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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

NAB 2014 - DRAGONcolor and REDgamma 4

We have had lots of requests for the name change, and I think Brook yelled the loudest :)
 
TheBied said:
To help clarify what 'RAW' view is in camera, it's been clearly defined as the following.

  • Updated RAW mode for MX and Dragon: RLF, RC2, 5600K, 800 ISO, 0 TINT
Click to expand...

Out of curiosity, why RC2 and not Dragoncolor?
 
TheBied said:
[RC2] it is the desaturated color space option shared with MX cameras.
Click to expand...

This made me wonder...

I know we are only talking about RC2 to create the LOG view, but still: to me the use of REDcolor has always been:
Use the most recent color science for best results. If you're not pleased: try the others."

On that status, RC2 is perceived as "outdated" and not something I would have recommended others to use. Doesn't it make sense to create a desaturated look from the newest color science, so that you can get the best of both worlds?
And / Or name it something like REDlogColor so that it's appreciated as a standard as a color grading basis (to go nicely with REDlogfilm) and not as an "old" color science nobody wants to touch anymore.
 
Patrick Grossien said:
This made me wonder...

I know we are only talking about RC2 to create the LOG view, but still: to me the use of REDcolor has always been:
Use the most recent color science for best results. If you're not pleased: try the others."

On that status, RC2 is perceived as "outdated" and not something I would have recommended others to use. Doesn't it make sense to create a desaturated look from the newest color science, so that you can get the best of both worlds?
And / Or name it something like REDlogColor so that it's appreciated as a standard as a color grading basis (to go nicely with REDlogfilm) and not as an "old" color science nobody wants to touch anymore.
Click to expand...

This is only RAW mode and its not something you are going to choose or have your clients really view.
 
Hi,
I use a combination of RC2 & RC3 with RLF in a same movie from a long time during grading, it gives me good option to go with the emotions of the scene and compliment the colours of the elements used in shot. Even sometimes i choose Camera RGB for a particular scene if required.
As our Dragon is on fire now, i'll soon get my chance to Grade it on Baselight. I hope by then we'll able to use RLF & RG3 on BL.

Already found more details from Dragon footages then on Epic in highlight and almost noiseless shadows. Recently Tested by top 3 Cinematographers here.

What a Codec(.R3D) to Grade on.... :) Excited.
 
Jarred Land said:
We have had lots of requests for the name change, and I think Brook yelled the loudest :)
Click to expand...

People outside of the REDUSER still use wrong color spaces and gamma spaces. I've seen a well known colorist from UK using REC709/REC709 settings for M-X footage (2013) on a big music project.
He said that he doesn't know what's REDcolor/REDgamma, REDgamma2/REDcolor2 etc...

Names must be very clear. It would be great to have common industry names for color spaces and gamma spaces. No more skulls and rebel stuffs etc...
You know what I mean. :) (I love your "skulls and rebel stuffs" but it doesn't work for many people)

BTW, you should delete old color spaces and gammas from SDK.
 
No, they shouldn't delete the old ones. I still find REDgamma (the original) puts a lot of extra contrast in the highlights (though it clips them a little more) and the look works really well for quite a few scenarios (particularly vintage-looks... I would hate to have to try to replicate it via a curve.

Honestly, if you're passing the footage on to anyone else -- colourist, vfx, etc. -- it should be in REDlogFilm anyway... I do think it's annoying that I have to tell colourists that RLF is supposed to be cineon, but in doing so, at least I know they'll know how to work with the footage.
 
THANKS TheBled, curious, because I remember you once answered me it was feasible…would PLAYBACK ALL CLIPS feature be possible in future upgrades? it's important to be able to play them all to customers sometimes, instead of one by one...
 
Enrique Blein said:
THANKS TheBled, curious, because I remember you once answered me it was feasible…would PLAYBACK ALL CLIPS feature be possible in future upgrades? it's important to be able to play them all to customers sometimes, instead of one by one...
Click to expand...

We added the ability to playback all, or some of your clips in 5.1.x and up. There is a playlist control in the media dialog when you are in playback.
 
Stacey Spears said:
Here is an image I posted previously. Re-processed with RC2, RC3, and DC so show how saturated red has changed along the way. REDGamma4 was used on all three images.

REDColor2
01_rc2.jpg


REDColor3
02_rc3.jpg


DRAGONcolor
03_dc.jpg
Click to expand...

REDcolor3 looks the most accurate to me in this scenario. Traffic lights are generally really red.

Of course, the purity (i.e. more red, less pink) of the red in the DRAGONcolor version could always be punched up in post since all the color info seems to be there.
 
Brian Boyer said:
REDcolor3 looks the most accurate to me in this scenario. Traffic lights are generally really red.
Click to expand...

I see that traffic light every day and its not actually as saturated as REDcolor3. It is closer to DRAGONcolor. Wish I could take a picture with my eyes to share.
 
Stacey Spears said:
I see that traffic light every day and its not actually as saturated as REDcolor3. It is closer to DRAGONcolor. Wish I could take a picture with my eyes to share.
Click to expand...

I've seen a few that have been less saturated than what I'm used to, similar to the DRAGONcolor example, but perhaps still a bit more red. I think I've seen so many of the more saturated ones my memory bank defaults to those, even though I know ones like these exist.

Well, if it's accurate, I guess that's a good thing. I just prefer the more saturated red look for these types of lights.

That's why I always bring it up on REDuser. I really dig the way red tail/brake/traffic lights looks in real life but it's so hard to capture that with digital cameras, especially from dusk on.

Bright daylight seems to be the best time to get those reds nice and saturated because, since you have to stop down or ND so much to account for the overall brightness, you end up keeping the lights from blowing out the sensor.
 
Never mind street lights and such, let us not forget how MX skin tones looked so much improved by the reds in RC3. To my eyes my MX skin tones still look more natural in RC3. Dragon Color on MX while nice enough, feels more like a stylistic choice to me.
 
Stacey Spears said:
I see that traffic light every day and its not actually as saturated as REDcolor3. It is closer to DRAGONcolor. Wish I could take a picture with my eyes to share.
Click to expand...

Yes - agreed. DRAGONcolor has better R and B representation IMO over any previous RED color science. B was always my issue with RG3 - as IMO - it was under-saturated and R was over-saturated IMO - maybe not technically - but for my preferred aesthetic.

DRAGONcolor + RG4 is pretty damn awesome. I'm hooked - even though I still like to turn B up a bit :)
 
Brian Boyer said:
That's why I always bring it up on REDuser. I really dig the way red tail/brake/traffic lights looks in real life but it's so hard to capture that with digital cameras, especially from dusk on.
Click to expand...

Its always good to raise issues. The more content that people share, the more RED can fine tune their product(s). Maybe Matt Fleming can post his impression since he drives by the same traffic lights too. Prior to the thread complaining about the red lights, I had not paid much attention to them. There is definitely a light part to the light (white'ish?) that you see in RC2 and DC. When I get back home, I will see what my 40D does with it. All-in-all, I see DC as an improvement over RC3. The green and yellow lights look the same as I recall and only RED was reduced. The obviously cool part is that all detail was still present in the R3D to be reprocessed.
 
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