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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

RED ONE M-X Sensor Upgrade Program

Hi Jeff,

Did you go with the Single I7, or the dual nehalem xeons?

THanks
Troy Smith

Jeff Kilgroe said:
@ Hans

Haven't checked into what Iridas is doing for a while now. As for the HP Z800... It's OK for an off the shelf sort of workstation, my latest PC mops the floor with it, though. ;)

I would be curious how well SpeedGrade is handling a full quality 4K debayer and how fast. I've got both Mac and PC systems that can play back 2K / 1080p full quality from 4K R3Ds just fine. But I would like to see RED Rocket™ support in After Effects and Nuke so we can offload the debayer process from the CPUs and have it happen in real-time or faster for 4K/5K footage.

Adobe's new Mercury playback engine does make heavy use of the GPU in a system and it's looking promising. I have a hunch this is why CS4 seems abandoned, they're going to roll this right into CS5 and push for release within the next 4 to 6 months. However, current GPUs can only do so much and it's a lot to ask of any GPU, even upcoming ones.

The RED Rocket™ has been huge with one of my projects here, especially since the SDK supports it now. Wrote my own R3D importer for Modo and it saved a mountain of time. Some things I want to change with it and I will probably bring it to Lightwave next. I'm thinking of doing a public release at some point when I can get it to completely work the way I want it to.
Click to expand...
 
Hans von Sonntag said:
Ha, Ha. I'm sure your machine eats my shiny z800 for breakfast. But I'm not as skilled as you in IT technology. I buy what my trusty reseller proposes.

With a Nvidia 5800 I can do half debayer in RT. That leads to pristine 1080p footage. 4K RT is not possible. For that you need RedRocket. But I very rarely need 4K RGB plates.

The implementation of Red's SDK in third party programs raises some problems:

1. The SDK changed in build 20 the way colour is handled. While the blue channel improved pictures processed with the new SDK don't match with footage that has been processed with the earlier SDKs. For consistency reasons many third party vendors did not implement the new SDK in their applications yet. Which was kind of wise because:

2. Red's new sensor needs a new SDK which again incorporates a new colour science. I'm sure that it is downwardly compatible to the old sensor but again will probably process the pictures differently.

While improvement is a value by itself, I would love to have the colour handling fixed for the next 2 years. Implementing permanently new SDK costs money. Manufactures of software want to invest manpower rather in their own R&D than in making new builds with new SDKs.

I'm sure that Adobe, Quantel, Autodesk, Iridas, Assimilate, Avid, etc... will take advantage of the upcoming SDK. Then I will have a look into the capabilities of the RedRocket. Personally we don't use Red's tools in our workflow. This might change in the future, or not.

Hans
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just curious - how long to 4K debayers renders take, if not RT?
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
CS5 better have it, or Adobe will be screwing up bad. And WTF is up with CS4??? It's like Adobe has already written it off... Already working on CS5 beta testing and no significant update or even necessary bug fixes to CS4 in months, RED plugin or otherwise.
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Agree 100%. We downgraded to CS3 except for Photoshop. CS4 was just not worth the headache. I wish they would fix the core functions before adding gadgets we never use. It's bloatware.
 
Is there any new info on Stage 2 for Epic? I would like to upgrade my sensor if it looking to be delayed to summer.
I have low number, so most likely I will be able to upgrade sooner than later if Epic is indeed delayed.
Am I missing this info? Was it discussed at the recent Red Day?
Or is it coming soon?
 
Raul Gonzo said:
Is there any new info on Stage 2 for Epic? I would like to upgrade my sensor if it looking to be delayed to summer.
I have low number, so most likely I will be able to upgrade sooner than later if Epic is indeed delayed.
Am I missing this info? Was it discussed at the recent Red Day?
Or is it coming soon?
Click to expand...

Isn't that the question on everyone's mind...
 
Someone mentioned to me on Twitter that the first 40 cameras are being sent in now.
 
Was this answered anywhere? When M-X gets put into Red One, what changes besides a cleaner, higher DR image? Does the FOV get any bigger? Is the full 30mmx15mm being put in? Any additional modes? I realize that M-X in Red is limited by existing Red processing and won't be like Epic, just trying to make sure i understand the scope of the change. I'm going to do it asap.
 
Zakaree Sandberg said:
I think higher DR and asa 800 is the main thing... worth it!
Click to expand...

Totally agree! So I hope no one mistakes my question. I just want to be knowledgeable. Since I know the M-X is physically different I didnt know what that would entail, also whether they'll be doing a new build to do more stuff or whatever
 
New sensor seems to be the same 30x15 sensor going into the new DSMC brains. Photosites are the same size (5.4um) of the current Mysterium sensor. So that means FOV, frame size, etc.. are identical to what you have on RED One now. Can't record the full 5K recordable area and probably can't see the over-5K look around of the larger sensor.

What you do get is:

* Increased DR
* Lower noise
* More sensitivity
* Less skew or rolling shutter (reset is now 5ms instead of 9ms)
 
Shawn Nelson said:
Totally agree! So I hope no one mistakes my question. I just want to be knowledgeable. Since I know the M-X is physically different I didnt know what that would entail, also whether they'll be doing a new build to do more stuff or whatever
Click to expand...

Shawn, don't know if this is answered, new build demoed at Red day will definitely provide better control and take advantages of the M-X - like FLUT, New REDColor and RedGamma. - Lim
 
Tom Lowe said:
Someone mentioned to me on Twitter that the first 40 cameras are being sent in now.
Click to expand...
Wonder if that is a test run before the 22nd? If they get that many out (not counting shipping time) before the emails for the 22nd, that would be a pretty fast turn-around.
 
Jim, Jarred, or anyone,

is there any plan yet for the rollout of the scarlets, in terms of priority orders etc. Fair enough the RedOne owners get first dibs at the the M-X, and the first epics.

I'm hoping the scarlet rollout will show new customers a bit of luvin! Im after the fixed and the s35. I have loyally waited and would put a downpayment on them yesterday, even if i have to wait many months before they come out, that would give me the chance to show that i too could be a loyal customer! Dont get me wrong i have seen many companies penalise exisiting customers by offering better deals for new customers which I do hate!

On another note, any ideas about how the new sensors, Flut, etc will improve Greenscreen results, will the redcode 100 on the fixed hold up to keying?

cheers and hoping

paul
 
Tom Lowe said:
Someone mentioned to me on Twitter that the first 40 cameras are being sent in now.
Click to expand...

As promised, first group of eligible cameras were blasted today. Before you ask "How many?" and "What rate will you be upgrading?", etc - let us get through this first batch to get some data points on how quickly people send in, etc. Reminder, we are blasting in order of delivery date, not serial number.

BC
 
As a point of reference I have serial #19 and took delivery on Red Day Zero, August 31st, 2007. I received the email from Nick at RED and, like everyone I have ever dealt with at RED, he talked me through the whole process and I will be dropping off my camera in the morning. Say what you want about RED but their customer service is off the charts.

I often wonder if the reason Red owners have such a better attitude about RED than many in the industry is not just because we are motivated to push our own agenda (inevitably there will be some of that) but more so because being treated so well builds confidence. Call me a suck up if you like but from my direct personal experience has been jam up. RED, like all human enterprises has made some mistakes but they do what is in their power to make it right and they learn pretty fast. I don't see how any fair minded person can ask for more than that.

Just my 2 cents

Cheers - Blair
 
Brent@RED said:
As promised, first group of eligible cameras were blasted today. Before you ask "How many?" and "What rate will you be upgrading?", etc - let us get through this first batch to get some data points on how quickly people send in, etc. Reminder, we are blasting in order of delivery date, not serial number.

BC
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Thanks, Brent. I know a lot of us would really, really appreciate you keeping us posted once you have a better idea of when certain blocks of Red Ones will be eligible to get the upgrade.
 
To help narrow the range for those that are curious. We are RED #63 and took ownership on time about two weeks after the first batch of cameras shipped (we were there for the second batch on the second "red training day"). And we haven't gotten a notice yet. But we don't have the cash on hand to jump in for a few weeks anyway, so no complaints here.
 
Blair S. Paulsen said:
As a point of reference I have serial #19 and took delivery on Red Day Zero, August 31st, 2007. I received the email from Nick at RED and, like everyone I have ever dealt with at RED, he talked me through the whole process and I will be dropping off my camera in the morning. Say what you want about RED but their customer service is off the charts.

I often wonder if the reason Red owners have such a better attitude about RED than many in the industry is not just because we are motivated to push our own agenda (inevitably there will be some of that) but more so because being treated so well builds confidence. Call me a suck up if you like but from my direct personal experience has been jam up. RED, like all human enterprises has made some mistakes but they do what is in their power to make it right and they learn pretty fast. I don't see how any fair minded person can ask for more than that.

Just my 2 cents

Cheers - Blair
Click to expand...

Well put Blair. I think you speak for many of us. Red should be the blue print for way business is done.
 
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