$1299 Seiki UHDTV 50" SE50UY04 - Bought it today

[Björn Benckert]

Saw the 50" now is down bellow 1k USD... So before I hit order can you guys give me some answers...

1. Does it support 25p 4k i.e what is the refresh options in PAL land?
2. How does a internal upscale from HD look, is it comparable to my 50" Samsung 1920p screen or is it worse? (I hate that samsung and will be happy to toss it out)
3. How do you use it with your rockets. I know the rocket has two DIV-x outputs and two SDI out. I assume that I should use the DVI-x, output and I have a weak memory of receiving the rocket together with a 1 to 2 DIV-X connector. Is it just to use one of the DVI-x and have a DVI-x to hdmi connector going to the screen, or?

4. how is picture quality in general especially if going from a 1920x1080p signal and use the internal upscale. (thats what I will do mostly as we finnish all most commercials in HD or 2k in flame and the flame use a HD output.

 

[Björn Benckert]

Argh.... Tried to hit buy on amazon just to find out I can not buy it in europe.... Any sugestions. Where is the best place to place order to receive it in Sweden?

 

[Paul Provost]

It's down to around $600 in the us. Would not get this as it is an old product now with replacement models coming out. This is only 30p from what I've seen with terrible upscale. Tons of info on this thread. Really at this point can you wait a couple months for hdmi 2.0?

 

[John Bellari]

It's down to around $600 in the us. Would not get this as it is an old product now with replacement models coming out. This is only 30p from what I've seen with terrible upscale. Tons of info on this thread. Really at this point can you wait a couple months for hdmi 2.0?

Can you provide link for $600?

Have you even used this monitor?

I've never seen it that low priced new.

FYI: Long-term Update 10-21-2013 (yes, it's still working...)

This monitor was the first broadly available inexpensive consumer UHD 50" monitor in the US back in April 2013. For the price, there was no peer then and really still isn't one broadly available one in the US even now in October 2013 for under $1000.

If you want to spend US $3500 - $5500, there are certainly better options today from 32" to 55" and in January more announcements coming shortly from manufacturers that support HDMI 2.0.

That being said, this set is not a reference monitor and is only as good as the signal it receives, so avoid using the internal HD upscale if at all possible. A lot of people have issues with the way it converts 24p or whatever framerate to 30p, but some others don't complain. Also, a lot of people complain about it not being 4K at 60fps, but HDMI 2.0 wasn't out at the time and we still have no idea if it will properly decode HDMI 2.0 signals at 30fps or less as Seiki has been tight lipped about the possibility of a firmware upgrade. Then again, a good quality home theater receiver with HDMI 2.0 may likely handle those issues for you anyway in the future.


If you plan using it at 3840x2160 at 30p today, it's still the best buy out there for under $1000 US
if you need something right now. If you have a budget in the $3000 price range and have some time, I'd advise you to hold off 3 months for the next round of announcements at CES 2014 and 6-7 months to buy...

 

[Wayne Morellini]

I did see some user reviews for the 39 inch movie that mentioned a 50 inch firmware update to fix upscaler bug and settings with links, but also I thought I saw a dual HDMI 60fps solution (but not for 39 inch). Is this true?

 

[Björn Benckert]

Only 30p Shit, Wish I did wait a little. So is it for sure so that this thing does not play back 25p?

I just ordered it... bouncing it on "myus.com" to get around the "order only in the states amazon limitation"...

If find it hard to believe that it can not refresh in 25p.
Also if fed with a uncompressed HD signal, then I would assume that it worst possible upscale would be a "nearest" / "no interpolation" which to me would be just as good / bad as a normal HD 50" TV. Basically 4 pixels on the 4k TV would be filled with the info from one pixel in the HD frame. Why would that look much worse than a lower resolution HD screen? I understand it will not look as good as a multisampled nicely upscaled image which would be far better in comparison to a normal HD screen.

So my asumption is that

This set with poor upscaling should be comparable to normal 1920p sets, or no? is it far worse?
Also when fed a true / clean 4k signal then things should look pretty good / incomparable to any HD set, or?


the 30p shit does not fly for me, I can not have a screen that can not refresh in 25p so I guess I have to sell this one. So let me know if you are interested of picking one up in Stockholm Sweden in a couple of days....

 

[Paul Provost]

Can you provide link for $600?

Have you even used this monitor?

yeah Seiki's headquarters (if you can call them that!) are not too far from my office and they invited me down for a demo when they first came out. it was really not bad for the money, but really only of use just to view 4K as a novelty I think, and the lack of 24 support was a deal breaker.
they have a 65" already out right?

 

[Björn Benckert]

yeah Seiki's headquarters (if you can call them that!) are not too far from my office and they invited me down for a demo when they first came out. it was really not bad for the money, but really only of use just to view 4K as a novelty I think, and the lack of 24 support was a deal breaker.
they have a 65" already out right?

Managed to cancel my order.

Now is it confirmed it does not playback 25p, 24p I have not much need for but 25p is a must.... If it does not do 25p what is the lowest priced option for 50" 25p?

I read on this forum and other places that it does do 24hz... does it not mean it can do 24P?

http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/hot-deals/1267029/

 

[John Bellari]

Managed to cancel my order.

Now is it confirmed it does not playback 25p, 24p I have not much need for but 25p is a must.... If it does not do 25p what is the lowest priced option for 50" 25p?

I read on this forum and other places that it does do 24hz... does it not mean it can do 24P?

http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/hot-deals/1267029/

The set will playback 24p material, but most complaints are about judder introduced from converting various frame rates such as from 24p to 30p from different manufacturer 4K devices, in which such issues are not present with the more expensive monitors and sets.

However, even the 32" displays using multiple displayport cables have their own sets of issues that the Seiki doesn't
in using a single HDMI cable.

SEIKI customer and technical support started out OK but has not been so great lately.

 

[Frazier Nivens]

Yep, still has sync issues here on HDMI 3 as well. 1 and 2 HDMI inputs are fine. Sound works again.

Just found the firmware Jeff, can't seem to get the Seiki to take it. Followed their directions but no joy. Sent you a pm.

Thanks,
Frazier Nivens

 

[Björn Benckert]

The set will playback 24p material, but most complaints are about judder introduced from converting various frame rates such as from 24p to 30p from different manufacturer 4K devices, in which such issues are not present with the more expensive monitors and sets.

However, even the 32" displays using multiple displayport cables have their own sets of issues that the Seiki doesn't
in using a single HDMI cable.

SEIKI customer and technical support started out OK but has not been so great lately.

Thanks but just so I understand.
If I feed it with a 24p signal will that be converted to 30p or shown as true 24p.

And more important if I give it a 25p signal will it play it back in 25p? And if so does it do it both for 1920@25p and 4k@25p.

I bought some very expansive sony screens a while back that where supposed to be "professional video screens" but they show up and where only 60hz and tearing all PAL material. So not so professional in this part of the woods, where PAL and 25p is the standard. Those sony screens I could not hand back or use so I just do not want to do the same mistake again...

 

[John Bellari]

Thanks but just so I understand.
If I feed it with a 24p signal will that be converted to 30p or shown as true 24p.

And more important if I give it a 25p signal will it play it back in 25p? And if so does it do it both for 1920@25p and 4k@25p.

I bought some very expansive sony screens a while back that where supposed to be "professional video screens" but they show up and where only 60hz and tearing all PAL material. So not so professional in this part of the woods, where PAL and 25p is the standard. Those sony screens I could not hand back or use so I just do not want to do the same mistake again...

I believe Jeff Kilgroe and others says it automatically converts UHD to 30p (even though the display still says 24p) and introduces judder which some people are very sensitive to

This is one of the cases where if Seiki would be more cooperative, we could find out exactly what's going on, and if there's a way to fix or eliminate it from firmware or via external equipment...

 

[Björn Benckert]

I believe Jeff Kilgroe and others says it automatically converts UHD to 30p (even though the display says 24p)

This is one of the cases where if Seiki would be more cooperative, we could find out exactly what's going on...

Thank you. I was worried that's the case. So to me that is the biggest bummer with this set. Can not believe that it's not mentioned around here.
Colors and everything else can be sorted with lut boxes I think but if it can not do the right frame rates it's pretty much unusable for everything that involves editing and and film / 4k work.

 

[houkouonchi]

You would probably get judder at 25Hz (just like 24hz) but the panel does have a modeline for 25hz. Its one of the 4 3k modelines it has:

# 3840x2160@30Hz
Modeline "3840x2160_30" 296.70 3840 4016 4104 4400 2160 2168 2178 2250 +hsync +vsync

# 3840x2160@25Hz
Modeline "3840x2160_25" 297.00 3840 4896 4984 5280 2160 2168 2178 2250 +hsync +vsync

# 3840x2160@24Hz
Modeline "3840x2160_24" 296.75 3840 5116 5204 5500 2160 2168 2178 2250 +hsync +vsync

 

[Björn Benckert]

You would probably get judder at 25Hz (just like 24hz) but the panel does have a modeline for 25hz. Its one of the 4 3k modelines it has:

# 3840x2160@30Hz
Modeline "3840x2160_30" 296.70 3840 4016 4104 4400 2160 2168 2178 2250 +hsync +vsync

# 3840x2160@25Hz
Modeline "3840x2160_25" 297.00 3840 4896 4984 5280 2160 2168 2178 2250 +hsync +vsync

# 3840x2160@24Hz
Modeline "3840x2160_24" 296.75 3840 5116 5204 5500 2160 2168 2178 2250 +hsync +vsync

Thank's would be great if anyone could confirm thats the case.

 

[houkouonchi]

Thank's would be great if anyone could confirm thats the case.

If someone could send me a video file that has mechanical motion it the way the other guy did to show the judder I could test. I have a camera that can do like 750 FPS (at really low resolution) but should be enough to confirm the judder if someone sent me the file, like the one used here:

http://youtu.be/yIGjk-lZC_Q

 

[Les Dittert]

Modelines mean nothing on that Seiki. After all it says it does 24P, but it converts it to 30P anyhow.
Not sure how that company could be so utterly stupid. There are a lot of 24P movies out there
My solution is to play the media at 30P.... gets the QC process done faster that way too ... hahaha.

Sorry, I don't have the video file anymore that I made the youtube video with. Just make one in a NLE. Use a picture of some bars and do a linear pan on it.
Takes about 10 min of work.

 

[Björn Benckert]

Modelines mean nothing on that Seiki. After all it says it does 24P, but it converts it to 30P anyhow.
Not sure how that company could be so utterly stupid. There are a lot of 24P movies out there
My solution is to play the media at 30P.... gets the QC process done faster that way too ... hahaha.

Sorry, I don't have the video file anymore that I made the youtube video with. Just make one in a NLE. Use a picture of some bars and do a linear pan on it.
Takes about 10 min of work.

Thanks Les. Yes, it seams quite dumb. But there is a lot of screens that can not do 24 or 25p. Cinema displays from apple for example... you would think that before putting that name on a screen you would make sure it actually could play "cinematic" material without cheating.

So next question, where do I find a low cost 25p / 25hz compatible 4k screen ?

 

[Wayne Morellini]

Only 30p Shit, Wish I did wait a little. So is it for sure so that this thing does not play back 25p?

I just ordered it... bouncing it on "myus.com" to get around the "order only in the states amazon limitation"...

If find it hard to believe that it can not refresh in 25p.
Also if fed with a uncompressed HD signal, then I would assume that it worst possible upscale would be a "nearest" / "no interpolation" which to me would be just as good / bad as a normal HD 50" TV. Basically 4 pixels on the 4k TV would be filled with the info from one pixel in the HD frame. Why would that look much worse than a lower resolution HD screen? I understand it will not look as good as a multisampled nicely upscaled image which would be far better in comparison to a normal HD screen.

So my asumption is that

This set with poor upscaling should be comparable to normal 1920p sets, or no? is it far worse?
Also when fed a true / clean 4k signal then things should look pretty good / incomparable to any HD set, or?


the 30p shit does not fly for me, I can not have a screen that can not refresh in 25p so I guess I have to sell this one. So let me know if you are interested of picking one up in Stockholm Sweden in a couple of days....

Bjorn, I would check for an actual Pal version. Manufacturers produce special versions for different markets, one reason we waited so long in my country. They filled Chinese and US orders first. That version might or might not have real 25hz, which you can display 24p on with a speed shift up to 25p and pitch shift down, as they do with movies in Pal markets and DVD's. But you might as well get a Hisense, Westinghouse, skyworth etc or Sony 55 inch with hdmi 2 upgradability, even new 32 inch monitor from Dell, if you want something cheap. TCL is also bring something out. Professionally many of these TV's are throw away stop gaps till you get a better set. If you make money with it, it pays for itself.

Unfortunately I'm told that the seiki is crap and nothing much else to give me an idea of how crappy (utter unsuitable crap, armature usable crap, or low end professional use crap). Something low end professional is good enough for me for the moment, a better one will be here in the next few years, maybe even a red projector.

 

[Björn Benckert]

Who makes pro 4k LED screens?

I did not think there where any, all I seen is sony, barco and other that makes projectors at different quality levels from pro to consumer. But I have not seen any of their 4k large format screens being made as professional screens. i.e they are all coming with built in speakers, smart TV etc. all the consumer stuff you do not want in a professional screen.

I thought this Seiki stuff was pretty close to being a good screen. Not to meny stupid options and just HDMI in. Then turn of sharpening and everthing else, put it in default and use a calibrator and create a screen lut to go from the computer. viola 4k calibrated LED screen. But I guess it's not that easy if it does not do the normal framerates it's not really anything usefull for the editing or VFX work that we do. But alot of screens have this issue but they managed to cheat it so it's not as noticeable. Apparently it's really difficult to make a screen that has variable Hz. So it's at best a 120hz or 150hz and then you devide down from there to 30Hz or 25Hz you simply can not have both without cheating one or the other or things get really expansive.