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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Birger Lens Mount Reservations

Erik Widding said:
Didn't have to look very far...

in the public forums:

and acknowledged by you in a private email a month earlier (our last communication from you on August 13):

David, so when may we expect your package will arrive?
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Erik,

Getting the iPins checked out by Red UK today (to put to bed where the fault lies with the no lens data appearing) and can assure you the Imperio will be in the post to you soon after.

As you can (probably) tell my latest shoot was not the smoothest. The 17-55/2.8IS and the 80-200/2.8IS are my 'standard' field lenses, and sods law dictates they are the key ones that do not work with the Imperio (the 70-200/2.8IS has worked before!).

Other lenses work(ish), with lower frequency non-smooth focus action.
To me, perhaps simplistically, it indicates that my Imperio 'can' work and and perhaps it's a firmware issue.

As for me being the odd one out with these issues ... hmmm

Dont get me wrong, the mount has been bullet proof > NEVER let me down.

The wireless control together with the focus remapping to a full revolution is GREAT ... just wish it was smooth in action :001_unsure:
 
Jarred Land said:
Epic will have support (electronic) for both Nikon and Canon (and others)...
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Competiton will focus minds ...

PLEEEEEEEASE give us Leica M lens support also :001_cool:
 
David Nardini said:
Other lenses work(ish), with lower frequency non-smooth focus action. To me, perhaps simplistically, it indicates that my Imperio 'can' work and and perhaps it's a firmware issue.
Click to expand...

David, time and time again you have been told that your Impero is broken. With no technical understanding of the situation, you continue to second guess this analysis, and whine about it on the boards. You really need to learn how to follow directions better.
  1. Your Impero is broken.
  2. Send it back to get it fixed.
 
Also, I'm under the impression that all of us are having issues with the 17-55 2.8 (and possibly 70-200 2.8--I don't have it so I don't pay attention to it) since the later RED builds. Its known and mentioned all over the boards. Erik has even apparently purchased the 17-55 to test its different behaviour, aware that you can shoot a feature with it and a single longer prime (or just it, actually).
 
Jeffrey Holland said:
Is this true for Scarlet as well?
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Various RED literature has mentioned this since they announced the DSMC system. Yes for Epic, Yes for Scarlet...and in time their own electronic lenses.

Good stuff.
 
I've had excellent service from Birger too. Quick, efficient, helpful and responsible. PRO.


Craig Schober said:
i just wanted to follow up on my post for help from last week. it's so easy to cry for help and then move onto the next project once you get the help without thanking someone, revealing remedies that others need to hear or simply posting the outcome...so here it is.

i submitted a support ticket on the birger website soon after my initial post. honestly i thought i was wasting my time as the website doesn't seem up to date and has a lot of dead links but erik immediately responded. he actually called me 1 minute after i clicked submit. i think it was some kind of coincidence but it was great to hear from the inventor himself. we troubleshooted over the phone for a few minutes until he seemed to reach the same conclusion that i did-the mount wasn't working.

since they now stock these mounts, i immediately ordered a new one and received it 2 working days later. happy to report that so far the new mount is working great. it seems even more responsive. that could be due to the fact that it shipped with newer firmware. not sure but i am afraid to mess with a working system at this point so no updates unless something goes wrong again.

now on to test each lens to verify full functionality...
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paul engstrom said:
Also, I'm under the impression that all of us are having issues with the 17-55 2.8 (and possibly 70-200 2.8--I don't have it so I don't pay attention to it) since the later RED builds. Its known and mentioned all over the boards. Erik has even apparently purchased the 17-55 to test its different behaviour, aware that you can shoot a feature with it and a single longer prime (or just it, actually).
Click to expand...

The 17-55 is a very nice lens - don't forget it has IS also. Add an 85mm and you probably have 99% feature shots covered.
 
Copied from the "Incredible" thread:

David Adamic said:
Alexander,

I agree, it is good to have options. I was wanted to avoid the birger if RED is going to have a native mount. Still, I don't want to avoid it if it mean I can't use the camera.
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Before you "avoid the birger" I would suggest you get RED to give a real estimated time frame. Many people spent months with a "doorstop" R1 (as one owner put it) waiting for the never produced Canon FD mount; the RED Nikon dumb mount, which in the end was designed by Birger; or the Birger EOS mount. Making a smart EOS mount is not trivial. Making it work with a lot of different EF lenses is even less trivial.

And there may be some legal issues with the Canon people if RED makes their own Canon mount. (Besides Birger being a small fish with not so deep pockets for Canon to sue, Birger's mount precedes some of the new copyright laws and therefore Birger may be grandfathered in.)

I don't know any of this for sure, but I do know there has been an "Alesniak" EOS smart mount that seems to have died on the vine and an Element Technica mount that RED announced in June or July 2008 as well but has yet to materialize.

Birger has a fully working product that should be very easy to convert to the Epic brain. The "smart" portion doesn't need to be changed - just the mechanical interface.

Here is a quote from Mark Crabtree from July 9, 2008 (almost 15 months ago)

Mark Crabtree said:
What does Element's entry bode for this Birger situation. Element is probably a year or more out from bring able to deliver the type of system Birger is ready to ship now. I am concerned that Red may feel Element's entry takes the pressure off getting the Birger shipping because people may mistakenly beleive Element has an electronic EOS mount they will be able to get relatively soon. The reality is that Red's customers will be irreperably harmed by another long developement cycle. We have spent over a year worrying over this Birger mount. We got a spectacular hands on demonstration of the working mount complete with ever so sexy remote focus knob at NAB. NAB was almost THREE MONTHS AGO. We (the Red One owners) deserve to be kept infomed as to Red/Birger progress. We deserve some real honest to goodness priority here to get this Birger out the door to let us start making money with this camera.
Click to expand...

Mark was pretty much right on with his prediction, and I think he, I, and a few hundred other Birger users would like RED to work with Birger to make sure we can make a smooth transition.
 
Michael Hastings said:
And there may be some legal issues with the Canon people if RED makes their own Canon mount. (Besides Birger being a small fish with not so deep pockets for Canon to sue, Birger's mount precedes some of the new copyright laws and therefore Birger may be grandfathered in.)
Click to expand...
I'm not 100% sure, but it seems the Canon patent on their electronic lens communication system has expired (finally... patents last too long). In which case anyone can freely create a compatible EF lens mount. Copyright has nothing to do with the construction and sale of such a device, it's entirely an issue of patents (and possibly trademarks if there's advertising involved). I'm not a lawyer, so don't take any of this as legal advice and use the info at your own risk.
 
Mark B. said:
I'm not 100% sure, but it seems the Canon patent on their electronic lens communication system has expired (finally... patents last too long). In which case anyone can freely create a compatible EF lens mount. Copyright has nothing to do with the construction and sale of such a device, it's entirely an issue of patents (and possibly trademarks if there's advertising involved). I'm not a lawyer, so don't take any of this as legal advice and use the info at your own risk.
Click to expand...

....and Nikon's mount?
 
Based on images shown of Epic-X it seems that, if needed as a temporary solution, it is possible to make a mechanical adapter between the existing Birger mount and Epic-X without any electric connection to avoid warranty issue. Birger mount can be powered from any external 12V battery and it's not a major problem to view the lens data on some external display.

Of course, it's likely Erik will produce a proper adapter to the Birger mount and Jarred has also said there will be a RED EF-adapter. The remaining question is, when these are available. If it takes time, a temporary mechanical adapter would enable one to move from R1 to Epic-X.
 
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