Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Log in
  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Zeiss Superspeeds

Greg M

Greg M

Digital FX
Joined
Dec 30, 2006
Messages
5,133
Reaction score
1
Points
38
Location
Louisiana
Website
www.digitalfx.tv
A friend has a set of Super Speeds for sale, they are MKIII's in excellent condition for $29k. PM if you are interested and I'll forward him your info. Set includes 18,25,35,50 and 85mm

MODS- I realize this belongs in a Classified section, I posted here because there is a huge shortage of these lenses and Red owners have been searching high and low for these. These are not my lenses, and I am not making any money, just thought I would pass on some useful info. Please delete if you feel this is inappropriate.

EDIT:
LENSES ARE SOLD
 
digitalfx said:
A friend has a set of Super Speeds for sale, they are MKIII's in excellent condition for $29k. PM if you are interested and I'll forward him your info. Set includes 18,25,35,50 and 85mm

MODS- I realize this belongs in a Classified section, I posted here because there is a huge shortage of these lenses and Red owners have been searching high and low for these. These are not my lenses, and I am not making any money, just thought I would pass on some useful info. Please delete if you feel this is inappropriate.
Click to expand...

Hi There,

A little bit expensive IMHO, bearing in mind Arri sold of the last batch at half price to clear them.

Stephen
 
I have personnaly received an interesting offer for a set of Zeiss Standard Speed (T2.1) MK.II... I'm still a little undecided... Could anyone here explain me the differences between those 2 sets: Super-Speed MKIII vs. Standard speed MK.II. Obviously, the "Super Speeds" are faster, but are they sharper? What about the number of blades for the IRIS (this little info is pretty hard to find on the internet)? What about the contrast? What about the flares? What kind of job would you do (or would you rather avoid to do) with either of these 2 kind of Zeiss Lenses?

Any advice, any kind of enlightenment would be quite appreciated :^)
 
There are people out there who would be willing to pay 30,000 for a set because the set is so rare.

With that being said, I have a strong feeling that a RED prime set is inevitable. They have a 300mm already, so nothing would stop them from producing the more popular ranges such as: 18,25,35,50 and 85mm.
Judging from the current price of the 300mm prime, it would be likely that the set will hover around 25,000. So I would be hesitant in throwing down 30 grand with all the upcoming NAB announcements.

The primary drive for people to spend so much for the super speeds is to save that extra stop due to using the 35mm adaptors.

Stephen, would you happen to know any other advantages that super speeds have over standard primes?
 
arkham said:
I have personnaly received an interesting offer for a set of Zeiss Standard Speed (T2.1) MK.II... I'm still a little undecided... Could anyone here explain me the differences between those 2 sets: Super-Speed MKIII vs. Standard speed MK.II. Obviously, the "Super Speeds" are faster, but are they sharper? What about the number of blades for the IRIS (this little info is pretty hard to find on the internet)? What about the contrast? What about the flares? What kind of job would you do (or would you rather avoid to do) with either of these 2 kind of Zeiss Lenses?

Any advice, any kind of enlightenment would be quite appreciated :^)
Click to expand...

Hi Arkham,

Zeiss Standards are probably sharper, they dont work well on a P+S technic adapter due to vignetting issues so have a lower resale value at the present time. (The exit pupil is too small, on the wider ones)

The Mk III superspeeds have a larger focus scale, that being the main change from the MKII superspeeds. Wide open they are not very sharp or contrasty, vastly better by T2.5

Only the very early SuperSpeeds have the ugly 3 bladed iris look. (Actually they have more than 3 blades)

I don't know why but I personally prefer the Superspeeds. I have rented both sets over the years. I own some early ones that have 16 iris blades with my Ultracam cameras.

How either will perform on a Red is unknown at this time.

Stephen
 
tonaci said:
Stephen, would you happen to know any other advantages that super speeds have over standard primes?
Click to expand...

Hi,

At $5,000 a lens I would look for 2nd hand Ultraprimes. I have seen them go for under $6,000 per lens, not quite as fast @T1.9 but far better handling.

The only thing that's wrong with the SuperSpeeds and the reason they are no longer made is the glass contains lead! That is not allowed in the EEC any more, why Sony had to release the 900R.

Stephen
 
in that case.. so the standard speeds contain lead too?

Stephen Williams said:
Hi,

At $5,000 a lens I would look for 2nd hand Ultraprimes. I have seen them go for under $6,000 per lens, not quite as fast @T1.9 but far better handling.

The only thing that's wrong with the SuperSpeeds and the reason they are no longer made is the glass contains lead! That is not allowed in the EEC any more, why Sony had to release the 900R.

Stephen
Click to expand...
 
tonaci said:
in that case.. so the standard speeds contain lead too?
Click to expand...

Hi,

Not sure, the standard's were replaced by the Ultraprimes. I guess you could say the SuperSpeeds were replaced by the Master Primes, just a bigger price gap.

Stephen
 
my .02-

(First let me say that I dont care if these sell here, my friend will sell these fast. I posted only to help others on this board.)

I had a set of MKII superspeeds that I bought new years ago, I sold them about 2 years ago in mint condition for $16k...I was pleased.

Last year I started looking for another set, and as you all know there were NONE. I finally found a very nice set of MKII for $25k...I told the guy he was CRAZY. The very next day I decided I was crazy and called him back to purchase, needles to say they were gone. I have since bought a new set of Ultra Primes. The bottom line is its a sellers market, there are only so many of these sets in existence and those for sale are very rare. I have since seen several MKII go for $25k. Bottom line $29k for 5 lenses is the market value and will be for some time to come as more people use primes on video gear.

Regarding used Ultra Primes....ha
If you can find used UP's for $5k each you can double your money INSTANTLY. Used UPS go for $8-12k depending on fl and thats IF you can find them.
 
digitalfx said:
my .02-

(First let me say that I dont care if these sell here, my friend will sell these fast. I posted only to help others on this board.)

I had a set of MKII superspeeds that I bought new years ago, I sold them about 2 years ago in mint condition for $16k...I was pleased.

Last year I started looking for another set, and as you all know there were NONE. I finally found a very nice set of MKII for $25k...I told the guy he was CRAZY. The very next day I decided I was crazy and called him back to purchase, needles to say they were gone. I have since bought a new set of Ultra Primes. The bottom line is its a sellers market, there are only so many of these sets in existence and those for sale are very rare. I have since seen several MKII go for $25k. Bottom line $29k for 5 lenses is the market value and will be for some time to come as more people use primes on video gear.

Regarding used Ultra Primes....ha
If you can find used UP's for $5k each you can double your money INSTANTLY. Used UPS go for $8-12k depending on fl and thats IF you can find them.
Click to expand...

Tell you what, you want to sell your UP's for 5K a pop I'll take them!:)
Stephen if you find a set at that price call me!
 
I'm unsure how well an older prime set will perform on Red, they are designed for 35mm film stock and that has distinctly different properties than a sensor, they will be sharp, but how well will they control CA, or purple fringing, and what about vignetting. These digital specific issues were all adresed to some extent in the Master primes in the Cooke S4s & newer Nikon lenses. But it's hard to say how a 15-20 year old super/standard speed set will perform on a Mysterium sensor.
 
I too have been shopping around for lenses but have stopped as I feel that when RED release a set of Primes the value of these Zeiss Super Speeds will drop.

As the question would be why by a 15 - 20 year old set of lenses when you can by a brand new set designed by the same company who makes the camera.

I have a used set of S16mm lenses that I'll used with my Nikon Still lenses and 300mm Red while I await a set of RED Primes to hit the market.

Lenses are a major concern and I hope the RED team see the demand is there for a new player offering quality fast cine lenses.
 
I personally dont believe this will happen. IMO Super Speeds are still very fine lenses, and I doubt RED will offer a superior piece of glass at lower prices. Once RED and other video cameras that accept PL mounts become available the market will only get worse.

Personally I wouldnt pay $30k for Super Speeds, I would rather invest $60k in Ultra Primes...which is what I did.

Just a side note: I have already made made back nearly my entire purchase price in rental savings on my Ultra Primes in less than one year. So for me they were a no brainer. Even at $30k for the Super Speeds, it doesnt take long to pay for them.

Now, if you dont do enough work to justify this kind of purchase then simply rent your lenses and pass the expense on to your customer. Whenever I use my primes, I bill the client a rental fee. If the client cant afford the rental we have less expensive equipment options. I dont give away the lenses...you get what you pay for.


<<As the question would be why by a 15 - 20 year old set of lenses when you can by a brand new set designed by the same company who makes the camera.<<

Because lens technology does not evolve as fast as electronics.
 
Thank you so much Stephen! I really appreciate your help!

Indeed, the choice of prime lenses for the Red is a tough one. I, for one, believe I should own a "basic set" of primes for standard jobs and rent ultra-primes, master-primes or Cook S4 whenever possible,according to the look I want to achieve. I love the look the Cooke S4 gives, but I recognize the Zeiss sharpness could be interesting in many situations too.

Actually, I do own a set of Lomo Primes (the fastest and sharpest ones, not the anamorphic ones), and I am in love with those too... I bought them two years ago for 200 US$/lens, and nowadays, it seems they are worth more than 450$ a piece. Quite a good investiment apparently. Only problem is they are OCT-19, and I'd have to pay around 600 US$/lens to transform them to PL mount... because I'm not sure there is a plan for an OCT-19 mount for the Red camera! Therefore, I'm also considering another set of primes and selling the Lomos to one of those Mini35 users :-) But if the Zeiss standard speeds suffers from vignetting issues with the mini-35, I guess they won't be such a good choice for Red either...

Tough choice indeed! I either can:
1- Cross my fingers hoping someone will make an OCT-19 mount for the Red.
2- Pay 3000$ to have a set of PL mount LOMO lenses
3- Pay many more thousand US$ to get a set of Zeiss Standard (probably sharper, but much slower too...) which could eventually be not so "good a choice" for the Red...
4- Wait for Red to announce their own set of primes, and pay even more than the second hand Zeiss standard set I've been lurking for a few days...

What would you do if you were in my shoes ?
 
rgdfilmsRED said:
I'd wait.. It's not like you have a RedOne yet
Click to expand...

Very true! My only concern is that, with thousands of Red users eventually looking for affordable quality primes, the more we wait, the more the prices will go up :)

But, I think I'll wait anyway! After all, as I said, rental prices are not so high for standard or ultra speeds Zeiss...
 
arkham said:
Tough choice indeed! I either can:
1- Cross my fingers hoping someone will make an OCT-19 mount for the Red.
2- Pay 3000$ to have a set of PL mount LOMO lenses
3- Pay many more thousand US$ to get a set of Zeiss Standard (probably sharper, but much slower too...) which could eventually be not so "good a choice" for the Red...
4- Wait for Red to announce their own set of primes, and pay even more than the second hand Zeiss standard set I've been lurking for a few days...

What would you do if you were in my shoes ?
Click to expand...
You've got another option, which I'd seriously consider if I was in your shoes - get the Red with a PL mount, and have a camera shop engineer you an OCT-19 mount for it - you should be able to get that done a lot more cheaply than modifying your lenses, assuming it will be possible, which sounds likely given what's been said about interchangeability of lens mounts.

That way you can either rent PL mount lenses and use the PL, or for lower budget stuff swap out the mount for the OCT-19 and use your Lomos...

It's kind of option (1), but without the crossing your fingers bit!!
 
digitalfx said:
I doubt RED will offer a superior piece of glass at lower prices.
Click to expand...

If the Red team can make a superior 4k camera at a fraction of the cost of 1080p cameras, I can't see any reason why that can't do the same with optics. Somewhere close in quality is good enough if it is at a fraction of the cost. The 300mm prime will be the first example of RED lenses that we will have a chance to critique in one month at NAB. I'm confident that Jim and company will impress us with their lenses. Best of all, they can fine tune the glass to be the most optimum for RED. Their 300mm prime has already been set at 5,000. IF they can pull of a whole set for around 25,000-30,000, I think I would choose this over buying a set of used ultra primes. my 2 cents.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top