Please, help me decide what to do.

[Petri Teittinen]

First off, my apologies if I posted this in incorrect forum.

Secondly, this post might seem silly to you. Let me assure you, I'm dead serious. This is not a joke.

Here's the gist of it. The day I first learned of Mr. Jannard's venture I decided that one day I will own a RED camera. It was never a question of "if", but a question of "when". Unfortunately the required funds were never quite there, no matter how hard I tried.

Very long story short, I learned today that I will be getting a very nice bundle of money in a couple of weeks. For the sake of this post, let's say the amount is $50,000.

Here's the silly part: I need to spend maybe $40K of it before the end of the year - or my equivalent of IRS will take a large portion of it. I won't bore you with grisly details of our progressive taxation; suffice it to say that all money I don't spend on buying tools for my company is counted as salary paid to me, thus raising the percentage of my income tax.

Some of you might think, "Easy, buy a nice car!". Nope, can't do that, unfortunately. I can own a car, but my company can't. (Don't ask.)

Now, some of you might think, "Heck, buy a RED ONE right now with some nice accessories."

And that's exactly the idea I'm struggling with. You see, I had my heart set on a Scarlet FF35. Or maybe two FF35s for shooting 3-D; you know how it is. But - and this is the bit that makes me physically ill - if I wait until 2010, the IRS gleefully relieves me of almost half of the $50K.

It's really too bad I didn't get the money before the announcement of October 30th. If I had, my decision would have been soooo much easier. As things stand, I don't know what to do.

So please, tell me what you think I should do, and please, also elaborate why.

Thank you.

 

[Zakaree Sandberg]

give it to red to put into your red account.. buy a tshirt.. then fill your account with 50 grand

 

[Petri Teittinen]

give it to red to put into your red account.. buy a tshirt.. then fill your account with 50 grand

A nice idea, but unfortunately I need an invoice for purchased goods. Simply moving the money from my bank account into RED's is not enough. And as far as I know, RED won't sell the FF35 to me yet.

 

[jimhare]

That's a tough one. I know exactly where you are coming from.

I assume it has to be spent on a business item that can be written off taxes as opposed to just getting it out of your account. If not, I would advise investing for a few months and then making the big buy next year. If not stocks, maybe property? Like a down payment on an office? Chances are the market will only go up so it's a pretty safe place to store money for a while. Chances are it will at least be six months anyway.

Probably NOT a good time to buy a Red One, especially if Scarlet is your future.

Unless you can find a temporary asset that will appreciate and you can liquidate when the time is right, I think you may be out of luck with the IRS.

Certainly buy all of the other bits, tripod etc. Then again, Red has some sweet matteboxes and other tasties coming out in the future.

Tough one my friend, best of luck with it.

Cheers,

Jim
Sydney

 

[Petri Teittinen]

I assume it has to be spent on a business item that can be written off taxes as opposed to just getting it out of your account. If not, I would advise investing for a few months and then making the big buy next year. If not stocks, maybe property? Like a down payment on an office? Chances are the market will only go up so it's a pretty safe place to store money for a while. Chances are it will at least be six months anyway.

Thank you for replying, Jim. You are partly right: the money has to be spent on a business item, but it has to be an item related to the business my company is involved in. Stocks are ineligible, unfortunately. If I put the $50K in stocks, the money is still considered as my salary. (At least, I'm fairly certain it would be. Need to verify with my accountant.) Property would be a good idea in different circumstances. I won't bore you with details as to why my accountant would advise against that, however.

Unless you can find a temporary asset that will appreciate and you can liquidate when the time is right, I think you may be out of luck with the IRS.

Where's that sobbing smiley when you need one...

Certainly buy all of the other bits, tripod etc. Then again, Red has some sweet matteboxes and other tasties coming out in the future. Tough one my friend, best of luck with it.

Thank you, Jim.

 

[J. Bernard Vallon]

plenty of parts of your future camera system are available today. First, buy some lenses. Lenses dont loose value quickly, in some cases they appreciate. Get a set, maybe of RPPs, and like jim said, a nice tripod and a short list of good AKS. You'll be set when the new cameras are ready.

 

[Petri Teittinen]

plenty of parts of your future camera system are available today. First, buy some lenses. Lenses dont loose value quickly, in some cases they appreciate. Get a set, maybe of RPPs, and like jim said, a nice tripod and a short list of good AKS. You'll be set when the new cameras are ready.

Hi John, and thanks for chiming in.

Truth be told, I wasn't planning on buying RPPs. I have a large-ish collection of Nikkor lenses and I sort of thought I'd stick with them. Also, and please don't shoot the messenger, a company shooting with RED here in Helsinki tested some RED lenses and they weren't happy with the lens quality. No, I don't know which lenses, but I could find out.

I do like the idea of buying compatible accessories right away. But can you imagine the frustration caused by having all those goodies on hand for several months without a camera? :laugh:

Could someone tell me what current accessories are not compatible with forthcoming cameras like the Scarlet FF35?

 

[Curran Giddens]

Buy all the additional accessories that you will need for when you do finally get the camera. Especially the items with very high resale value. You could even buy multiple pieces of the same item. For instance, buy a used Arri mattebox and then sell it for the same price after new years.

EDIT: Damn iPhone. Too slow... Already been said.

 

[Peter Hodgins]

Buy some other $50,000 tool for your company ... when the Scarlet comes out sell that tool and buy the Scarlet. The loss you might take on the first tool can be written off. Or pay off some Company debts or buy land, or buy Gold futures.

 

[Harva Raj]

Speedgrade DI - $ 45,399 ( For Grading and Finishing you movie)

or

Panasonic AJ-HD3700B - New $74,500.00 (D-5 HD/SD Studio Mastering System)
Used $35,000

 

[(blake)]

Buy two Red One bodies only. Sit on them. Then trade them both towards epic S35s Stage Four and use the remainder to pay towards the epic upgrade cost (since the money might only be $10,000 left over instead of $50,000 I doubt that the tax percentage will be as severe). Shoot 3d Epic S35 for awhile then sell to upgrade to two FF35 bodies of your choice.

 

[paulherrin]

what it comes down to

what it comes down to

i'm pretty sure if you buy a used One (or two), you inherit the serial number, and could be eligible for the trade-in stages.

another viable option is buying accessories and equipment that you will use.

or use it on equipment you might (or not) use, but can sell when it's time to get the scarlet... i.e. something that won't depreciate in value, as has been mentioned.

that's what i think it comes down to.

 

[Steve Sherrick]

Truth be told, I wasn't planning on buying RPPs. I have a large-ish collection of Nikkor lenses and I sort of thought I'd stick with them. Also, and please don't shoot the messenger, a company shooting with RED here in Helsinki tested some RED lenses and they weren't happy with the lens quality. No, I don't know which lenses, but I could find out.

Possible they were talking about the RED 18-50. Not the best lens in the RED lineup. But the RPPs are superb, and as much as I love my Nikons, I'd rather shoot with the RPPs if given the choice.

 

[Lauri Kettunen]

Possible they were talking about the RED 18-50. Not the best lens in the RED lineup. But the RPPs are superb, and as much as I love my Nikons, I'd rather shoot with the RPPs if given the choice.

Yes, Steve is right, I've heard this comment from guys in Helsinki and they meant the RED zoom. RPP's is a different story. Still, Nikkor lenses should be just fine for a mobile set. I'm perfectly happy with Canon EF L-series lenses, and especially the EF primes create wonderful images.

Petri, why do you want to go to Scarlet and not Epic? I suspect that sooner or later broadcasting companies will be asking for footages shot 50 fps and beleive EPIC will be a useful tool for a longer time than Scarlet. If you buy Red One body now, you'll then be able to upgrade to Epic. You can also buy RED bricks, drives, LCD etc. that all can be exploited with Epic. You can also buy a good tripod & fluid head now, something like the Cartoni Delta Rosso, Miller, or O'Connor,

 

[Martin Weiss]

Have a look at this post - maybe there is hope. Maybe.

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showpost.php?p=493922&postcount=16

 

[Petri Teittinen]

Wow! Thank you ever so much everyone who took time to reply; I'm grateful for all your comments and suggestions!

One thing I forgot to mention when writing the post very late last night... the sum of money mentioned is all I have. There's no guarantee I will have a single extra dime to spend for RED gear in 2010, so the money I receive in two weeks is all there is.

Speedgrade DI

C.A.Alan, while I'd love to buy a good grading/mastering system, I would then have no money left for the camera and accessories. Thank you for the suggestion, nevertheless.

And like I mentioned earlier, the money has to be spent buying actual physical products that relate to my business. In other words, no investing in stocks, bonds, land, debts or gold futures. Or buildings. :001_huh:

Buy some other $50,000 tool for your company

or use it on equipment you might (or not) use, but can sell when it's time to get the scarlet

Peter and Paul, buying some other tool for the company now, then selling it in 2010 has a certain appeal. I've thought about it - a lot. My fear is that I might end up stuck with the tool, or being forced to sell it at a very high loss, thus ending up with way less money for RED purchases. I've had both those experiences in the past and didn't enjoy them one bit.

Buy two Red One bodies only. Sit on them. Then trade them both towards epic S35s Stage Four

What an intriguing suggestion! Is it really possible to trade in two RED Ones for one S35 Epic Stage 4 and have some money left over? I don't remember seeing that mentioned, but then again, I haven't read quite all of Mr. Jannard's posts.

why do you want to go to Scarlet and not Epic?

Lauri, great to hear from another Finn! Why? Simple: I'm shooting with Nikon D3 and a Full Frame sensor is a fixation of mine. I then compared prices of Epic FF35 vs Scarlet FF35, and decided on the Scarlet.

I'm open to anyone trying to convince me to go for Epic instead of Scarlet, though. Fire away!

You can also buy RED bricks, drives, LCD etc. that all can be exploited with Epic.

Couldn't I use those on the Scarlet as well?

Have a look at this post

Martin, while Mr. Jannard's reply does feel somewhat encouraging, doesn't the post he's replying to talk about the Epic-X only? Unless I misunderstood, I'm not eligible for an Epic-X.

Paul Herrin mentioned I might be eligible for trade-in stages if I bought a used RED One and inherited its serial number. Can anyone verify this with 100% certainty?

Jim from Sydney wrote earlier that this might not be a good time to buy a RED One. Why would this not be a good time; wouldn't the camera still be worth $17,500 when traded in towards a Scarlet FF35 whenever it becomes available?

Again, thank you very much for your replies.

 

[Peter Hodgins]

Why would this not be a good time; wouldn't the camera still be worth $17,500 when traded in towards a Scarlet FF35 whenever it becomes available?

There was never any promise to accept a RED ONE trade in for a Scarlet, the only trade in ever suggested was to get 17,500 credit toward an Epic-X. When the Scarlet is released the price for a used RED ONE will be somewhere below the price of a new Scarlet ... let's say 20% less than the price of a new Scarlet. This ignores the effect of Obama's coming hyper-inflation which will drive prices in American dollars to the moon ... if you have the YUAN you'll be OK. Given all that, the RPP's might be a good. "investment".:lol:

 

[Stephen Gentle]

What an intriguing suggestion! Is it really possible to trade in two RED Ones for one S35 Epic Stage 4 and have some money left over? I don't remember seeing that mentioned, but then again, I haven't read quite all of Mr. Jannard's posts.

I'm pretty sure this is not an option. As far as I can tell it's one RED ONE plus the money for one EPIC-X.

 

[Petri Teittinen]

There was never any promise to accept a RED ONE trade in for a Scarlet, the only trade in ever suggested was to get 17,500 credit toward an Epic-X.

Oohhhh.... right. I don't know where I got the idea in the first place. Well, that's good to know, thanks.

 

[Petri Teittinen]

I'm pretty sure this is not an option. As far as I can tell it's one RED ONE plus the money for one EPIC-X.

It would've been too good to be true, right? Thanks, Stephen.