Right now I dream that someone official from Red, like my favorite Jarred, will respond and makes things crystal ball clear.

 

[Phil Holland]

Thanks Phil.

Right now I dream that someone official from Red, like my favorite Jarred, will respond and makes things crystal ball clear.

I'm certain that if things were known today about exactly what's happening 1-3 years from now, Jarred would chime in. I think what I'm saying is Weapon is happening and is the future body planned. New technology is always under development, but predicting and releasing information that might not be "bolted down" yet would be tricky.

 

[Jarred Land]

Yes ALL Dragons will be eligible to move to the next sensor family in one way or another as the question was asked just like there always has been.

That is why it was important for everyone to get to Dragon that wanted to carry along forward to Weapon and beyond.

This obviously does not mean that the next sensor will fit in an Epic or Scarlet body though like some people are implying... that is taking the question and answer out of context, and the electronics obviously would need to be upgraded for a new sensor, but there will be an upgrade path regardless, no matter where you are in the Dragon family. Considering that most likely that will be in the Weapon form factor, it obviously will be most affordable to be on Weapon when that time comes.

 

[Phil Holland]

Yes ALL Dragons will be eligible to move to the next sensor family in one way or another as the question was asked just like there always has been.

That is why it was important for everyone to get to Dragon that wanted to carry along forward to Weapon and beyond.

This obviously does not mean that the next sensor will fit in an Epic or Scarlet body though like some people are implying... that is taking the question and answer out of context, and the electronics obviously would need to be upgraded for a new sensor, but there will be an upgrade path regardless, no matter where you are in the Dragon family. Considering that most likely that will be in the Weapon form factor, it obviously will be most affordable to be on Weapon when that time comes.

FYI in a conversation with somebody from "another camera company" on the show floor they stated that the Dragon sensor was the best sensor currently on the market. Nice tip of the hat there I'd say!

 

[Martin Stevens]

Thanks Jarred and Phil, and, oh, bye the way, Red's new state-of-the-art WEAPON System is beyond the infinite,
and agreeably the new "Gold Standard" in Digital Cinema Camera systems....!!!

Did I tell you I was impressed by it? Well, hell yes!

 

[Milan S.]

This obviously does not mean that the next sensor will fit in an Epic or Scarlet body though like some people are implying... that is taking the question and answer out of context, and the electronics obviously would need to be upgraded for a new sensor, but there will be an upgrade path regardless, no matter where you are in the Dragon family. Considering that most likely that will be in the Weapon form factor, it obviously will be most affordable to be on Weapon when that time comes.

Thank you for clarifying that Jarred.

The only way to stay on the upgrade path is to upgrade to Weapon, hopefully the rumors can stop now.