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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

The Gentleman's Underwater Bubble Blower Thread

Cheers Rudi,
It's still Mark but I gave up trying to resolve the access issue to the forums after three months of being ignored by the site Admins, sheesh, and to think I was one of the first batch of people to put their cash down back in 2006.

Thanks for the feedback on the piece, I will look at the audio issues you mentioned. I didn;t notice it too much on the master so wondering if the coding from Vimeo may have amplified it during the web compression etc. Who knows, will check it out, cheers.

@Paul thanks mate, I guess the strongest support will be to spread the word. I'll let you know once the project goes out on Indiegogo.

Thanks,
Mark.
 
(: will do my best... don't have much of a following myself, but perhaps i can get it in front of anybody who does. more likely, someone will see it somewhere from somebody sharing it and hopefully that'll do the trick. good luck!
 
Shit makes me sad.

Marc Thorpe said:
Hey folks, have been silent a looooong time. Getting into fatherhood, off shooting in the jungles of Sumatra and now just finished editing a Pilot for a personal project. This is the first sharing of said pilot given that there are a shed load of guys that I respect here. It would be great to get any feedback on this as it deals with the bane of our chosen working environment, the depletion of the enigmatic species such as sharks and Manta rays. All shot on the islands of Bali and Lombok over the past couple of months. The music was composed and created by Craig Gannon, ex member of The Smiths and ardent conservationist. Craig is onboard for the project if we can get funding, this pilot will be the foundation of a crowdfunding project that will be launched on Indiegogo in a few days. Shot it on 5DMkII's and edited with FCPx with a Motion 5 Template by MotionVFX that I tweaked to fit the project.

Enjoy...


Cheers,
Mark.
Click to expand...

He's right, the sound is a bit soft.

Rudi Herbert said:
for a call to action, a tad more volume and bass would go a long way.
Click to expand...
 
Will Keir said:
Shit makes me sad.
Click to expand...

join the club...

lol, you know what i would love to see as a promotional material... like a cheap-o emotion-grabbing heart-string pulling animal shelter commercial, but with sharks. i think it would be awesome and actually effective. humor is the best medicine (:

if you don't have time i'd be happy to throw something together to help you out, would be fun
(whenever i have time, it would have to launch mid-campaign)
 
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That'd be the magenta that turns up when you clip the highlights and the colours don't break down uniformly, or something like that, and which can be fixed with the DRX slider in REDCINE-X. As I understand it, the underwater magenta anomaly happens without over-exposing and clipping the highlights, when the sensor has trouble colour-balancing for other as yet unknown reasons.
 
I believe the reason are KNOWN but the solution is taking time.

Les Hillis said:
the underwater magenta anomaly happens without over-exposing and clipping the highlights, when the sensor has trouble colour-balancing for other as yet unknown reasons.
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1462953_670973049601668_1218621661_n.jpg

New Build in the works…. Were going under water baby!
 
Hi Josh,

I have the Rossa and have been fairly happy with it. I have done more than 100 dives and no serious breakages so far :) I have also taken it to 60m without issue - planning for deeper when I do my next ccr level.

I have the Zen mini dome for the 8-15mm and i like it a lot, but still prefer the 230mm.

I use mine with the external smallHD monitor as well as the red monitor, although that is probably overkill for any wide shooting with currents. I have a scooter mount on the way which should make for some interesting footage - i suspect this might be hard with the bigger / heavier housings but who knows :)

One big plus for the Nauticam is their support for macro lenses. I have been shooting the MP-E 65mm and also some new Nauticam Diopters on it and you get insane reproduction ratios.



Josh Beadle said:
@Micheal
Great write up! Thanks!! I have the Nauticam for the Canon 1Dc now but am missing the RAW in post white balance flexibility. I haven't had any issues with that housing but don't dive professionally like many in this thread. Using the Keldan LED's . . . happy with those as well. Thinking of getting the Nauticam for RED and using the 8-15mm with small dome to keep it lean. Thoughts?
Click to expand...
 
Will Keir said:
I believe the reason are KNOWN but the solution is taking time.
Click to expand...

Could be the case, all I know is what I recall reading here and I don't remember anyone saying they know for sure what the problem is. Except for Pawel. But as beautiful as it was, I don't think that video he made is proof he's got it fully sorted out either. Too much post-processing to be able to really tell for sure, in my opinion, no offense intended.

Anyway, time for me to stop posting in this thread. Was originally just checking it out for images from those other-worldly underwater places I don't often see. Then got caught up in the human drama unfolding as the technical issues with the MX sensor emerged. Feels a bit awkward posting in a thread that deals with stuff I know nothing about and have no experience with and that I can't really contribute to.
 
This is my first post on this forum so let me introduce myself. My name is Darek Sepiolo. I live in Warsaw, Poland. I've been diving for 14 yrs. I used to publish a diving magazine in Poland "Big Blue" and I've been shooting stills for National Geographic for few yrs. NG published a coffee table book "Big Blue" with my pictures. I've got fed up with stills few yrs ago and decided to try filming. I started with small Sony HC9 then I've been using Sony EX1 for few yrs. I did a series for Discovery / Animal Planet called The Magic of the Big Blue that was aired all over the world in 2012 and 2013. There are 7 episodes - each one is from different continent. You may find some trailers on YouTube.

I've always wanted to have Red camera and been reading this forum since the very beginning. Now I can join you as a Scarlet owner. I've always been using a custom made housings for my UW film cameras. They are made here in Poland. The housing is very simple built. I use Canon 100mm, Sigma 30mm lenses and Tokina 11-16mm with an access to full zoom, camera power on/off and record button. I also have simplified access to Redmote so I can adjust all camera parameters and trigger recording from RM as well. We use Nauticam housing for SmallHD monitor. I've already did 3 trips with the housing: Palau, Bikini and Lembeh and the set worked great. The good thing about the housing is its compact size that fits into regular hand luggage.

My initial experience with filming Scarlet underwater is quite similar to what Rudi posted here... the resolution, slow motion, raw editing are great but color rendering is sometimes far from what I've got from my EX1. This is mainly when I shoot shallow reefs in ambient light trying to white balance the scene. Red just can't do this as good as EX1 did. Shooting in the blue and with lights is OK for me.

It's nice to be finally here :)

www.dareksepiolo.com
 

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Greetings Darek, a warm welcome to you.

Have just returned from Islas de Revillagigedos in the eastern Pacific, fantastic project, Rouge in deep conversation with Giant Mantas, more to follow.

Warm regards to all.

Tom



[URL="http://www.flickr.com/photos/90831642@N05/11330681143/"][/URL]
G][IMG][URL="http://www.flickr.com/photos/90831642@N05/11330681143/"][IMG]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7423/11330681143_40271d5d51_z.jpg[/URL] Rouge-Blade Manta 2 by Red Sea Pictures, on Flickr[/IMG]
 
Darek Sepiolo said:
This is my first post on this forum so let me introduce myself. My name is Darek Sepiolo. I live in Warsaw, Poland. I've been diving for 14 yrs. I used to publish a diving magazine in Poland "Big Blue" and I've been shooting stills for National Geographic for few yrs. NG published a coffee table book "Big Blue" with my pictures. I've got fed up with stills few yrs ago and decided to try filming. I started with small Sony HC9 then I've been using Sony EX1 for few yrs. I did a series for Discovery / Animal Planet called The Magic of the Big Blue that was aired all over the world in 2012 and 2013. There are 7 episodes - each one is from different continent. You may find some trailers on YouTube.

I've always wanted to have Red camera and been reading this forum since the very beginning. Now I can join you as a Scarlet owner. I've always been using a custom made housings for my UW film cameras. They are made here in Poland. The housing is very simple built. I use Canon 100mm, Sigma 30mm lenses and Tokina 11-16mm with an access to full zoom, camera power on/off and record button. I also have simplified access to Redmote so I can adjust all camera parameters and trigger recording from RM as well. We use Nauticam housing for SmallHD monitor. I've already did 3 trips with the housing: Palau, Bikini and Lembeh and the set worked great. The good thing about the housing is its compact size that fits into regular hand luggage.

My initial experience with filming Scarlet underwater is quite similar to what Rudi posted here... the resolution, slow motion, raw editing are great but color rendering is sometimes far from what I've got from my EX1. This is mainly when I shoot shallow reefs in ambient light trying to white balance the scene. Red just can't do this as good as EX1 did. Shooting in the blue and with lights is OK for me.

It's nice to be finally here :)

www.dareksepiolo.com
Click to expand...



Hello and welcome to the UW Bubble Blowers group. Question for you, are you not getting good color in shallow water shooting your Scarlet? I've had multiple HD cameras UW over the years but get far better color out of my EPIC especially in shallow clear waters. Shallow reefs and ambient light is crazy good and colors are just great and sometimes almost too saturated at times, far more than my Sony HD cameras. Rudi can probably attest to that as he just saw some of my 5k footage at this years DEMA show. Even on blu ray, the RED kicks my Sony's camera's rear.

I'll try to post a bit of video from some shallow reef shots from around here in the Florida Keys and Bahamas as I have time. Message me privately I'd be happy to offer a few suggestions if you'd like.

Best to you and welcome,
Frazier
 
Welcome Darek, nice to have you in the discussions.

Your website is excellent.

J-
 
SHARK SHOWDOWN

SHARK SHOWDOWN

The Shark Showdown sold out last month, but a few divers just backed out from the excursion.

Gates will be there with Howard and Michele Hall judging your Great Hammerhead videos. Prizes, too.

Contact Jillian Morris if you'd like to join. sharkyjillian@gmail.com

https://www.facebook.com/SharkShowdown
 
Very nice Tom

Very nice Tom

Tom Hamilton said:
Greetings Darek, a warm welcome to you.

Have just returned from Islas de Revillagigedos in the eastern Pacific, fantastic project, Rouge in deep conversation with Giant Mantas, more to follow.

Warm regards to all.

Tom



[URL="http://www.flickr.com/photos/90831642@N05/11330681143/"][/URL]
G][IMG][URL="http://www.flickr.com/photos/90831642@N05/11330681143/"][IMG]http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7423/11330681143_40271d5d51_z.jpg[/URL] Rouge-Blade Manta 2 by Red Sea Pictures, on Flickr[/IMG]
Click to expand...

Love Mantas, must've been loads of fun Tom. Love to see some footage from it when you have time.
 
Welcome Darek, quite an impressive body of work on your website,

Well, a few things to remember. Bayer array single sensor CMOS cameras such as RED are not "color accurate", in that interpolation/reconstruction algorithms are used to build the output of the color channels based on light values input approximation. It is a flawed system that held back CMOS mainstream use for many years but one that has been surprisingly perfected to the point where it is the prevalent (almost the only) technology and probably will be for some time. CCD sensors were, and will always be, better at color reproduction but they consume far more energy and cost more than CMOS to produce. That's why older cameras like the Sony F-900 series and the subsequent single sensor F23 and F35 all produced MUCH better colors than anything CMOS. But even with CMOS, a 3 chip array, such as used on the venerable EX-1, produces much better colors than a single sensor simply because there is no "guessing", no interpolation, as there is enough color information per channel to build the final image. Now, you remove the advantages of CCD and 3 chip arrays and we are left with a system that works exceedingly well under normal conditions but tends to crack under the pressure of abnormal situations such as underwater. Still, many a camera does a decent job and I think where RED fails is by virtue of some anomalies that happen somewhere along the image path. It is unlikely it happens pre-sensor since most cameras share very similar OLPF and CFA technologies, so the problem probably lies at the sensor level or afterwards, at the debayer/color science implementation phase. To me, this is the likely culprit as the analysis of bad images reveals startlingly contradictory information between the actual look of the image and mathematical input interpretation, i.e.: scopes, of said image.

All that said, greenish water locations at shallow depths, such as the Florida Keys and the Bahamas, produce very acceptable results, which coupled with solid shooting skills and spot on exposure, such as exhibited by Frasier, result in great looking images. Come settings within Redcine are also far more conducive than others to get better images, such as Camera RGB or even Redcolor 1 color spaces, and gamma spaces like Redspace, REC 709 or even sRGB, but again, all thata makes a difference provided you start with a decent image. Some of the results we've seen lately are beyond salvageable. And interestingly, when compared to a lesser camera like the aforementioned EX-1, the color accuracy tends to be better than RED. If you grade both images while using the sony compressed flavors like HDCAM or XDCAM, all of them 8 bit, and worse, either 4:2:0 or 3:1:1, then you can only push the image so far, and like Frasier said, RED can look better than those cameras then, but if you tap into the SDI port and record a 10 bit, 4:2:2 or 4:4:4 in the case of the F-900, F-23 and F35, then it is the RED that falls noticeably behind. Again, this may be attributed the 3 chip or CCD advantages, and when the RED does look good I am quite happy with its colors, but it rarely happens as easily out of the box as it happens with other cameras.

So, what are we to do? RED has been working, and is still working, to find the issue and fix it. Pawel claims to have figured the problem out but as I have told him, he will need to provide comparisons of his solution at work in plenty of situations and on a side-by-side set up, MX with and without his filter. Until then, we can take his word, and that of several talented people like Jon Shaw who have actually used Pawel's solution, but irrespective of its validity, it is of no use to our community if his solution remains proprietary to himself. We all know the issues between Pawel and RED, and all I can say on that front is that those issues have, as of yet, not been resolved and may likely never be. We need to be respectful of the reasons for anyone to refuse working with somebody else, that is a sacred prerogative and I mean that. But the fact remains, RED does not have a solution, and what I can say on that aspect is that, as of 10 days ago, they were still nowhere near a solution. So, all in all, we are in the same spot we were many months ago, where not for lack of effort and work of all those involved, RED cameras still continue to perform very poorly under a variety of situations underwater...And after all this typing I wonder really what the point of this whole post was...
 
Can you guys using epics and scarletts advise me with a red one mx system underwater....does the redone mx have all the same problems in shallow warm ocean waters,or is the old red onemx ok for shooting florida or bahamas waters to 50 ft..with or without filters etc...I am still playing in cold green dark great lake waters..we light the hell out of all our wreck shooting.koz
 
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