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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Bricked NEW EPICs (Quality Issue ?)

Brent@RED said:
Robin, we have put in new test procedures so boards are being pre-screened for this issue.

Others who just took delivery, I can understand your trepidation. I don't want the impression that the sky is falling, that is not the case. As I mentioned earlier, this issue has only happened in a relative handful of cameras. So, the risk is still very small of something happening even factoring that in.
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That's what I wanted to hear thanks!
 
Patrick, it was actually an acquired talent at RED. With things moving so quickly, if you cannot maintain some level of calm, you'd have a heart attack within 30 days of employment : )
 
Must say, that it's pretty cool that this thread is so open, and things are responded to so quickly, Brent. Gives confidence to everyone I think.
 
Thanks, Paul. RED would not be where it is today without the candor going both ways on this forum.
 
Assume you mean EPIC with M-X sensor....

I would assume the current release version of v4.0.18 as the beta v5.1.29 was only released a week ago. But things move fast, so take it with a grain of salt.
 
Newly added test procedures and a extra year of warranty for affected customers. Wow, thats great.
Problem solved, congrats and thanks, especially to Brent for holding the position here. ;)
 
I seldom use my own camera on big shoots, I had my own Aaton 35 go down on me 15 years ago and lost a full day on a very expensive set rental, I learned the hard way. If I am doing a Commercial in LA, I will just rent from ONI, they have 20 Epics and will deliver a new one within minutes if I ever have any issue. Not to mention the fact that there Red system is the most production friendly in the biz. Never risk your career on a camera, in fact, most clients I work with insist on fully prepped outside rental packages.
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Bob, I understand your point of view. But, you live in L.A. and you can get an Epic in a minute... I live in Italy in Verona: impossible get an Epic: few rental house and high rates... This is the rest of the world.


Bob Gilles said:
I seldom use my own camera on big shoots, I had my own Aaton 35 go down on me 15 years ago and lost a full day on a very expensive set rental, I learned the hard way. If I am doing a Commercial in LA, I will just rent from ONI, they have 20 Epics and will deliver a new one within minutes if I ever have any issue. Not to mention the fact that there Red system is the most production friendly in the biz. Never risk your career on a camera, in fact, most clients I work with insist on fully prepped outside rental packages.
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Bob:

Like Luca said, only LA, and possibly NY, have rental houses with 20+ Epics ready to go (maybe a handful of other cities like Toronto, etc.). For everyone else in the world, this isn't the case at all.

Please consider that some folks have a career because they have THE camera, so your statement "never risk your career on a camera" might be true in LA, but doesn't apply anywhere else that doesn't have the luxury of having a local rental house like ONI.

Imagine having the courage of risking your reputation and clientele having no backup camera. That's everyday life for some here, not for lack of planning, but a location or a budget issue. Therefore, it's no surprise that some demand that their equipment (and investment) doesn't crap out on set, at least not at the rate that this thread indicates.
 
I just wanted to add that my Epic #06153 was a victim of one of these bad boards. In less than thirty days of receiving the camera it "bricked" and would not power on. Luckily this happened at the end of a day of shooting and the next day was cancelled due to weather (You might have heard of the Austin City Limits Festival being completely flooded out). Red took care of the board swap in about 8 days turn around and I only lost one rental.

However they didn't mention anything to me about a one year extended warranty. I may have to check back on that.

DBG
 
David your Epic is #6153, my bricked Epic was the number #6183… and other EPICs from the "series 6000" seem to suffer from similar issues.
Now I have a new Epic (#6267) but I'm always nervous on set.
I would like an official response from RED...What's the problem? Have you solved it?

Luca.

David Blue Garcia said:
I just wanted to add that my Epic #06153 was a victim of one of these bad boards. In less than thirty days of receiving the camera it "bricked" and would not power on. Luckily this happened at the end of a day of shooting and the next day was cancelled due to weather (You might have heard of the Austin City Limits Festival being completely flooded out). Red took care of the board swap in about 8 days turn around and I only lost one rental.

However they didn't mention anything to me about a one year extended warranty. I may have to check back on that.

DBG
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Luca Orlandi said:
David your Epic is #6153, my bricked Epic was the number #6183… and other EPICs from the "series 6000" seem to suffer from similar issues.
Now I have a new Epic (#6267) but I'm always nervous on set.
I would like an official response from RED...What's the problem? Have you solved it?

Luca.
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It would also be useful, for those looking at purchasing a "pre-owned" Epic, which can have a 90 day warranty, with ownership transfer, to have a price point on the repair, if outside warranty.

Thank you very much

Fury
 
My Epic had to be returned with similar sounding issues (#5521) a week after I received my upgrade. The reason being "Internal component failure" as well. I've contacted RMA to see if I get that extra warranty. Like Luca, I tend to get pretty nervous on set with it...
 
Look, cameras, all cameras sometimes die. If you go on an important job either without a backup body on site or having identified one nearby, you are taking a chance. When Red One was introduced, we bought two since they had a reputation. We never needed the second body due to failure of the first. We traded up to two Epics and we have never needed the second body either, but we have it. Two Epic bodies are still much cheaper than what one broadcast HD cameras used to cost. If you are working at a budget level where you can't bring a backup or cover yourself with a borrowed backup or prearrange access to a nearby second body, you are just skating on thin ice. Sooner or later any camera is going to go down, no matter who makes them. If you work without a net, sooner or later you are going to land on your ass very hard. I think Red is being very good about this. If you don't think so, try to go through the same experience with Sony....
 
Rob Gardner said:
Look, cameras, all cameras sometimes die. If you go on an important job either without a backup body on site or having identified one nearby, you are taking a chance. When Red One was introduced, we bought two since they had a reputation. We never needed the second body due to failure of the first. We traded up to two Epics and we have never needed the second body either, but we have it. Two Epic bodies are still much cheaper than what one broadcast HD cameras used to cost. If you are working at a budget level where you can't bring a backup or cover yourself with a borrowed backup or prearrange access to a nearby second body, you are just skating on thin ice. Sooner or later any camera is going to go down, no matter who makes them. If you work without a net, sooner or later you are going to land on your ass very hard. I think Red is being very good about this. If you don't think so, try to go through the same experience with Sony....
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Right, but three issues:

1.) Why compare what costs are now to what costs were "back in the day"? That's completely irrelevant - just because an Epic costs less than what an HD broadcast camera used to cost by no means justifies telling someone that they should go out and buy a backup. It makes sense to compare costs and features to what other cameras cost and feature now.

2.) Everyone's finances are different. I was fortunate enough to get by with shooting on the same 5D Mark II from Nov 2008 - Nov 2011 without any issues, and didn't have a backup. Even though that only cost $3k at the time, finances dictated that I couldn't afford a second backup body, and many jobs didn't allow a budget for rental of such. We all take jobs for money, but also accept them because we love the projects and the ideas behind them. Whether it's a huge commercial or a personal film, even if they don't have a budget for a backup body, we should still be able to rely on the camera at hand. $30k for a working package is a lot to ask some people to spend twice for reassurance.

3.) The whole point of this original post was that 3 brand new Epic-MXs bricked. You can look at it as either having 3 Epics and needing 3 backups or, more sensibly, looking at it as having 1 Epic with two backups. When all three fail, and others have been posting issues about their new Epics failing as well, it should raise a concern about the stability of them on a set, regardless of whether you can afford 1 or 100.

The concern being voiced here overall is paying for, arguably, the best quality in the industry and not receiving the best quality control. As you stated, though, Rob: RED is being very good about this. We'd just like to see some official announcement on the issue rather than having mods and reps answer questions on these threads.
 
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