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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Which Scarlet Upgrade Will You Choose?

Which Scarlet Upgrade Will You Choose?

  • Scarlet Dragon

    Votes: 62 55.4%

  • Epic MX

    Votes: 37 33.0%

  • No Upgrading

    Votes: 13 11.6%
  • Total voters
    112
I am getting a separate new Epic M Dragon, so I am opting for the Scarlet Dragon path for my Scarlet. This way Scarlet can shoot all the normal speed stuff and TLs (time lapses) and Epic focuses on high-speed / HDRx and of course - rental...

But even if I was not getting the EMD - I would still chose the Scarlet Dragon path...

P
 
It's actually taken me this last year to start selling the Scarlet as a worthwhile upgrade for clients from DSLRS and I am finally getting work where people specifically ask for the Red instead of the Canon. Hopefully the upgrade offer will still be on the table for a long time because now I can't put any more money into the Scarlet until it's come closer to paying for itself.

I'll revisit the situation in 6months time, and obviously I want to know what the specs are for the other features aside from 5k @ 60fps - the only ones I know currently - but for example 120fps at 3-4k would be a game changer for me as I could actually immediately monetize that ability.
 
for me it´s more about the reduced noise (hopefully) and wider dynamic range (have to wait and see images) than the 6K = Scarlet Dragon (if wife lets me)
 
Ben Scott said:
It's actually taken me this last year to start selling the Scarlet as a worthwhile upgrade for clients from DSLRS and I am finally getting work where people specifically ask for the Red instead of the Canon. Hopefully the upgrade offer will still be on the table for a long time because now I can't put any more money into the Scarlet until it's come closer to paying for itself.

I'll revisit the situation in 6months time, and obviously I want to know what the specs are for the other features aside from 5k @ 60fps - the only ones I know currently - but for example 120fps at 3-4k would be a game changer for me as I could actually immediately monetize that ability.
Click to expand...

Great to hear people are asking for RED in the UK. Glad you made the Scarlet purchase?
 
Enrique Blein said:
for me it´s more about the reduced noise (hopefully) and wider dynamic range (have to wait and see images) than the 6K = Scarlet Dragon (if wife lets me)
Click to expand...

Exactly. And color science. Alexa with 2k is awesome. I hope dragon will reach those highlights and skin colors. Nevermind 6k then.
And am I wrong or will it be 1.3 crop vs 1.6 for 4k on regular scarlet?
 
Thomas Pierrepont said:
Great to hear people are asking for RED in the UK. Glad you made the Scarlet purchase?
Click to expand...

It's been a long battle because we live in an age where for the increasing majority of channels if 'good' comes with a small premium then 'good enough' will do. Some of these channels rely purely on quantity of material as opposed to trying to make them good. However, I've really pushed to use the Scarlet on a few jobs where normally they would be a no-go and each of those clients has always sought to find the little bit extra to pay for the goodies since seeing their production values increase by such a margin.

My Red kit shipping in different parts mean I couldn't use it on paid gigs for a while and things like phantom power and timelapse being late to be implemented meant i had to buy other solutions to cover me or not use the red for a fair amount of time. Also, the lack of 50fps at 3k was and continues to be a monumental pisser for productions shooting music promos in PAL Land so I've not had much work with the Red doing those.

That said, I'm really pleased I made the purchase as ultimately now I can say I'm investing in Redcode as opposed to the Scarlet, but with hindsight thus far it has been a huge financial burden to me and is only just in 2013 starting to pick up.


For the first time it is starting to look might it might pay for itself for me so come back to me in 2months and I'll have a better answer for you :)
 
Need to see Scarlet Dragon low light performance and DR first.
Using Zoom lenses a lot, so light sensitivity absolutely rules!!

Native ISO 2000 hasn't been officially confirmed yet...

Hopefully pushing Scarlet Dragon button later this year!
 
sam karr said:
Exactly. And color science. Alexa with 2k is awesome. I hope dragon will reach those highlights and skin colors. Nevermind 6k then.
And am I wrong or will it be 1.3 crop vs 1.6 for 4k on regular scarlet?
Click to expand...

I agree with this too; I definitely want full frame (or closer to it, ala Dragon), but I don't necessarily want 6k... That said, I would have no problems dealing with the extra backend hardships of 6k (storage and Rocket-X) if it meant I would be using all of the sensor.

Unfortunately though, I think you are slightly off on your crop factors Sam. From what I recall it's closer to this:
1.) MX at 5k (Epic) = ~1.3crop (APS-H)
2.) MX at 4k (Scarlet) = ~1.6crop (s35/APS-C)
3.) Dragon at 6k (Epic) = ~1.2crop (it's own thing...bigger than APS-H, not quite FF35)
4.) Dragon at 5k (Scarlet) = ~1.6crop (s35/APS-C)

So the FOV will be very similar between Dragon 5k and MX 4k, but the resolution is obviously way more (almost double the pixels -- 5k is 14mp, 4k is 8.85mp).
 
Based on current information, I think it'd have to be Epic-X just for the frame size, frame rates and it's relatively mature tech.

I can *imagine* doing this and later perhaps, going for Dragon. I can't justify going all-out Epic Dragon right now.

That said, I can hardly believe this choice is available to us and in the meantime, I have a phenomenal Scarlet to shoot with.
 
sam karr said:
Alexa with 2k is awesome.
Click to expand...

One word - downsampling...
downsampling = reduced noise
downsampling = increased DR
downsampling = increased sharpness
downsampling = increased overall IQ

Take properly exposed and shot 4K from Scarlet and down-sample it to 2K/HD and it also looks awesome... ;o)

P
 
Peter Majtan said:
One word - downsampling...
downsampling = reduced noise
downsampling = increased DR
downsampling = increased sharpness
downsampling = increased overall IQ

Take properly exposed and shot 4K from Scarlet and down-sample it to 2K/HD and it also looks awesome... ;o)

P
Click to expand...

Well, right, but not everybody wants a clinical ultra clean image. Alexa wins for color science and organic aspect. And downsampling does nothing to that. I'm just impatient to see some footage to know if my scarlet will be closer to that after upgrading.
 
This is a seriously tough decision!! I don't think a Scarlet Dragon is practical, you may have to have used an epic to understand why. To invest so much money in a camera, it does not make sense to NOT go all the way. At this point, what is 10k, and if you can't afford it, then you probably don't have a need for Dragon can offer. MX offers amazing images, so Dragon will not change your life.

I'm in love with RED, why? The chance for an almost full credit to upgrade, and having bought a battle tested Scarlet, I think the value is greater. This is incredible!!!! Highly recommended, especially seeing that a Scarlet Dragon will only do 5k anyway. But do I need two epics? I bought the scarlet as a cheaper back-up camera, so having another Epic MX defeats the purpose. Upgrading my Epic to Dragon, and Scarlet to Epic is just too much finically after a year of heavy investment in cameras and equipment.

What to do? It's a seriously hard decision.
 
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