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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Controversial Commercial - Directed By Tonaci Tran - 2k DOWNLOAD AVAILABLE! MUST SEE

And to all, a good night. I'm checking out of Reduser until after the holidays.

Peace everyone!
 
wow this commercial looked bad
I agree with Phedon Papamichael whether its really him or not??
every thing about this commercial screams digital
Ive seen better images produced on a hvx200...
I know the red one is a capable camera,Ive seen better images than this...
but if you guys are gonna make a claim that film is dead.
At least try to make a commercial worthy enough to live up to that...
you DOP must of been asleep.
this is a real lazy effort guys:(
Im sure film will stick around for quite some time,especially when a product like this is produced...
Click to expand...

It's a valid opinion.

Thanks

In the DOP defense, he had nothing to work with.

1 1K light and a bounce card is not a lighting kit.

He had no choice.

I believe all of the budget was spend on location.

Also this project has not been through a post process I think.

No Online, No Grading, and no Color Corrections I believe.

I regret not being able to help Tonaci with Post.

Tek
 
Firstly, there is nothing "controversial" about this effort. I do think the concept is clever; I give the team good marks for that.

As for the cinematography, I would ask if it looks the way it was desired. If yes, I might say that in my opinion it looks ugly and I question the visual taste of the cinematographer. If no, I would say the cinematographer failed to deliver; having inadequate tools is not an excuse; one should shoot for the location/equipment available, especially when there is no client making impossible demands.

I did not like the edit. Just my opinion of course, but I though it was on par with the rest of the piece. Perhaps it was rushed or the result of too many decision makers in the room. I don't know.

The crux of the matter is the, "film is dead," claim. Well, it's not dead. If the claim were, "film should be dead," then the example of the better recording medium should have been absolutely stellar.It should be drop-dead, gasping for breath beautiful. It's far from it. Very, very far.

Can anyone honestly say that this piece is a good example of what the Red camera can do? Would anyone use this to advertise the camera's capabilities? I certainly would not.

OK, here's the disclaimer. I'm not attacking anyone personally or suggesting that they are incompetent in general. I'm just saying that this particular piece is not a good example of either the Red camera or the cinematographer's skills.

It's unpleasant to have to critique harshly; but when someone invites a review, what is served by false praise?

Good shooting and best regards,

Leo
 
Daniel Carruthers said:
every thing about this commercial screams digital
Click to expand...

It wasn't my goal to make this commercial look like "film."

To clarify, this commercial represents the productions, film, commercials and projects that have bid a final farewell to film because for the first time we now have worthy alternative to 35mm. This year alone, I worked on 5 feature films and many commercials that were all shot on RED. These productions will never shoot on 35mm ever again.

just a note: it looks good on a mac with gamma set correctly to 2.2. I am working on a solution to get things matching on pc environments. I fear that many seem to be judging the quality of the picture solely based on a youtube compressed video.
 
A 1k and a bounce board?
I had a lot less than that on location in the past, and I have made better looking pictures from a dvx...
of course I could of used the nice 35 mm depth of field?:(
Anyways they should not have posted this video if it wasn't completed?
And I really don't understand why they would blow all the budget on location and props and put so little effort into the camera and lighting department?
especially when the whole purpose of this commercial is to say film is dead and the red one camera is its replacement?
doesn't make sense to me?
 
Leo Ticheli said:
Firstly, there is nothing "controversial" about this effort. I do think the concept is clever; I give the team good marks for that.

As for the cinematography, I would ask if it looks the way it was desired. If yes, I might say that in my opinion it looks ugly and I question the visual taste of the cinematographer. If no, I would say the cinematographer failed to deliver; having inadequate tools is not an excuse; one should shoot for the location/equipment available, especially when there is no client making impossible demands.

I did not like the edit. Just my opinion of course, but I though it was on par with the rest of the piece. Perhaps it was rushed or the result of too many decision makers in the room. I don't know.

The crux of the matter is the, "film is dead," claim. Well, it's not dead. If the claim were, "film should be dead," then the example of the better recording medium should have been absolutely stellar.It should be drop-dead, gasping for breath beautiful. It's far from it. Very, very far.

Can anyone honestly say that this piece is a good example of what the Red camera can do? Would anyone use this to advertise the camera's capabilities? I certainly would not.

OK, here's the disclaimer. I'm not attacking anyone personally or suggesting that they are incompetent in general. I'm just saying that this particular piece is not a good example of either the Red camera or the cinematographer's skills.

It's unpleasant to have to critique harshly; but when someone invites a review, what is served by false praise?

Good shooting and best regards,

Leo
Click to expand...

Leo,

you represent the first civilized critique. i think the challenge here is the nature of this type of project. I just don't have 10,000 to put out of my pocket to make it the way I would have liked with over 100 extras, a crane, all the lighting gear, extra shooting days. Everyone on the project volunteered their time for me. It is what it is. It was the best we could pull together given no budget and all volunteer effort. I am not saying we needed a billion dollars to make it look stellar...we were scrambling to get the shoot done and I am just relieved we have something to show for it.
 
tonaci said:
It wasn't my goal to make this commercial look like "film."

To clarify, this commercial represents the productions, film, commercials and projects that have bid a final farewell to film because for the first time we now have worthy alternative to 35mm. This year alone, I worked on 5 feature films and many commercials that were all shot on RED. These productions will never shoot on 35mm ever again.

just a note: it looks good on a mac with gamma set correctly to 2.2. I am working on a solution to get things matching on pc environments. I fear that many seem to be judging the quality of the picture solely based on a youtube compressed video.
Click to expand...

Well I guess I see your point?
but to most people who like film likes the way it looks...
if you want a digital look, shoot red
if you want a film look shoot film...
and your saying film is dead because we have a worthy alternative?
well what if the red doesnt suite the look of the project?
kodak keeps making better film stocks.
heck I would shoot super 8 over the red if I thought it suited the story better?
I dont understand why everyone wants film to die off?
why does it have to die?
why cant there be red and film?
I think the red camera is awesome!
but I just think its another tool for filmmakers
its not gonna replace anything,its just more options
at least thats my opinion:)
 
Oh gosh, what a buzz.

My personal tought is that if the claim was "P2 is dead" instead of "film"...

Btw, a little suggestion: why not start a brand new Opencut project?
New cuts, gradings, final graphics... Maybe some personal taste will be accomplished.

Tonaci? Torrey?

And yes, (repeating myself again) I'm proud to be part of this.
And yes, I'm a Fanboy :w00t:
 
XiaoSu Han said:
you can't tell me that someone with that many credits can only gather together a 1k and a bounce board...
Click to expand...
he had a one day notice to jump on board because the other dp I couldn't make it. Ketch generously brought out his 1k and tekcin brought out his bounce.

but after thinking about it.. i am realizing it is pointless to make excuses. i think it is hard to appreciate something until you go through the hard work of doing it.
 
Daniel Carruthers said:
I dont understand why everyone wants film to die off?
why does it have to die?
why cant there be red and film?
I think the red camera is awesome!
but I just think its another tool for filmmakers
its not gonna replace anything,its just more options
at least thats my opinion:)
Click to expand...

I spoke with an advertising agency recently who told me that 27 out of 30 of their last projects was shot on RED..before this, their client's ONLY wanted 35mm for their ads. just a small example..but a transition is happening.

I don't hate film. I dig the dynamic range..but I just can't afford the cost or the inconvenience.
 
Elcurado said:
Oh gosh, what a buzz.

My personal tought is that if the claim was "P2 is dead" instead of "film"...

Btw, a little suggestion: why not start a brand new Opencut project?
New cuts, gradings, final graphics... Maybe some personal taste will be accomplished.

Tonaci? Torrey?

And yes, (repeating myself again) I'm proud to be part of this.
And yes, I'm a Fanboy :w00t:
Click to expand...

interesting thought. I am in the process of getting the piece better color grading.

again, thanks so much for helping me on the other side of the planet. i love the pic of your editing lair.. very nice.
 
tonaci said:
just a note: it looks good on a mac with gamma set correctly to 2.2. I am working on a solution to get things matching on pc environments. I fear that many seem to be judging the quality of the picture solely based on a youtube compressed video.
Click to expand...

I think this may be part of the problem for the harsh criticism. That and while people don't seem to feel it's controversial, I think you're touching a few nerves. It seems some are of the opinion that if you're going to make such a piece claiming that film is dead that you need to be able to replicate and even improve on the characteristics of film within that particular digitally-shot piece. OK, fine, if it were completely serious.

I think all the negative types are just incapable of having a little fun.
 
Well done Tonaci........
Keep in mind you've done nothing wrong with story, shooting or post!!
You produced it to the level of experience you're at, so good for you.
It's the leap you make with the next one and the next after that etc, that really describes who you are as a story teller.
And you tried which places you at a level 1000 times above anyone who didn't!

Also keep in mind that Phedon gave you/us the xmas present of the year.

It's a bit like being in a class room with a hard teacher...it's embarrassing, but fuck you listen and learn so much from it.

So again well done, I wish I was in your shoes.

...have a happy xmas.
D
 
lol, I love it!
 
The crux of the matter is the, "film is dead," claim. Well, it's not dead. If the claim were, "film should be dead," then the example of the better recording medium should have been absolutely stellar.It should be drop-dead, gasping for breath beautiful. It's far from it. Very, very far.
Click to expand...

Hey Leo,

I have always like your opinions and professionalism.

You are right, film is NOT dead.

FYI:

I think so far, 5 out 5 of Tonaci DIT/Cam Ops features are going to be print to film for the Theaters.

Film remain a great final Distribution Media for us all.

We are just a bunch of Kids in a Candy store having some fun.

Have a merry Christmas.

Tek
 
WOW!!

I really LOVE this Boards, but some times I wonder...

Tonaci called me the day before confirming the shoot ( previously cancelled ) and with great pleasure I arrived on location with my last 1200 HMI, as I had already sold most of the other lights :( .

The shoot was a lot of fun, food was great, and every one there was truly enjoying the day, meating each other and shooting little something with a RED ONE, many of which had seen for the first time, all concept, camera work, and various decisions were taken by those that created the idea, and they should be respected as such, OPINION should be just that, Opinions, and they should be presented with respect, and as a point of view not a harsh critique of some one else work, negativism is truly the DEATH of anything done for the FUN of it, I personally have a favoritism for B&W with an HARSH Graded Grey look for this kind of scenes, especially when shooting in :rip_1: is involved, but I enjoyed as is nonetheless, and look forward now to see the new graded version as well.

Tonaci, you did a great job, and just the fact that you did this should count, it does for me, if only I could have kept my RED ONEs I would be shooting my A%$@$# away every day, and wouldn't care too much about making every shot perfect, I would just shoot away for the fun of it, and when budget and time permitting, then I would do something with greater attention to details.

Any way, I just wish some people could be a little bit less Harsh in their sharing of Opinions!!

ciao
 
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