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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

KOMODO....

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‘Full sized’ almost seems like he meant full s35 sensor, but the fact that he compared it to Monstro makes me think it might actually be full-frame.
 
Stephen Mickelsen said:
Interesting article about Steven Soderbergh in Filmmaker Magazine. He mentions shooting on Komodo.

https://filmmakermagazine.com/10831...at-llcs-and-systemic-corruption/#.XYVtJcplCfA
Click to expand...

My two takeaways from that:

"Full sized sensor"
I'm assuming he's talking about full sized as in cinema standards, a.k.a. S35 and not full frame 135. His use of Summicron-C's also kinda elude to that, but I guess there's still the possibility he was cropping a full frame 6K to 5K to get full coverage on those lenses. The fact that Komodo is named Komodo though, leads me to believe there is a similarity to Dragon, which would lie in the pixel pitch, so I wouldn't be surprised to see it be the same ~30.7mm sensor width.

"but big enough to give me the aesthetics and the practicality that a “normal” camera would give me."
This one is big to me. I'm of the belief that Komodo has to be on par with Dragon at the very least for it to be successful. I think that's another clue from the name Komodo. The fact that we know for sure now that it shoots .r3d, while looking at what happened with the DSMC2 Unified program, I have the feeling that RED isn't planning on releasing anything that is "gimped" at this point. The same way Ranger doesn't outpace DSMC2, I don't think Komodo is going to be behind DSMC2 on the performance standpoint.

Just my thoughts.

Edit: I guess with his reference of what to do with his Monstro bodies... hmmm...
 
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Noah Yuan-Vogel said:
Doubt it's FF/LF. It's probably s35 still.
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comparing them to the monstros, canon and sony both having full frame 6k cameras announced, and being RF mount, makes me think it is full frame, hopefully the 4k crop is s35 though, and im sure its limited frame rate and compressions in this case.
 
In which universe does a FF sensor in lowest priced RED camera make sense ?
 
Yeah as it has already been said, to me Mr. Soderbergh is more talking about "full size" s35 compared to a cellphone than "hey it's full frame".
The lense he is using leads me to believe it's slightly bigger than s35 like the Gemini sensor.
 
Andrew Dease said:
You can see the frame from his lens in the shot on his monitor. Maybe some RU wants to zoom in and compare........sensor...size
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There is actually enough information within that photograph to extrapolate an approximate sensor size.

Doesn't require zooming in however. Just dissecting all of the elements within the image.
 
You are absolutely right Phil!
Not many elements to dissect either!

The lens covers a 36mm image circle and is intended for larger sensors, like the Helium and Gemini.
https://www.leitz-cine.com/summicro...rger-sensors-film-and-television-productions/

On the third page of this https://cvp.com/pdf/large-format-lens-finder---sensor-coverage-and-thalia-relative-values.pdf
you can see that using a Summicron places the Komodo sensor somewhere around RED Dragon 6K dimensions. Maybe a bit larger.
35mm FF requires a 43mm image circle, so the Summicron can't do that. Unless it's shooting at a crop frame...

And with the image that's visible on the Atomos, seeing as it is in focus at T2, that means that the 8ft reading reflects how far that kitchen counter/chairs are at. And the size of the scene based on the perspective/angle of the camera.
So, maybe it's a bit of a crop from 6K to 4K...

Anyone's guess really. Coupled with Steven's quote about a "full size sensor" and comparing it to the Monstros, supports that theory.
I think. :p


EDIT: I could go all out and do a 3D scene reconstruction and use the lens specs to create a virtual camera in that position, but something is stopping me...
Maybe because I know deep down that my OCD will never let me accept the outcome.


Better to sit back and enjoy these little teasers while waiting for the big reveal from Jarred!

--- --- ---

In other news, this makes me even more tempted to ask for a Monochrome Komodo and hopefully even a monochrome without the IR filter... One can only dream!
 
Another thought... looking back at the old Scarlet cameras, they were branded 6K, but they could only do 1-12 fps in 6K, while they operated at 5K 24fps. So Komodo might not even work at normal fps at 6K. I do think, however, that in order to compete with other bodies, 6K 50 fps is needed in 2020. I don't think it's reasonable to do a Scarlet 12 fps again.
 
Christoffer Glans said:
Another thought... looking back at the old Scarlet cameras, they were branded 6K, but they could only do 1-12 fps in 6K, while they operated at 5K 24fps. So Komodo might not even work at normal fps at 6K. I do think, however, that in order to compete with other bodies, 6K 50 fps is needed in 2020. I don't think it's reasonable to do a Scarlet 12 fps again.
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Neither reasonable or necessary given the orders of magnitude increases in processor capabilities vs cost, power and thermal envelopes that have occurred in the interim.
 
Hrvoje Simic said:
In which universe does a FF sensor in lowest priced RED camera make sense ?
Click to expand...

one with limited specs such as frame rates and compressions in order to compete with what's coming to market with competing brands...but as you can see jarred already said neah...
what im worried about now then, is if it's 6k and not full frame, what will the 4k crop be? if its anything less then s35 then its pretty much a no go for most people i know.
 
Aaron Lochert said:
My two takeaways from that:

"Full sized sensor"
I'm assuming he's talking about full sized as in cinema standards, a.k.a. S35 and not full frame 135. His use of Summicron-C's also kinda elude to that, but I guess there's still the possibility he was cropping a full frame 6K to 5K to get full coverage on those lenses. The fact that Komodo is named Komodo though, leads me to believe there is a similarity to Dragon, which would lie in the pixel pitch, so I wouldn't be surprised to see it be the same ~30.7mm sensor width.

"but big enough to give me the aesthetics and the practicality that a “normal” camera would give me."
This one is big to me. I'm of the belief that Komodo has to be on par with Dragon at the very least for it to be successful. I think that's another clue from the name Komodo. The fact that we know for sure now that it shoots .r3d, while looking at what happened with the DSMC2 Unified program, I have the feeling that RED isn't planning on releasing anything that is "gimped" at this point. The same way Ranger doesn't outpace DSMC2, I don't think Komodo is going to be behind DSMC2 on the performance standpoint.

Just my thoughts.

Edit: I guess with his reference of what to do with his Monstro bodies... hmmm...
Click to expand...

I don’t think Red ever “gimps” their cameras beyond the necessary limitations imposed by hardware choices necessary to meet a given price point. Komodo should give us everything the state of the art allowed at hardware design lock.
 
jordan levy said:
one with limited specs such as frame rates and compressions in order to compete with what's coming to market with competing brands...but as you can see jarred already said neah...
what im worried about now then, is if it's 6k and not full frame, what will the 4k crop be? if its anything less then s35 then its pretty much a no go for most people i know.
Click to expand...

Why? S35 at 5k for a nicely oversampled 4k delivery is more Red’s philosophy.
 
Phil Holland said:
There is actually enough information within that photograph to extrapolate an approximate sensor size.

Doesn't require zooming in however. Just dissecting all of the elements within the image.
Click to expand...

Assuming an industry standard countertop height and seat height, the bottom of the seat to the top of the counter is ~12", which conveniently bisects the frame vertically. So the 2.4:1 frame is roughly 2' tall and 4.8' wide. Assuming the 8' focus distance on the lens is at the first chair, then math works out that with that focal length of 35mm, the sensor size is somewhere in the S35 area. But there's a lot of assumptions to make there.

David Rasberry said:
I don’t think Red ever “gimps” their cameras beyond the necessary limitations imposed by hardware choices necessary to meet a given price point. Komodo should give us everything the state of the art allowed at hardware design lock.
Click to expand...

Perhaps I should rephrase that. The perception was that they were gimped, whether that was the case or not. It's like the feeling of being nickeled and dimed. Charge someone a one time fee and they're fine, split the same total into a bunch of small fees and they feel like you're charging for every little thing even when the total is exactly the same. Humans are strange.

So DSMC2 unified "feels" better to the consumer because there's no hidden "gotchas" in the features. You pick your format size and resolution and you're ready to go. It wears its limitations on its sleeve.

So that's sorta what I mean. I think RED is going to work to make sure the perception is right this time. If there's too many gotchas it's gonna steer people away, IMO.
 
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Christoffer Glans said:
Another thought... looking back at the old Scarlet cameras, they were branded 6K, but they could only do 1-12 fps in 6K, while they operated at 5K 24fps. So Komodo might not even work at normal fps at 6K. I do think, however, that in order to compete with other bodies, 6K 50 fps is needed in 2020. I don't think it's reasonable to do a Scarlet 12 fps again.
Click to expand...

OG Scarlet was actually branded 5k and shot in 4k 24fps.
 
jordan levy said:
one with limited specs such as frame rates and compressions in order to compete with what's coming to market with competing brands...but as you can see jarred already said neah...
what im worried about now then, is if it's 6k and not full frame, what will the 4k crop be? if its anything less then s35 then its pretty much a no go for most people i know.
Click to expand...

You are worried in case it might be a raw recording cinema quality camera, in 6K resolution, standard cinematography S35 format, using off the shelf media, and with smallest size and lowest price in Red's product lineup ?

13 years ago we were ecstatic about a 4K tank 4 times the price and size and ten times the weight.
 
I mean it could be 6K and traditional Full Frame... as in 36mm wide (and still not as large as Monstro's 41mm wide).

But yeah...Komodo is probably 30mm wide (ie S35+ like Gemini, Helium and Dragon).

And yes...certainly larger than the 24-25mm width of s35.
 
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