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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

DRAGON - ITS THE REAL DEAL !!!!

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If you properly shoot on MX and do proper downscale (not premiere or final cut) difference between MX and Dragon might be substantial in 1080P. But. If you ever think about delivering to 4K display, for example. Difference between MX and Dragon will be H U G E. And you will see it instantly.
 
Great work Toia.

As with your London TVC from years ago (that was my final push to get an Epic).... this has conformed a jump to Dragon.

Damn you Sir! (in a nice way of course!) :)

Funny how slow the Vimeo download is at the moment. The 1080 Mov is taking ages and the 1080 MP4 arrived in about 25 secs (just had 100mb fibre installed so things have suddenly got fast)... but it looks like Vimeo's server is getting slammed on the mov file.

No doubt this is going to make a bg internet splash today... be ready for an onslaught (or just go and hide :)
 
Mark, thank you, great shots with a great camera! Really convincing images. Looks like Dragon will be able to shoot the northern lights, and that's quite a thing.
 
Eric Z said:
It's really hard to tell how good is the footage I'm looking at, without something to compare to, shot at the same time side-by-side (or one after the other in a studio under controlled lighting).
Is there another upload coming up, where Dragon is compared to M-X?
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...so why does it even matter? beautiful footage stands on its own, even when it's compressed. unrealistic side-by-sides only help the logical portion of your brain feel better about itself, which is pretty illogical to me all things considered. btw, h264 1080p. quantitative measurements are fine and good, but i'm just sayin' you may wanna think about a few things here... :)
 
Thank-you Mark and RED, what a great way to reveal the first footage from Dragon.

I don't think I've shot lower than 10:1 on the Scarlet, seeing 17:1 on those wave/surfing shots is mind-blowing.
 
Eric Z said:
It's really hard to tell how good is the footage I'm looking at, without something to compare to, shot at the same time side-by-side (or one after the other in a studio under controlled lighting).
Is there another upload coming up, where Dragon is compared to M-X?
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Look at the onscreen numbers closely while you watch the images and it is very easy to understand. If you understand what your epic can currently do, it's is very easy to blown away by these shots. It's very hard so simulate these kinds of real world contrast situations with lighting setups.

Read what mark has written. He is saying that where he used to compensate with bounce or fill lighting (because cameras could not read the contrast) he is seeing wide latitude.

Ifyou know the EPIC X there is no need to see a side by side. It's very obvious. Just the Forrest stills alone would require heavy lo con filtration to see into the shadows and preserve highlights, but the dragon is seeing it like your eye would.

That is a small miracle.

david
 
Dmitry Burenok said:
Where? If it is not in Canada I may participate as well :) I'm thinking big like Forth Knox or so :) how many Dragons we can get for the single brick?
About 15 I think. So we need 13 more guys than.
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Why 13 more guys? We just get a backup camera each and a proper set of Leica lenses.
 
Mark Toia said:
The SONY F65 I rate as having the best sensor in the market for a production cine camera. Yes.. it's better than the EPIC- MX. (I'm not going to harp on about the size of it or the price comparisons).
Even Jim knows that Sony have done very well with the F65 sensor and that was obviously pissing him off, because his new Dragon sensor has just given the the F65 notice.
All the F65 SONY purists out there will dispute this. But I have Sony files here with me, and I'm looking at both side by side… and Dragons grain (noise) structure is cleaner and it has more range.
Dragon is now the King. (AND… I'm not going to harp on about the size of it or the price comparisons). or did I ..ha !
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As I love the look the Sony gives, while hating it's clumsy size and workflow, I really love this!
 
David Battistella said:
Look at the onscreen numbers closely while you watch the images and it is very easy to understand. If you understand what your epic can currently do, it's is very easy to blown away by these shots. It's very hard so simulate these kinds of real world contrast situations with lighting setups.

Read what mark has written. He is saying that where he used to compensate with bounce or fill lighting (because cameras could not read the contrast) he is seeing wide latitude.

Ifyou know the EPIC X there is no need to see a side by side. It's very obvious. Just the Forrest stills alone would require heavy lo con filtration to see into the shadows and preserve highlights, but the dragon is seeing it like your eye would.

That is a small miracle.

david
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David,
I have read Mark's notes, and watched the video a few times with close attention to details and DR.
The fact of the matter is - I have seen footage from EPIC M-X that looks very much like what I'm seeing here.
Now, considering that some of the shots were at 17:1 compression, and considering these are all ungraded (except for some small adjustments in RC-X), I do like what I see.

Mind you, it's really hard to judge such a compressed down-ressed video.

However, would be nice to see exactly how much of a difference there is, so I can appreciate the Dragon better.
 
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Mark,

Thanks for the work.
Preparing a feature here in India early next year and will shoot with this marvel.
Merci RED team for making those incredible things possible.
 
Eric Z said:
David,

However, would be nice to see exactly how much of a difference there is, so I can appreciate the Dragon better.
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I am sure we will see reams of that kind of test in the coming months when Dragon hits the street. I appreciate what you are saying,but just based on numbers, compression and low noise high ISO we can see how far along it is. Similar scenes pushed to high iso and high 17:1 compression ratio probably would not hold up as well on the mx footage.

That is the only reason I think it is obvious but that is not to say I don't appreciate what you need to see.

I'm sure we will see a bunch of naysayers too. But from what I see here, what I know about my camera and what it can do, I completely understand that the dragon is exponentially better.

Im not speaking for mark or anything because the images and the exposure data speaks for itself.

David
 
paulherrin said:
...so why does it even matter? beautiful footage stands on its own, even when it's compressed. unrealistic side-by-sides only help the logical portion of your brain feel better about itself, which is pretty illogical to me all things considered. btw, h264 1080p. quantitative measurements are fine and good, but i'm just sayin' you may wanna think about a few things here... :)
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I agree Paul. No need to put sude by side. Its pretty obvious esp the DR and highlights. Just look at the dog shot and the car! Amazing.
 
Thank you Mark.You are great,Thanks Red team also.



Sunil Prem
 
Couple of forest shots looked like motion picture film on steroids (i know, sacrilegious to say like that), I was shooting some test stuff for a friend in a forest with Sony camera back in May and I just can't believe what I see here with apparently no lifted shadows. Insane. I don't know what's the deal with highlights in some crazy hot sun shots, maybe soft contrast curve would help that a bit. Overall, with that kind of sensor they can shoot another sequel to Baraka / Samsara and that will look more than fine, compared to 65mil.
 
Those images + Those numbers = Most amazing thing I've ever seen...

65mm Baraka, eat your heart out.
 
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