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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

DSMC Leica M Mount

Is there a definitive list of Leica M lenses which work with the new mount and which don't?
 
Not yet...


That’s a lot of expensive lenses to check out.

I wondering if that front light baffle that surrounds the physical sensor can be removed or modified in some way. I.e. if it’s replaced with something else that has a larger circular recess around the sensor rather than the socketed shaft that it is now, then perhaps all possible M type lenses would work pretty well.

Might need to have extra notched steps in the geometry to control internally reflected light better.

Does anyone from RED have a photo of the front baffle removed so that it is possible to see if a different shroud/front matt would be possible?THANKS!

Eric
 
Jarred Land said:
The Official RED DSMC Leica M mount

1320552451.jpg



The mount is finishing testing and should be in the store early December.

Fits both EPIC and Scarlet. Seals for dust and light.

Aluminum version $800.

I have a feeling " Leica M lenses " is going to be the search of the day on Ebay :)
Click to expand...

Holy gift!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jarred... This is incredible!!!

Thanks Sir!

Antoine
 
James Brundige said:
right here, post 12, from pawel

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?60516-Leica-M-mount-lenses-on-EPIC/page2
Click to expand...

I see, I guess that rather than the front surface of the casing being a separate “bulk head” instead it looks integral to the casing of the camera. What I was hoping was that the front recess could be modified somehow so that a deeper circular recess could be made for the biogon style wider angle M’s.

Maybe I make a sketch or some such to illustrate what I mean more accurately perhaps with some dimensions… meanwhile it’s a BEAUTIFULL day here in NM so will spend it with kids and horses.

Will check in back later.

Thanks James!

Eric
 

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paulcurtis said:
One thing to be aware of with rangefinder glass is that you may see colour shifts at the edges of the frames with the wider lenses. The M9 compensates for this in camera and also has a specific sensor that tilts the micro lenses at the edges. The issue is simply that the exit pupil of the lens is so close to the film plane that the light rays are not tele centric like an SLR lens.

So the wide lenses may cause colour shifts and perhaps corner blurring.

On the other hand there are some wonderful vintage LTM lenses. The old Canon RF are beautiful in character and Voightlander have a lovely range of affordable leica glass. Their 12mm is really nice. I use these lenses on sony NEX cameras for stills and the occasional hard to get video shot in tight places. Lovely small combination.

cheers
paul
Click to expand...

hey Paul, given the crop factor on Epic and Scarlet they should be ok. I shoot a M8 and M9, and also used my leica glass on NEX-5 and never saw it from 18MM and up. I am pumped to try on my Epic!
 
Jarred, what would you say the odds of a Leica "S" mount appearing sometime in 2012. (Even if auto-focus is not enabled, just the mount.) Just trying to figure out whether to invest in more M glass or S glass, pro's and con's. I'm definitely not buying any lenses that aren't Epic/Scarlet compatible, that's for sure :)
 
Jarred Land said:
The Official RED DSMC Leica M mount

1320552451.jpg



The mount is finishing testing and should be in the store early December.

Fits both EPIC and Scarlet. Seals for dust and light.

Aluminum version $800.

I have a feeling " Leica M lenses " is going to be the search of the day on Ebay :)
Click to expand...


Come to papa!

Jarred...thanks for making this happen. Sanjin, welcome back.
 
Jarred Land said:
OK.. I just unbanned Sanjin... someone let him know. He will be happy with this..

Although the credit for really making me green light this mount is Mark Read from Pier 59, who begged me for this back in April and kept beeping me every week till I agreed :)
Click to expand...

thanks for letting him come back inside to play... haha. welcome back sanjin, try to play nice :)
 
I wonder how the Voigtländer M-mount lenses work on the Epic. (If they will mount.)

28mm f2 VM Ultron $629
2247.jpg


35mm f1.2 Asph VM II $1399
3319.jpg


40mm f1.4 VM Nokton $529
939.jpg


50mm f1.1 Nokton $1049
2521.jpg


75mm f1.8 Heliar Classic $759
3094.jpg
 
28 doesnt look like it will, that back element looks like its RIGHT out there
 
Just so we can figure stuff out…

Does anyone at RED or anyone else know the depth of the recess (in mms) from the top of the rectangular flange that directly surrounds the sensor down to the plane of the sensor?

I don’t have an Epic to hand to take that measurement myself, not that anyone should be poking objects onto their sensor/blocking filter.

Thanks in Advance,

Eric
 

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Pawel thanks for the image.

Also I know very well it's not so much space left but could be possible to get some lenses to work!?

It's about to keep lightweight and still use as much as possible some of those optically excellent lenses.

One limited range of the lenses that could be possible to fit EPIC and Scarlet that will start with wide angle lenses @ 35mm and end with telephoto lens @ 135mm...

Here below is a kind of unconfirmed list of lenses that could possible fit:

Wide angle:

Voigtländer Nokton 35mm f/1.4

Leica Summarit-M 35mm f/2.5

Voigtländer Nokton 40mm f/1.4

Standard lenses:

Leica Noctilux-M 50 mm f/0.95 ASPH

Leica Summilux-M 50mm f/1.4

Voigtländer Nokton 50mm f/1.1

Carl Zeiss C SonnarT*1,5/50 ZM

Leica Summicron-M f/2.0

Voigtländer Heliar 50mm f/2.0

Leica Summarit-M 50 mm f/2.5

Telephoto lenses:

LEICA APO-SUMMICRON-M 75 mm f/2 ASPH

LEICA SUMMARIT-M 75 mm f/2.5

LEICA APO-SUMMICRON-M 90 mm f/2 ASPH

LEICA SUMMARIT-M 90 mm f/2.5

LEICA APO-TELYT-M 135 mm f/3.4 ASPH

Voigtländer 75 mm / F 1,8 Heliar

Carl Zeiss Planar T* 2/50 ZM

Carl Zeiss Tele-Tessar T* 4 / 85 ZM

Also don't forget many vintage lenses from those and other brands in that focal range can be very good as an additional option.

A 2 or 3 lens system can therefore easily be carried in the pockets of a sports jacket.

Rangefinder Light Weight Small Lenses by Luminous Landscape>>>
 
Sanjin thanks for the awsome list.

At some stage I have to work through some of the things that are relevent to our applications and try to comapre near equivalents with near equivalents..

For example (and BTW I don't work for ZEISS)...

Zeiss has a good looking M 35mm/f2.0 lens that does not appear to have protruding elements.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/361547-REG/Zeiss_1365_658_35mm_f_2_ZM_Lens.html

price is $1005.00

And here’s it’s closest cousin in the Leica range…

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/520349-REG/Leica_11_643_35mm_f_2_5_Summarit_M_Manual.html

Price is $1695.00

If you compare the data sheets then you will find that the Zeiss 35mm/f2.0 has MUCH lower distortion than the Leica Summarit M 35/2.5

However the contrast may be very slightly punchier on the Leica than the Zeiss.

Generally when you are dealing with Biogons/symmetric type lenses… this can be a design trade off between radial distortion and contrast/favorable MTF. Not easy to have a super high contrast Biogon with very low distortion (Schneider Krueznach has achived that with some of their 'Apo-Digitar" (symetric) offerings but are generally for larger formats but the detail is astounding. BTW I don't work for Schneider either!). This is why you will find a distagon type layout in some cases sneaked into the verious "M" lines to help with improved contrast at the expense of distortion for the medium to medium/wide angle lenses.

The Leica M 35/2.5 really has superb mechanics. I was quite surprised that the price of the Leica M 35/2.5 was only $1695.00, I was expecting it to be much more expensive.

In our case for some s-3d applications it easy for us to re-engineer the Zeiss M 35/2.5... BUT if I was a regular shooter and didn’t care about radial distortion then the Leica M 35/2.5 is a sexier lens to use for sure, nice feel and extra ring features.

Hopefully we get to test both on the Scartet-X at very least :)

Zeiss M 35 mm data sheet: http://applications.zeiss.com/C12578620052CA69/0/8B0311D44FCD838CC125786400471C37/$file/biogon2_35mm_zm_e.pdf

Here’s the Leica data sheet for the M35/2.5

http://us.leica-camera.com/service/downloads/lenses_for_rangefinder_cameras/summarit-m_35_mm_f25/

Cheers,

Eric
 
Thanks Sanjin, welcome back.
Talking about your last post... we can use a Leica R to Eos too, right?
But R to M is cooler... agreed.

Cheers.
 
Matt Johnston said:
I sure wish those 12's and 15's could be made to fit.
Click to expand...

Looking through the Zeiss range of M’s

And in terms of shorter focal lengths shorter than 35mm there is on a lot of these lenses “protruding rear elements”.

From what I can measure and tell if the front bulk head of the EPIC/Scarlet had a recess (introduced) of approximately 35mm in diameter and was dropped down approximately 12 mm or even slightly less, then that should clear virtually all M type lenses that have rear protruding elements. [I have no idea what is behind that bulk head...there probably is not an atom of space left to do such a thing?].

It looks as though that the front bulk head (under the mounting plate) is integral to the camera. So unless that front bulk head is removable someone would have to machine a recess into the front face of the camera and also build a new flange/cowling/mask for the sensor.

Only the guys at RED know if they can do that or I think the guys at Spacecam have alluded to some sort of solution on their web site as being a possibility for the future.

BUT… Jarred did mention in passing something about the possibility of a relay lens, ie. something that can extend and shift the plane of focus. It basically inverts the image and extends the optical tube by creating intermediate planes of focus. Not sure how that might degrade optical performance but might be worth a go?

Interestingly there have been a few smaller lens manufacturers that talk about having a telecentric "core" to the lens for cinematic applications. I should probably have a closer look at Optiteck web site etc. and some others...

Cheers,

Eric
 
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