Dsmc2 audio modules?

[Dave Draper]

NOW we are talking....

Damn straight, homie.

 

[Dave Draper]

A RED designed Vlock I/O module with sound devices preamps and analog limiters shut up and take my money.

Gotta have those RED aesthetics.

 

[Brian F Kobylarz]

Let's add a SuperSlot to the module design.
( superslot.org/about )

And why not make the battery mount style be a choice.(V or AB).

 

[Scott Selman]

Can I get 5 redusers to swear by the omod xlr2? I still think its looks to be the cleanest, cable less solution for dsmc2. If anybody finds that you getting better audio recording onboard camera please elaborate.

I like to finish the onboard audio once for all!
//Joel

-1 here... I returned my unit. The team sent me a second one, because we thought the first one might have some issues. Same problems - and my background is in audio. Running from my Sound Devices, peaking levels all over the place. Plugging a mic in, peaking levels and clipping. AES- not any better. Sorry but I prayed this was my audio savior - but at least on my Scarlet-W - it was not.

Also -1 for the Mini Papi, returned mine as well. The photos on their website (and the manual) so a -20 db switch.. that didn't exist on my unit. The case is also basically 3D printed, so I had no hope it would hold up in the field. First time I used it the mic would clip the red input with the preamp turned to 0 - and the internal settings turned to 0... second time I tried to use it I got nothing but noise.

I now use my Sound Devices mixers into an A-Box and run into the camera when I'm in the studio.

In the field I've fed my Lectro wireless directly into the camera as well and had great results.

 

[Joel Arvidsson]

Crap im litterature write my order of the omod xlr2 when reading this... I have been battling on getting the omod or sound devices like the mixpre3,6 or 10 going into reds vlock expander using 3,5 input.

So you say this gives cleaner audio?


I know red had a firmware version that gave a grounding issue with the omod xlr2. Can this have coursed the problems?

 

[DJ Meyer]

I just ordered a MixPre 6. Most of the on-camera modules seem to be a crap shoot.

 

[Jake Wilganowski]

It's funny but not in a comical way that we are this deep into dsmc2 and there's not something that just works. Points to deeper issues

 

[Joel Arvidsson]

It's funny but not in a comical way that we are this deep into dsmc2 and there's not something that just works. Points to deeper issues

Yeah, madness! I think we have waited patiently on a solid audio module for the dsmc2. There is really no excuse that we don’t have a great onboard audio module for all of us that is not in Hollywood.

Maby a mixpre10 is the way to go since it got built in timecod generator (to have this option to.). But it is tolarge for most locations.
But interviews and studio work it would be fine.

 

[Joel Arvidsson]

I just ordered a MixPre 6. Most of the on-camera modules seem to be a crap shoot.

Why not mixpre 3 or 10? I fine with 2xlr but the 6 have a little higher recording option and the 10 have the timecode generator. What was your logic for your choices?

 

[DJ Meyer]

Why not mixpre 3 or 10? I fine with 2xlr but the 6 have a little higher recording option and the 10 have the timecode generator. What was your logic for your choices?

The 6 is not that much more money and only slightly larger than the 3, and has more flexibility for channels. But it was a bit of a decision to go 3 or 6.

 

[andrewhake]

The 6 is not that much more money and only slightly larger than the 3, and has more flexibility for channels. But it was a bit of a decision to go 3 or 6.

Yeah the 6 really isn't much bigger than the 3 just slightly wider. The only thing that would make the MixPre 6 better is if there was a MixPre 6T variant with the same built in time code generator that the 10 has. Would also be really cool if DSMC2 could send TC and record trigger out via HDMI.

 

[andrewhake]

It's funny but not in a comical way that we are this deep into dsmc2 and there's not something that just works. Points to deeper issues

I really think it is just up to Red to make a dedicated module for this type of use. Their Redvolt module seems to be the only one at the moment that is issue free and provides phantom power. The issue is that it is about twice as large with twice as many IO options than needed for this type of use. It's quite expensive with a lot of IO and powering options that this type of use does not need. I think the deeper issue is that it's just difficult to manufacture and test a proper module and requires a lot more resources than most third parties have. I really just think Red should have more modules available. There are essentially only 2 expander module options, the base expander I/O set, and the Redvolt expander I/O set.

I definitely think a dedicated V-Lock Audio module with:

-DC-in
-HD-SDI
-HDMI
-3.5mm stereo in
-3.5 stereo out
-2 XLR or mini XLR with phantom power
-high quality pre-amps on all audio inputs
-analog limiters
-built in timecode generator with TC in and out

would sell very well.

If they could get all that in a package about twice as deep as the standard V-Lock IO expander and sell it for around $2500 I would definitely buy one. Probably even $3000. If the module was deeper that may leave some room on the top of the module and left hand side for other things as well.

 

[David Peterson]

Yeah, madness! I think we have waited patiently on a solid audio module for the dsmc2. There is really no excuse that we don’t have a great onboard audio module for all of us that is not in Hollywood.

Maby a mixpre10 is the way to go since it got built in timecod generator (to have this option to.). But it is tolarge for most locations.
But interviews and studio work it would be fine.

The MixPre10T is crazy small for a ten channel recorder. What do you mean "too large"?!?!?!
Or do you mean for mounting on a camera? Yeah, then a MixPre3 is the way to go.

However generally speaking if any one is considering buying a field recorder for filmmaking (and they don't have a budget of three grand plus) then the best choice by far to go with is the new Zoom F8n. Or if the budget is extremely tight, then a Zoom F4.

As the MixPre series are not really primarily targeted at sound recordists, more for YouTubers/videographers/musicians/etc instead. Thus when you really dig into it the MixPre series just has too many gaps in their capabilities/designs for what we need. Thus this is why Sound Devices has their 6 series instead for you to buy.

Meanwhile, Zoom has thrown the kitchen sink at their F series, which is what makes the F4 and now the F8n the best fit for my needs currently.

I really think it is just up to Red to make a dedicated module for this type of use. Their Redvolt module seems to be the only one at the moment that is issue free and provides phantom power. The issue is that it is about twice as large with twice as many IO options than needed for this type of use. It's quite expensive with a lot of IO and powering options that this type of use does not need.

I definitely think a dedicated V-Lock Audio module with:

-DC-in
-HD-SDI
-HDMI
-3.5mm stereo in
-3.5 stereo out
-2 XLR or mini XLR with phantom power
-high quality pre-amps on all audio inputs
-analog limiters
-built in timecode generator with TC in and out

would sell very well.

If they could get all that in a package about twice as deep as the standard V-Lock IO expander and sell it for around $2500 I would definitely buy one. Probably even $3000. If the module was deeper that may leave some room on the top of the module and left hand side for other things as well.

And to that a slot to take a wireless receiver as well, that would be really nice, such as the Lectrosonics SR series which are designed for this purpose.

Also having AES input would be useful.

Yeah the 6 really isn't much bigger than the 3 just slightly wider. The only thing that would make the MixPre 6 better is if there was a MixPre 6T variant with the same built in time code generator that the 10 has. Would also be really cool if DSMC2 could send TC and record trigger out via HDMI.

I'd strongly suspect that using the timecode output would be a way trigger an external recorder with TC? (such as any MixPre recorder, or any Zoom F series, and many others)

Would at least be worth a try.

 

[Scot Yount]

The MixPre10T is crazy small for a ten channel recorder. What do you mean "too large"?!?!?!
Or do you mean for mounting on a camera? Yeah, then a MixPre3 is the way to go.

However generally speaking if any one is considering buying a field recorder for filmmaking (and they don't have a budget of three grand plus) then the best choice by far to go with is the new Zoom F8n. Or if the budget is extremely tight, then a Zoom F4.

As the MixPre series are not really primarily targeted at sound recordists, more for YouTubers/videographers/musicians/etc instead. Thus when you really dig into it the MixPre series just has too many gaps in their capabilities/designs for what we need. Thus this is why Sound Devices has their 6 series instead for you to buy.

Meanwhile, Zoom has thrown the kitchen sink at their F series, which is what makes the F4 and now the F8n the best fit for my needs currently.

the Zoom stuff have digital limiters. The Sound Devices MixPre stuff analog.....That difference alone is what made me go Sound Devices....

 

[andrewhake]

The MixPre10T is crazy small for a ten channel recorder. What do you mean "too large"?!?!?!
Or do you mean for mounting on a camera? Yeah, then a MixPre3 is the way to go.

However generally speaking if any one is considering buying a field recorder for filmmaking (and they don't have a budget of three grand plus) then the best choice by far to go with is the new Zoom F8n. Or if the budget is extremely tight, then a Zoom F4.

Personally I come at this from the perspective of a non-professional videographer or sound recordist, I am a vfx artist who does a lot of video/sound personal projects and dabbles in this world and helps friends who are pros in this field when they need help and I have the time. If I am helping a friend on a project I tend to focus on either helping them shoot or helping them with sound. But for my own projects I am doing on my own it is very one man band so being able to have more built into the camera would be great when I am only able to capture audio from mics mounted to the camera. In many cases I will even setup sound recorder and and mics in a different location from my camera, so being able to keep them in sync without extra gear attached would be great.

As the MixPre series are not really primarily targeted at sound recordists, more for YouTubers/videographers/musicians/etc instead. Thus when you really dig into it the MixPre series just has too many gaps in their capabilities/designs for what we need. Thus this is why Sound Devices has their 6 series instead for you to buy.

Meanwhile, Zoom has thrown the kitchen sink at their F series, which is what makes the F4 and now the F8n the best fit for my needs currently.

For me the big sell on the MixPre is the analog limiters and the quality of preamps and headphone output. Plus all sorts of smartly implemented features they have been able to pack in like HDMI timecode in and record trigger. I also really like Sound Devices approach to UI and user experience. I would imagine really high quality limiters are less important for a dedicated sound recordist because that is obviously a huge part of the job. Personally I do a lot of recording of extremely loud cars and race cars and the analog limiters on MixPre are a revelation for me. If it isn't cars it is often some very uncontrolled environment where the limiters definitely come in handy.

And to that a slot to take a wireless receiver as well, that would be really nice, such as the Lectrosonics SR series which are designed for this purpose.

Also having AES input would be useful.

I'd strongly suspect that using the timecode output would be a way trigger an external recorder with TC? (such as any MixPre recorder, or any Zoom F series, and many others)

Yeah wireless receiver would be amazing as well. Why a slot for wireless receiver though? Just build it right in. I would imagine that could add a bit to the cost though.

And yes timecode generator with output would allow the main camera to be the master for everything else. Maybe even have a dedicated battery for it so there is less chance for drift.

Sync additional cameras and have dedicated sound recordists sync their recorders without the need for a bunch of external TC boxes. Even better if this (and record trigger) can just be done wirelessly. If I could wirelessly transmit sync TC from my camera to recorders I would be extremely happy. I love things like tentacle sync and UltraSync with it's dedicated TC network, but it just seems odd that this sort of thing is still necessary and not just built right into these devices. It's not even necessarily the need to be able to continuously transmit TC to a recorder, just being able to wirelessly jam sync the devices would be great. I am probably just being naive but as someone coming from another part of the industry, it seems like it would make a lot of sense for every pro camera and sound recorder to have reliable built in timecode generators that can simply be synced when beginning shooting and reliably stay in sync throughout the day. Or the ability to connect to a standardized timecode/ctrl network.

 

[Joel Arvidsson]

So the start/stop triggering does not work with red cameras?
https://www.sounddevices.com/supported-cameras

 

[sreenivasa reddy s]

Hi to pro's that deal with sound,
Can we use the A10 Digital Wireless Microphone System from Audio Limited with the transmitter attached to a shotgun mic as a boom and the receiver directly feeding the RED. This is just to get a better quality of sound into the Camera because in Chennai, India, we use the sound only as a scratch and later dub the dialogues in a studio. This is only for the feature film work with minimum crew.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

I wonder if the brain is able to record real AES input or if it's input is analog and there is an A/D convertion taking place?


My wish module :


-DC-in
- 2x dtap 12v output
-2x HD-SDI (loop out) (well placed that it's close and protected by the module).
-HDMI
-3.5mm stereo in
-3.5 stereo out
-2x TA3 in or 1x TA5 better -> split to 2x XLR or 2x TA3 (why do people still use XLR on their camera mics?)
-high quality pre-amps on 2 audio transformer less inputs (Sonosax like with 132dB dynamic (no need to worry about overload), with digital transformer balanced AES3 or AES42)
-analog limiters with trimming possibilities
- control pannel for both tracks
-built in timecode generator with TC in and out
- Superslot place for reciever.
- Integrated Vlock
- Small size
- 4 mounting points on the top


Pat

 

[sreenivasa reddy s]

Hi Patrick,
This will be a great module if there can also be three outs for running the FIZ motors with the control in the module. A complete package.

 

[Patrick Tresch]

Hi Patrick,
This will be a great module if there can also be three outs for running the FIZ motors with the control in the module. A complete package.

I use the RTmotion sidekick and I find it a better solution/position for FIZ than having cables coming from the back of the camera. So I wouldn't built it in in my dream module ;-)

Pat