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What is the save and highest target sensor temp of Epic-W Helium 8K?

R

Robert Berger

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What is the save and highest target sensor temp of Epic-W Helium 8K? I have sometimes long interviews and with the target temp on 38 the fan kicks in very fast. With my Dragon it's sensor temp was 48/65 Can i calibreet the Helium also on sensor target temp 48 or higher without damage anything and get a low speed of the fans? Best Robert
 
Giles Harvey said:
i've just been calibrating at 37 degrees (adaptive)
Click to expand...
Ye, thats default, but when you live in Afrika, i can imagine thats far to low, your surroundig tempeture is already 40 degrees celsius. So sombody from Australia or Afrika knows the answer or someone from Red ?
 
Stacey Spears said:
Robert, was your Dragon EPIC or Weapon? I ask because they changed to sensor temp on Weapon for both Dragon and Helium. e.g. I think Dragon default is 40 for sensor temp on Weapon vs. 65 core on EPIC. Sensor temp makes more sense.
Click to expand...
Hi Stacey, i hat the Epic-Dragon on 47 sensor and 65 core temp. My question is can i put the target temp on my Epic-W 8K Helium the same, so with a interview you the fans will kick in later in a low speed? The manual says, you can change the target temp, but then you have to do a new sensor calibration. No problem, but how hi can i go witch is still save for sensor and camerabody?
 
I tested this a few months ago 44 is the cleanest temp and since then I've only shot at 44 & adaptive fan set for 44 too.

FYI:
There's barely any difference between Auto (55mins) calibrate and Manual (5mins) calibration so if you're in a rush Manual is very good to rely on.

HNY too :)

Stu.
 
Stuart Graham said:
I tested this a few months ago 44 is the cleanest temp and since then I've only shot at 44 & adaptive fan set for 44 too.

FYI:
There's barely any difference between Auto (55mins) calibrate and Manual (5mins) calibration so if you're in a rush Manual is very good to rely on.

HNY too :)

Stu.
Click to expand...

Thank you Stu, some one else on a higher temp, like 48 degres celsius?
 
I had wondered about setting to a higher temp as well. I was shooting a documentary in Florida last month with lots of long interviews. The camera would heat up pretty quick and the fans would spin up to 75% or so (according to fool control), which is quite loud. It seems like everybody else has figured out how to make nearly silent cameras, so why can't RED figure it out as well? I'd happily take a brain that is 25% larger if it would accommodate a heatsink and fans to keep it as silent as an Alexa Mini. But as it stands, 38 degrees and the current design does not work for long takes.
 
Kyle Wright said:
I had wondered about setting to a higher temp as well. I was shooting a documentary in Florida last month with lots of long interviews. The camera would heat up pretty quick and the fans would spin up to 75% or so (according to fool control), which is quite loud. It seems like everybody else has figured out how to make nearly silent cameras, so why can't RED figure it out as well? I'd happily take a brain that is 25% larger if it would accommodate a heatsink and fans to keep it as silent as an Alexa Mini. But as it stands, 38 degrees and the current design does not work for long takes.
Click to expand...

hi Kyle, i have ask by mail to Red if the camera sensor tempeture could be set higher like 48 decrees without damaging the camera, i have not had a answer yet. When i have i let everybody know. The Epic-W is way to loud now!
 
Stuart Graham said:
I tested this a few months ago 44 is the cleanest temp and since then I've only shot at 44 & adaptive fan set for 44 too.

FYI:
There's barely any difference between Auto (55mins) calibrate and Manual (5mins) calibration so if you're in a rush Manual is very good to rely on.

HNY too :)

Stu.
Click to expand...

Hi Stu, i had contact with Red UK and they advice that 44 celsius is ok, but don't go higher. So thank you Stu !
 
Tom Gleeson said:
That's good information but can you specify if this advice from Red was for a Dragon or Helium Sensor ?
Click to expand...

Helium.

RED EUROPE were gonna add this to a firmware upgrade as we did the tests with RED EUROPE Cc'd.

Higher or lower temp's can be used but there's no guarantee that the 'noise' these 'off temp calibrations' creates is repeatable.
It's often a random noise & often in one line & not all over the sensor all of the time...to be clear though this extra noise is really only visible in dark blacks & if you push the ISO higher to 'see' into the blacks.
A shot of mainly mid tones it'd hardly be noticeable IMO.
A moody scene it'd show up in mid tones & shadows too.

Oddly enough the OLPF affected our Calibrations even although we shot / did them with a port cap on! It was only a slight difference but noticeable.

So far I've shot from 5 degrees C to 40C & the Helium has been awesome at 44...this weekend it'll be a -20C shoot in Northern China so a sensor temp of 44 is gonna be a challenge for sure!

My very best results were:

Got camera to 44.
Port cap in.
Mains or floor battery.
Auto Calibrate (but there wasn't much in it between Auto or Manual).
Same OLPF I intended to do the scene with.
Set the same shutter Angle as I intended to shoot with.

How I tested it?
loaded R3D into RCX, took ISO to 12800 & then took FLUT up to the max too....compared all the different temps doing this & the cleanest was 44 by quite a bit.

Sure doing this it way was as noisy as hell for a 100% black shot, but this way, by moving the sliders in RCX you see how the noise floor comes in & how even it is.

I hope this helps.

S
 
It might be time to go back to the Red One "Ice Bag" approach:

red_ice1.jpg


1281249517.jpg
 
Tom Gleeson said:
That's good information but can you specify if this advice from Red was for a Dragon or Helium Sensor ?
Click to expand...

Hi Tom, its only about the Helium sensor!
 
Stuart Graham said:
Helium.

RED EUROPE were gonna add this to a firmware upgrade as we did the tests with RED EUROPE Cc'd.

Higher or lower temp's can be used but there's no guarantee that the 'noise' these 'off temp calibrations' creates is repeatable.
It's often a random noise & often in one line & not all over the sensor all of the time...to be clear though this extra noise is really only visible in dark blacks & if you push the ISO higher to 'see' into the blacks.
A shot of mainly mid tones it'd hardly be noticeable IMO.
A moody scene it'd show up in mid tones & shadows too.

Oddly enough the OLPF affected our Calibrations even although we shot / did them with a port cap on! It was only a slight difference but noticeable.

So far I've shot from 5 degrees C to 40C & the Helium has been awesome at 44...this weekend it'll be a -20C shoot in Northern China so a sensor temp of 44 is gonna be a challenge for sure!

My very best results were:

Got camera to 44.
Port cap in.
Mains or floor battery.
Auto Calibrate (but there wasn't much in it between Auto or Manual).
Same OLPF I intended to do the scene with.
Set the same shutter Angle as I intended to shoot with.

How I tested it?
loaded R3D into RCX, took ISO to 12800 & then took FLUT up to the max too....compared all the different temps doing this & the cleanest was 44 by quite a bit.

Sure doing this it way was as noisy as hell for a 100% black shot, but this way, by moving the sliders in RCX you see how the noise floor comes in & how even it is.

I hope this helps.

S
Click to expand...
THank you Stu.
 
Kyle Wright said:
I had wondered about setting to a higher temp as well. I was shooting a documentary in Florida last month with lots of long interviews. The camera would heat up pretty quick and the fans would spin up to 75% or so (according to fool control), which is quite loud. It seems like everybody else has figured out how to make nearly silent cameras, so why can't RED figure it out as well? I'd happily take a brain that is 25% larger if it would accommodate a heatsink and fans to keep it as silent as an Alexa Mini. But as it stands, 38 degrees and the current design does not work for long takes.
Click to expand...

Hi Kyle, good news from Red Support US: Under your fan control settings the max Target Temperature you can set is 48 degrees celsius. The camera automatically regulates the temperatures and will automatically power down if it gets too hot to avoid any damage. So 47 degrees would also be save as a target Temperature :). So as silent as a Alexa Mini. I already tested 44 decrees in a 20 degrees surroundigs and it was already quit, foolcontrol said 46 % on both fans!
So NO ICE NEEDED !!!! :)
 
Same test today, with sensor target temp on 46 degrees and the core temperature is 70 degrees. fan speeds is 43/43. Very low fan noise :)
temp 46/70 fan 43/43 to see this on foolcontrol (i love this app !!)
 
I always shot two steps down from the max temp from Epic-x to Dragon Weapon and never had an hardware failure.
Always adaptive mode as it gives you long takes capability AND constant fan speed level (and noise foot print) wich is important during rehearsal and shooting. Having a loud camera during prep/rehearsal is unacceptable.

Pat
 
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