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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Dragon Upgrade Predictions for Scarlet-X

Predictions:

6k 12fps
5k 30 fps
4k 50fps

Wishes:

6k 25 fps
5k 50 fps
4k 120 fps

Price, hopefully < 10k. Any more and I'll probably just save for an Epic.

Oh Scarlet forum and wild speculation, let it begin.
 
@ Jerrod I luv your optimism . But I bet it will be a lot more than that, I reckon Josef is right.
 
Jerrod Cordell said:
Half the price of the Epic Upgrade.

So $3,000.

6K: 12 fps
5K: 25 fps
4k: 60 fps
2K: 120 fps

And of course HDRx is half the frame of all the above.
Click to expand...

My FPS predictions are in line with yours, aside from the fact that I hope we'll see 30fps 5K, but it's already been said that the SCARLET upgrade will be more than the EPIC, due to the fact that they need to replace more internal boards. So I'm guessing $7,000-$8,000 for the Scarlet upgrade.
 
Jerrod Cordell said:
Half the price of the Epic Upgrade. So $3,000.
Click to expand...

Highly unlikely. Jim explained that while the Scarlet upgrade is possible, it's more complicated than the Epic upgrade. With the Epic, they have to replace a few boards, make some small adjustments, put the new sensor in and call it a day. With the Scarlet, it's a bit more difficult since the ASICs, most of the basic components will have to be completely taken apart and replaced in order to support the 6k resolution. Factor in the labor to do that extra disassembling and the price will almost certainly be more than the Epic upgrade. Otherwise, why would anyone buy an Epic?

I'd say the Dragon upgrade for Scarlet will cost more than the Epic, yet will at least provide 25FPS 6K. This will leave some breathing room between the Scarlet and the Epic.

Price: 30% more than Epic upgrade, around $8K or $9K = total cost of Scarlet $18K compared to $40K Epic.

We can always hope for...

6K: 25
5K: 50
4K: 120
2K: 300!?!?

...I would pay 9K for HALF of those numbers. I'm just factoring in the RED "exceeding expectations" factor into my guesses. Since we're all speculating, after all.
 
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Scarlet will never be able to shoot 24fps at max EPIC resolutions. RED will maintain that gap between the camera for both technological and business reasons. You can, however, expect 4.5k (or maybe even 5, but unlikely) at 24fps.

Jannard laid it out pretty well; Take current resolutions and framerates (ex; 3k at 48fps), and because of the increased pixel density, you get moderately higher resolutions at same frame rate (ex; 3.5k at 48). These jumps may be a bit bigger, but I would hope for something like 2k at 96fps.
 
The official word was earlier that the Dragon upgrade to Scarlet would cost more than the upgrade for Epic. Although I think at that time the reasoning was the Epic upgrade would be just the sensor, and the Scarlet upgrade would be ASICs and sensor. But that might've changed, since the upgrade also ups the framerates on the Epic. So I'm guessing the Scarlet upgrade could be anywhere between $5k and $10k. I hope it's closer to $5k.

25fps@5K and whatever trickles down from that to the lower resolutions is what I'd like to see.
 
Niko Pueringer said:
Jannard laid it out pretty well; Take current resolutions and framerates (ex; 3k at 48fps), and because of the increased pixel density, you get moderately higher resolutions at same frame rate (ex; 3.5k at 48). These jumps may be a bit bigger, but I would hope for something like 2k at 96fps.
Click to expand...
I don't see how higher pixel density would make higher resolutions/framerates possible. The camera needs to push through more data, so it needs more horsepower as well. The question really is, how much more horsepower will there be coming.
 
I think 6K: 12 fps, 5K: 25 fps, 4k: 60 fps, 2K: 120 fps is what the most Scarlet users dreams...realistically and logically in my eyes.

A price between 5000$ and 8000$ must be calculated for sure.
 
I'd imagine the price would be around $3000,-$4000, less the EPIC

120fps in either 3K, 4K would be awesome

cant wait to hear the news on it

much better then buying another canon, then another, then another

buy RED, stay with RED ;)
 
An actual dragon.
 
Red has already said that the price will be more than Epic because of the need to replace more components.

Any way you look at it, the 15stops of dynamic range is awesome. With (I hope) the ability to use HDRx at higher resolutions/frame rates, I am quite interested.
 
Jannard said:
Can Scarlet-X be upgraded to the new Dragon sensor when it is released?
Yes. However the upgrade will be more expensive than upgrading an EPIC due to the necessity to change several primary boards. There will still be data rate limitations to Scarlet after the upgrade as compared with EPIC.
Click to expand...

I'll be glad if this has changed, but for now I'd prepare for $6k+ to upgrade a Scarlet.
 
Niko Pueringer said:
Scarlet will never be able to shoot 24fps at max EPIC resolutions. RED will maintain that gap between the camera for both technological and business reasons.
Click to expand...

I don't think business considerations have anything to do with it it, at least not in the sense you are suggesting. It is mainly a factor of Red trying to maximize the yields on the ASICs. By going with much more conservative specs on the Scarlet, they are able to maximize the yield. If the Dragon design is less prone to failure overall, the baseline goes up for Scarlet and maybe we get 24fps 6k. I think that Red is probably most interested in getting Scarlet to motion capable 5k so that all of their cameras can shoot for proper 4k finish.
 
I can't afford to buy a new camera because that's what it cost after getting an upgrade for the scarlet!... 8 to 9K??? hell that's what i paid for it. i know it's set for next year but you have to have the warranty right? Dude I'm done... I can't buy another car priced camra... Just get my brand new 4K camera working properly so I can make movies now.
 
What I don't understand is if the Dragon upgrade will be standard moving forward (post release obviously), why you'd bay more than $6k to upgrade. Just buy a new brain. I think if RED wants to offer the upgrade to Scarlet owners, they will have to cut their margins on the upgrade and bring it in sub-6k. Otherwise, I just don't see the incentive.
 
David Granger said:
What I don't understand is if the Dragon upgrade will be standard moving forward (post release obviously), why you'd bay more than $6k to upgrade. Just buy a new brain. I think if RED wants to offer the upgrade to Scarlet owners, they will have to cut their margins on the upgrade and bring it in sub-6k. Otherwise, I just don't see the incentive.
Click to expand...

I'm sure the cost of the Scarlet brain will go up too. Maybe total cost won't be as much as an original Scarlet + upgrade (accounting for manual labor hollowing it out and adding new components), but I'd say the new dragoon brain will be looking around 14k or so.

Scarlet owners shouldn't stress, we're in good hands.
 
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