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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Dragon w/New OLPF issue? (Addressed by Red)

Brent@RED said:
OK, quick update.

When we do this OLPF flip in-house, we have the luxury of clean rooms, custom jigs, and specialized tools. Plus a staff handling camera repair on a daily basis. Not exactly something you can easily replicate in your workshop : )

So, our production team, ME's and repair teams are working on two things. The first thing is creating a process you guys can use to perform this with minimal risk of damaging something or inducing debris. All assuming you don't have a clean room in your basement, ha. So, they are testing various methods and off-the-shelf tools to see what works best.

The second thing is once that process and tool kit is mapped out, our tech writing team will create the end-user work instructions.

We will go as quickly as we can to make these available to you - but we want to make sure we give you the best resources to do the job.

Meanwhile, like Jarred said, if you happen to be shouting distance from one of our service centers and need this done quickly, that is your best bet. Depending on volume, if you drop off in AM, should be done by COB that day.
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First needs to be the test, which we can do without a clean room. Thanks.
 
Ok, i just saw this movie:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1091191/?ref_=nm_knf_i1

Lone Survivor, other than it made 124 millions in theatres (with 40 millions budget) i can say is quite a masterpiecein his genre.

For a dozen times the DP was looking for that devilish flare, and he got it, dozen times, just watch the movie and you will spot it simply.
Now i understand that the movie was shot with Epic with the old MX sensor and, obviously, the old OLPF.
The fact is: that flare in that movie is AWESOME. The movie is mostly shot against sun (in the battlefield) and you can see many kind of flares. Shot with optimo and fujinon cabrio. Now if you cut at the editing that flare, the movie lose something in awesoness.

My opinion? Seriously? You must keep the Red M, because it was awesome, and with less dynamic range you can do something that you can't do with more dynamic range. Then, you must keep Red Mx, because it have a better lowlight. And the equation continues on the fact you must buy the Dragon because it's the best camera out there. But keep a VHS camera, because you can use it like Scorsese in Wolf of Wall Street. Or an Hi8: you can shoot The Blair Witch Project with it.

I keep everything for two reasons:

First: Every camera is a tool. Sometime a very different one, like a hammer and a knife.

Second: Never spit in the dish where you use to eat (respect every tool helped you to make money, or to express yourself).

Cheers
 
All respect Jean: The OLPF/Sensor red dot flare is the tail wagging the dog. If I want that style of flare for creative reasons then that is a decision I want to make as DP. Lenses flare - cameras don't. RED knows this and is working hard to fix the issue. From what I read on this thread - they have it solved.

BTW: according to Steven Soderberh's speech on RU . . . a movie with a $40M budget will require a $30M marketing budget and, therefore, needs to bring in $140M before it is considered a breakeven project ;-)
 
Hi Zeb,

40 millions i pretty think included the distribution, since some stars in the movie co-produced it.

Anyway you have right, and in my post i have written that, in that movie, the infamous flare is considered artistic.

But starting from your point of view, we should destroy every lens that is not precise like Master Primes, or doesn't have a nice look like S4. Why having a 6k camera with lens that resolve 35 lines per mm?(standard Lomo). Movies are still engaged to creativity, i said in the previous post that of course we need the best technology (Dragon, new OLPF, etcetera) but we gain something, and we lose something else, depending on the project.

So i repeat, pick a Dragon, but keep an MX too would be the best choice for artistic purpose. If we have money to stick only with one camera, so it's ok to take only the newest one.

Cheers
 
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Jean Maurizio said:
(snip) . . . But starting from your point of view, we should destroy every lens that is not precise like Master Primes, or doesn't have a nice look like S4.
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errr . . . no

Predictable lens flare is a creative choice that can be made by the DP to support an emotional tone or add effect. I own a couple old Zeiss standard speeds for this purpose and I am always on the lookout for uncoated, gritty old glass.

Camera sensors and internal body parts should not flare. Period. It is just where we are currently with an evolving technology. Hoping it's fixed since, in looking at some of my footage I shot last week, the red dot flare made itself the unwelcome star of the show several times. :-(
 
In fact Alexa does not flare. But do you have this red dot flare problem even with the IR-cut filter?
 
Like the OP says . . . "New OLPF" . . . just got installed backwards it appears ;-)
 
Hope you, and all Dragon's users, will resolve soon this problem, and nice to hear about uncoated gritty lenses: i love them too ;-)
 
Hello all.

I just preformed the OLPF flip and can confirm that this solves the red dots issue. All is good:)
 
I would not recommend doing the flip unless you are a professional lens technician with proper tools. It's very easy to damage the frame and the filter. RED did not recommend me doing it at this stage, but I had no choice as the camera is going out tomorrow. And of course, you do not do this in the field...

;)
 
OLPF Flare - Before and After

OLPF Flare - Before and After

Hey RED Brothers & Sisters,
So I took a road trip up to 34 Parker this morning to have the RED Elves flip my OLPF to the correct orientation. It is with gladness in my heart that I can report that the flip really did fixed the issue. I was going to shoot the same scene at the same T-11 but with the OLPF in the correct position you could not see any red dot sensor flare. I had to close up the iris to T-22 to get any effect to show and even then it is a pleasing pink natural looking flare. Attached is the before and after shots. I jacked with the clarity, contrast and exposure in LR to accentuate the effect on both images. The images are not pretty but that was not the exercise. I was attempting to break the sensor on both before and after.

I also shot a short vid of that same scene panning in and out of the sun - no weird flares - very natural.

Cheers!!
 

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Note, while the actual flip takes the 15 min or so Jarred quoted, we still do all out inbound QC and then outbound QC like backfocus check, etc. So, we will try to do "same day" for everyone. Like, we get in morning and get back out by end of day. But it is not a "wait in the lobby" kind of thing : )
 
I'll be the first to say that RED has its flaws. But the way they fessed up to this issue, from the highest levels, and got a fix in place is something that Toyota and other "quality leaders" could learn from. Shit happens - it's how you respond that defines you
 
Zeb B said:
I'll be the first to say that RED has its flaws. But the way they fessed up to this issue, from the highest levels, and got a fix in place is something that Toyota and other "quality leaders" could learn from. Shit happens - it's how you respond that defines you
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Couldn't agree more. Red's willingness to improve their own products when there is a flaw, is pretty remarkable. And the customer service is outstanding.
 
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