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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

DRAGON - ITS THE REAL DEAL !!!!

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For those of you wanting a side by side comparison of MX to Dragon, I DID shoot a few of the same shots in the desert sunlight scenes right after each other. I'll be happy to post those once the Dragon build of RC-X is made available to me. I can't in good faith upload from a 2K DPX and not even get to adjust the shots to my liking off the 6K ANA r3ds first. I would have certainly posted images sooner but as you can all see Jarred and Red have been busy the past few weeks.

I certainly did ASK!
 
Hey RED! Very excited to finally see Dragon rear it's head! More resolution, more latitude, better compression, INSANE! The MX sensor was so good to begin with, that perhaps people are having a hard time seeing the apparent differences. I for one can and will undoubtable be upgrading to Dragon. 6K at 100fps... Yeowzzza!
 
One word. It is "AMAZING" !

Thanks for your hard work Mark. It's all good, lots of questions are answered just by looking at the video and small comments on the shot.

It's all good, really good.

Hats of to RED team. Kudos !

Warm Regars
Rivai
 
Andy Roberts said:
No RCX to use for Dragon footage yet Björn. End of August...
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Aha.

I really like Mark shoots but they do not tell me much. It's looking really nice but so would it do if he used an MX. So the really interesting thing to see would be some charts / gray steps and such. Is there anything like that available here? I been on vacation and have just briefly gone trough some threads here as I been on poor internet...
 
Christopher Probst said:
For those of you wanting a side by side comparison of MX to Dragon, I DID shoot a few of the same shots in the desert sunlight scenes right after each other. I'll be happy to post those once the Dragon build of RC-X is made available to me. I can't in good faith upload from a 2K DPX and not even get to adjust the shots to my liking off the 6K ANA r3ds first. I would have certainly posted images sooner but as you can all see Jarred and Red have been busy the past few weeks.

I certainly did ASK!
Click to expand...

Thanks Christopher,

I, for one, and I'm sure almost everyone here will agree with me, think that Mister Probst should be given a copy
of the new Dragon-Enabled RedCine-X as soon as possible, so that he can post images here from his
shoot as soon as possible.

:)
 
Wow great work Mark, and great work RED team, I was a bit on the fence but i've jumped completely over.

I've scanned most pages but I haven't seen anything about lenses used...maybe I missed that. Were Leica's used in this test?
 
Just saw the pics, watched the video, read the thread.

Thought it was an excellent range of shots, in terms of showing in real life situations what the Dragon is capable of.

The surfing and rainforest shots in particular are great examples for me of the unprecedented latitude the Dragon sensors can capture.

Thanks Mark for putting in the effort and sharing such clear examples of what we can expect to see from the Dragons.

Thanks too Jim and Jarred for giving Mark the opportunity to check the camera out, and for getting us to this point in digital image capturing.
 
Rarely post anything, but again I feel I must. It's an old and familiar complain, but isn't pixel peeping a 9.51 mbps MP4 kind of an exercise in futility (on this level of excellence), when there's nothing to directly compare it to? Or do you guys have access to a better copy of the video that I'm not aware of and I'm making a fool of myself. -- Again. :)

EDIT: This post was aimed for the hardcore pixel peepers, that get stuck on the littlest (hmm, smallest?) detail of any given shot. I do understand broader mechanics of it, though.
 
Martin Stevens said:
Thanks Christopher,

I, for one, and I'm sure almost everyone here will agree with me, think that Mister Probst should be given a copy
of the new Dragon-Enabled RedCine-X as soon as possible, so that he can post images here from his
shoot as soon as possible.

:)
Click to expand...

Thanks Martin, now I'm off to Spain for two weeks... Ugh!

Jarred, I have a better idea, just take my camera and throw a Dragon in it!
 
Canons I believe.

1077149_10201790038811520_1740331279_o.jpg


Jeffrey Loewe said:
Wow great work Mark, and great work RED team, I was a bit on the fence but i've jumped completely over.

I've scanned most pages but I haven't seen anything about lenses used...maybe I missed that. Were Leica's used in this test?
Click to expand...
 
We all appreciate what Mark did. At least I do.

We all probably have ideas and desires to dig into the files and shoot our own tests.
That just makes sense.
We are a greedy bunch.
At least I am.

Jims and Davids mullens advice that
"Anything will clip when overexposed"

Is a good one.

LOL

How it clips will be due to a number of things.

I have seen the same shots as the rest of you, and for what it is worth (despite worried offline messages)
THIS really looks like the real deal.

How much more of a real deal this is than anything else?
Hard to say until we can shoot and check for variables ourself.

Does this look like the amazing camera?

Yup.

Is it capable of 16 or 20 stops?

Have no idea. But I stand by my words that if you cannot make images with an Epic, it is probably not the camera which is the first thing to blame.

And still the Dragon seems more desireable than I would have imagined. :)

Chill down.
Rejoyce that we get to see footy.
Probably gonna be a lot more popping out the next month

Stay hungry
Make pictures.

Thanks Mark, Jim, Jarred et all for letting stuff out of the secretive testing beds!

G
 
Jannard said:
Antonio... Mark has also shot about every camera known to man. We gave him no guidance what to test or what to post. Unless you were standing over him when he graded these images you don't know what is there and what isn't. Mark acknowledged just opening them in RCX and adding a curve. I'd also point out that everything clips, the Dragon does, the Alexa does, film does. It is just a matter of when, how much and how smooth the transition is. Shoot a properly exposed building at noon with the sun directly in the shot and tell me you see detail in the sun. Making a comparison judgment on footage with a simple s-curve without taking anything else into consideration may be considered a premature opinion. Mark had the camera and saw what he saw. Unfortunately you haven't had the same opportunity yet. Again, I'd suggest you read what Mark had to say and then do your own tests. Getting into this before you do is counter productive to the celebration that should be happening for all our customers. We see more DR than any other motion capture device. Apparently so does Mark. This is an upgrade to an EPIC, not a new camera. It happens at the same time we give you new color science and 6K at 100 fps that can be shot at higher compression REDCODE so you can still record to your current SSDs. That fact that I have to explain this on a Sunday is mildly frustrating... even though I now know you don't mean any harm.

Your courtesy comment is noted. I deleted that part of my post but apparently not in time.

Jim
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I know this is a time of celebration. I respect that. I'm not trolling, I just want to know Dragon. That's all. I love Dragon already, hell, I love the MX, there's nothing not to love. So when viewing images from the new sensor, and I see a clipped highlight in a beautiful sunset, I react.

But you're right. I'm sure it won't be even an issue. I can only imagine what movies are going to look like once this camera is out. I say it again, Red is making movies look better, a lot better.

It was probably unfortunate of me to bring out this discussion, it wasn't my intention to be negative. And I do believe that that it is a matter of exposure and grading, and I also know how much dynamic range was in those shots, too much for any other camera or film to handle.

I can't wait to shoot on it.

Also edited my post.
 
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Just went back on to Vimeo to play it again for an other friend that stopped by...


And LOVED Mark's reply and I can't wait to do an other "Carly" like Fashion Film, taken to an other new level, new Sensors and few years working the RED Epic should make it for a very interesting experience... Skin to me is more important then anything else, of course additional DR, 100fps at 6K etc. those too are most welcome... ;)


"Thanks Ketch :) You will love it for skin mate, it gives you back exactly what you see with your own eye."
 
THANK YOU MARK
 
To put my own spin on things... Regardless of what you think of the images shown thus far, it's safe to assume that the Dragon represents an improvement over the MX chip... And it's not just in another K of resolution or increased frame rates. Just how much increased sensitivity and dynamic range we will ultimately see will surely evolve over the next weeks, months and year... In my opinion, even without the increased ISO and DR, the Dragon is a win. I KNOW what I can do with the MX at the current DR and sensitivity... Any increase beyond that is pure gravy.

If you cannot achieve optimal results out of the MX at present, getting a Dragon or a F65, or a freakin pixelvision is not going to change that. If you can pull the best out of the MX and fully understand/control your lighting/exposure and understanding of how the camera functions, then having a dramatic increase in capability is going to be all the more empowering. I for one cannot wait!
 
Hey Mark,
Thanks so much for doing this! Loved your test and very impressed with what the new sensor can do. I signed up day one for Scarlet. I signed up day one for upgrade for it and will be happy as I'm now when they send me my email.
 
KETCH ROSSi said:
Just went back on to Vimeo to play it again for an other friend that stopped by...
Click to expand...

Vimeo; They really should jump on the 4K (or UHD) wagon at this point. Better yet, there should be a 6K torrent based live streaming client for us enthusiasts. :)
 
This should indeed be a celebration!

I was giddy waiting for my original RED one, I loved converting it to MX, EPIC was worth the wait, and the Dragon has me very intrigued (in a jaw dropping kind of way).

And, just sticking up for Mark. He took a camera shot for two days and stress tested it. He did real world stuff, in tough conditions. I don't think what he or RED are doing here is part of a marketing machine. It's community service and I really sense Mark and RED are really excited to be sharing what they have created.

Plus, this is a test with a pre release camera. We don't know anything about how it will be further tweaked, the OLFP, blah, blah, blah, but yew do know Mark and his work and we know he is a straight shooter. What he did was help a lot of us understand what this upgrade is going to help us accomplish.

I think if Mark was going for smooth highlight rolloff he's got the knowledge to accomplish that. It's feels like he was really going for a more honest, hard nosed approach, without a lot of apparatus.

Will it get better? I'd say RED has a pretty great record of continuously delivering more for their customers. Hardware and software.

So cheers to the RED team and to Mark for this little coming out party. It's a great Sunday in early August, it probably means we could be close to upgrade time.

David
 
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