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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

RED NAB Speculation thread...

I'm sure a few fire breathing dragsters have already been captured on DRAGON. I hope there isn't any fire blowing out the top of my EPIC when the dragon is installed! :)

David
 
Jeff Kilgroe said:
I only want three things from RED this year...

1> Dragon sensor installed in my EPIC.

2> REDRAY PROJECTOR, installed in my new screening/ coloring room.

3> ODEMAX to be real and to kick-ass in use with REDRAY. I'm not buying the Hobbit on Blu-Ray, dammit. I will watch it on my REDRAY PROJECTOR on a 12 foot wide screen.
Click to expand...

Copying your list. '-)
 
David Battistella said:
It is noticeably quieter. I'd have to do a before and after video and I don't really have time for that. I just know that with this on the fan is much quieter (i don't know in db) but the fan is quiet, if you take the grill off you can hear how quiet the fan it. The logo is what causes a lot of the noise.

David
Click to expand...

Can't you just leave the OEM grill off? If I remember correctly the air just passes through a closed chamber, doesn't it?

I know it looks strange this way, but every desktop computer I own has the sides off, and in some cases sides and front. They work so I don't worry about how they look.
 
I suspect that an altered intake in Front of the grill could be designed with a more gradual air impedance match - and this would make the fan more efficient (ie it could run a a lower RPM).

If this intake visually obscured the fan, and did not reduce the maximum air speed much, was lined with a high frequency absorbing material - this first reflection of the sound energy radiating forward from the fan would be greatly muffled.

Maybe a spiral variant with an aperiodic membrane in the final 'flared' outermost section, and with rate of spiral increasing nearer the fan - would work. The high frequency reflections from the fan radiating forward would get absorbed, the Low frequency airflow inwards wouldn't 'see' the aperiodic membrane, the spiralling air would be rotating at a speed closer to the fan (so less cutting noise), and the flaring would make the fan more efficient (in the same way when you cup your hands to throw your voice further).

AJ
 
I think the grill is there for a good reason. To keep the fan in there.

To be clear, I have only tested this, never shot on the day with this grill on the camera. It was just to see if there was a difference in sound level.

David



Elsie N said:
Can't you just leave the OEM grill off? If I remember correctly the air just passes through a closed chamber, doesn't it?

I know it looks strange this way, but every desktop computer I own has the sides off, and in some cases sides and front. They work so I don't worry about how they look.
Click to expand...
 
I took my grill off for a while with only a very marginal improvement in sound output. Removing the grill also created a major problem in that the audio mini jacks no longer seated correctly and became susceptible to a crackling noise if bumped. The grill ended up back on.
 
I would not recommend operating the camera without a fan grill cover.

David

Tom Gleeson said:
I took my grill off for a while with only a very marginal improvement in sound output. Removing the grill also created a major problem that the audio mini jacks no longer seated quite right and became susceptible to noise if bumped. The grill ended up back on.
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I knew physics and engineering would find its way into this thread.

david


Antony Newman said:
Interesting points in this article if anyone was looking at a fan redesign : http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/top10noise.pdf

If a fan can be made more efficient - it makes less noise - but it could also have is spin-speed reduced for the same airflow generated (further reducing noise levels).

AJ
Click to expand...
 
But the question is whether any of this will actually affect the performance of the fan and its ability to effectively move air to remove heat from the body.

im sure there is a way to make this both quiet and highly efficient.

David


Antony Newman said:
I suspect that an altered intake in Front of the grill could be designed with a more gradual air impedance match - and this would make the fan more efficient (ie it could run a a lower RPM).

If this intake visually obscured the fan, and did not reduce the maximum air speed much, was lined with a high frequency absorbing material - this first reflection of the sound energy radiating forward from the fan would be greatly muffled.

Maybe a spiral variant with an aperiodic membrane in the final 'flared' outermost section, and with rate of spiral increasing nearer the fan - would work. The high frequency reflections from the fan radiating forward would get absorbed, the Low frequency airflow inwards wouldn't 'see' the aperiodic membrane, the spiralling air would be rotating at a speed closer to the fan (so less cutting noise), and the flaring would make the fan more efficient (in the same way when you cup your hands to throw your voice further).

AJ
Click to expand...
 
[Seen the RED announcement - thought I'd answer this anyway!]

@David,

"But the question is whether any of this will actually affect the performance of the fan and its ability to effectively move air to remove heat from the body.
I'm sure there is a way to make this both quiet and highly efficient."

Fan noise (turbulence) that is projected towards the front of the camera slows downs the air flow through the fan (into the camera), reducing its efficiency.
All things being equal - if there was less noise (turbulence), Greater air would flow through the camera for the Same fan speed.

When sound resonates in the mouth of an acoustic horn, the sound propagates down the throat and there is a gradual expansion of the sound wave. This expanding wave is able to efficiently push the air in front forward. This horn is said to change the 'acoustic impedance' of the air in the through (and in this case making it easier for you to 'push' it).

When designing fans it is possible to design a baffle (or other 3d structure) on both sides of a fan to help reduce turbulence (eg dimpled surface), help blow air through a structure (carefully designed acoustic impedance change) - both of which mean that a lower rotational speed of the fan will blow the same air through the structure (or camera).

Fan noise is 'roughly proportional to the 5th power of fan speed' - and so for a small reduction in fan speed (due to increased efficiency) you should be able to make reasonable (turbulent) noise reduction.

Even if REDs top-plate fan adds noise, the reduction in speed of the front fan could greatly reduce the total noise level.

AJ
 
KETCH ROSSi said:
Only what I read around... ;)
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Dude... wait for it... There are some COOL things coming from Red... that's all I can say... but I'm EXCITED about them... Some killer competitive things... all I can do is smile for two more weeks!
 
Doh! You tease! See you at NAB Curt.

Curt Pair said:
Dude... wait for it... There are some COOL things coming from Red... that's all I can say... but I'm EXCITED about them... Some killer competitive things... all I can do is smile for two more weeks!
Click to expand...
 
David Battistella said:
It is noticeably quieter. I'd have to do a before and after video and I don't really have time for that. I just know that with this on the fan is much quieter (i don't know in db) but the fan is quiet, if you take the grill off you can hear how quiet the fan it. The logo is what causes a lot of the noise.

David
Click to expand...

Out of curiousity... why orange? Why not RED? Other colors? That would be cool.
 
See what Ketch released? I'm loving it! I don't know where you dug that up... (the picture of the "older/original" design of the Epic) but it's COOL!
 
Last edited:
Bob,

I love and respect ya... but I've been sworn to secrecy! All I can say is DO NOT FEAR the F55! (How's that one?)

Yup, I'm a tech tease... lovin' every minute of it! I enjoy reading the speculations! (You don't know how hard it is to keep quiet sometimes... Like last year, when I was reading all the Adobe Premiere stuff... I'd been cutting with CS6 since August of 2011... and it was AWESOME... I'll pull the pin on another grenade... Adobe has even MORE cool things in store this time around! Stay tuned folks... It's actually going to be a pretty spectacular NAB... The "reasonable" 4K monitors on the floor are going to be exciting to check out! Can't wait!)

 
LOL Curt. Easy brother... you might have said too much already. Run for the hills!

Curt Pair said:
Bob,

I love and respect ya... but I've been sworn to secrecy! All I can say is DO NOT FEAR the F55! (How's that one?)

Yup, I'm a tech tease... lovin' every minute of it! I enjoy reading the speculations! (You don't know how hard it is to keep quiet sometimes... Like last year, when I was reading all the Adobe Premiere stuff... I'd been cutting with CS6 since August of 2011... and it was AWESOME... I'll pull the pin on another grenade... Adobe has even MORE cool things in store this time around! Stay tuned folks... It's actually going to be a pretty spectacular NAB... The "reasonable" 4K monitors on the floor are going to be exciting to check out! Can't wait!)
Click to expand...
 
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