Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Log in
  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

When will Dragon be available for sale in stock ready to buy it now

I

Iskandar Abdullayev

Active member
Joined
Jan 18, 2014
Messages
26
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Hi community,
Thank you for the opportunity to be here. I am putting together a business plan. Some of the inventory will include high-end cameras. I need to choose between Alexa package or Dragon package. While Alexa is very expensive, IT IS AVAILABLE NOW. Dragon looks great, but not for sale. The only option is 50K CF Dragon, but I simply cannot justify overpaying 21K for 1 lb weight advantage.
So here is the simple question: When will $29K Dragon be available in stock? When will random customer be able to open a webpage, order it and receive in 3-5 business days?

Thanks!
 
Outside a few people at Red no one knows. It's a secret. There is a huge waiting line and even one's place on this list is secret. While a few people have tried to reverse-engineer their turn it has proven to be useless. So if your business plan needs a camera soon I would opt for the options that are actually available.
 
I wouldn't count on it until at least end 2014. (This is just a wild guess of course) There is a huge line of people waiting and things are still evolving. To be honest I don't mind waiting for it since the camera is not yet complete. (Still tweaking color science , SDK, and enabling features etc)... I'd rather get the dragon when it's fully ready to go and properly operational from day one as opposed to dealing with growing pains like previous years...
 
Maz Mawlawi said:
I wouldn't count on it until at least end 2014. (This is just a wild guess of course) There is a huge line of people waiting and things are still evolving. To be honest I don't mind waiting for it since the camera is not yet complete. (Still tweaking color science , SDK, and enabling features etc)... I'd rather get the dragon when it's fully ready to go and properly operational from day one as opposed to dealing with growing pains like previous years...
Click to expand...

I have no idea of timeframe. CF seems to be delivered.
I am rather opposed to the notion that there are "growing pains" with the Dragon, in comparison with R1, R1 MX or Epic.
Prortotype Dragon I had in August was 100% stable and there was a post-workflow.
the Dragon I have had since late November has been stable and un-moody, as it seems most others have been.

Yup. Have to change the OLPF. In some ways a PITA, but not implying the the current Dragon is either dysfunctional or moody or hard to get a workflow for.

I am glad Geoff triggered an extra mail conversation between RED and blackmagick on the ACES workflow, but there are no issues using Dragon footy in Resolve or other online tools "out of the box" NOW.

RED is really doing a lot of things differently in this rollout.

These kind of notions die hard
(I still get confronted with the R1s behavior back in March 2008, because someone observed it back then. I do not need that notion to follow the Dragon, unless of course it is true. Which it is not)
 
Thank you for all responses, will keep in mind to check at the end of 2014.
I was thinking. Here is the typical line of thought: RED One MX is discontinued, Scarlet is severely limited by no slo mo, buying Epic is kind of frustrating when Dragon is around the corner... but $29k Dragon is not ready yet. Too much drama. :) Exciting for fans, pulling teeth for professionals... My humble opinion, I love RED cameras...
Another thought: cheap GH4 and new 4k blackmagic just came out. What if Arri comes with 4k? Dragon better be in stock and color-ready before that. Would be great to land a blockbuster or two ;)
 
Last edited:
There is a really good path, if you really want Dragon. Buy Epic and upgrade... :)

Price: the same.

And Epic isn't a bad camera while waiting.
 
Iskandar Abdullayev said:
Thank you for all responses, will keep in mind to check at the end of 2014.
I was thinking. Here is the typical line of thought: RED One MX is discontinued, Scarlet is severely limited by no slo mo, buying Epic is kind of frustrating when Dragon is around the corner... but $29k Dragon is not ready yet. Too much drama. :) Exciting for fans, pulling teeth for professionals... My humble opinion, I love RED cameras...
Another thought: cheap GH4 and new 4k blackmagic just came out. What if Arri comes with 4k? Dragon better be in stock and color-ready before that.
Click to expand...

I doubt that Arri will beat Dragon on price, performance, size weight or resolution anytime soon… Now when I got the dragon and I tested it for a few days I can only say without exaggerating that it's out performs all other cameras I laid my hand on. (we have been shooting Alexa XT the last couple of jobs) Dragon is nuts, it's not just a little bit better, to me the imagery it produce is like a few times better than anything else. It got the DR to blow the alexa XT out of the water, the resolution and low noise to even make epic MX look like low res and so on… it's simply so good so I can not sleep.

Now when the OLPF is fixed I honestly think that buying the CF dragon is a really good option for people that want to cut in line. The extra cost will be quite easy to make up. As I can not think of an alexa client that would not pick the dragon if they just got a demo of it. Basically I as I see it you would be stupid to shot with anything else than an epic dragon today if you could have one as it is so far above the rest it's ridiculous.
 
Iskandar Abdullayev said:
Another thought: cheap GH4 and new 4k blackmagic just came out. What if Arri comes with 4k? Dragon better be in stock and color-ready before that. Would be great to land a blockbuster or two ;)
Click to expand...

GH4 isn't out yet, it's not even in beta yet or limited production they have only showed an engineering experiment. Blackmagic is "out" but unavailable for order today as well. They're both at or behind the Dragon on the production line. If Arri starts shipping a 4k Alexa this year it'll also face shortages on release and be limited in availability. Also there is a nearly 0% chance of an upgrade so if you need something *now* but want to upgrade in the future I would buy used Alexas or else an Epic and a place in line for the Dragon update.

There will certainly be more 4k available in the future. My cell phone (Nokia 1020) has an 8k sensor that shoots RAW. So, extrapolate what you want from there. But even though the 5D has more resolution I prefer my Epic for stills due to workflow and tools. The GH4s and Blackmagics of the world will always be there and they will always be a great option for a lot of solutions but the Alexa/Epic place in production will be untouched.
 
Few know the answer to this. However if I owned a camera company I'd certainly want my premium camera shipping before NAB in April...before a 4K Alexa is announced.

I also agree that for the money Epic is a pretty rad option.
 
Epic MX si a premium camera now. I'd rather they wait and perfect than ship anything to me that is less than optimal. I'm sure they are going as fast as they possibly can.
 
Last edited:
The new OLPFs should be in stock and in sufficient numbers in just a few days. Carbons are probably caught up so that will free up those technicians. I'm thinking upgrades go quickly once everything is in place, although there will be a new procedure to make the OLPF one with the camera... don't know where the Dragons already shipped will insert into the assembly line, but that should be a simple procedure to change out the OLPF. Assembling new cameras could go quicker than upgrades since nothing has to be removed. Not sure what RED's schedule is or how many cameras are left to upgrade but being an eternal optimist, I think new Dragons will be on sale before Autumn.
 
According to Jarred here is Dragon roll out plans
This is the order we will continue to roll out :
CARBON DRAGON -New Carbon Dragon orders are manufactured and shipped on their own schedule. 2-3 weeks after order.


PRIORITY 1: “EPIC-M DRAGON / Early Adopter / Purchased EPIC-X Within 30 Days of NAB” Upgrades*


PRIORITY 2.1: “EPIC-M DRAGON New Camera Orders: After all owners of “EPIC-M / Early Adopter / Purchased EPIC-X Within 30 Days of NAB” have been notified they are eligible to send in cameras for upgrade*, new EPIC-M DRAGON orders will begin to be processed.

I hope it helps

Harcharan
 
Harcharan Singh said:
According to Jarred here is Dragon roll out plans
This is the order we will continue to roll out :
CARBON DRAGON -New Carbon Dragon orders are manufactured and shipped on their own schedule. 2-3 weeks after order.


PRIORITY 1: “EPIC-M DRAGON / Early Adopter / Purchased EPIC-X Within 30 Days of NAB” Upgrades*


PRIORITY 2.1: “EPIC-M DRAGON New Camera Orders: After all owners of “EPIC-M / Early Adopter / Purchased EPIC-X Within 30 Days of NAB” have been notified they are eligible to send in cameras for upgrade*, new EPIC-M DRAGON orders will begin to be processed.

I hope it helps

Harcharan
Click to expand...

I think we can add the big fish and big rentals into the equation.

A Blockbuster needs 30 Epic Dragon? You have to make them and give'em. More good movies made by Dragon cameras, more it will establish into rental business and enough prestige in the industry to persuade many Alexa lovers between DP's.

So, big fishes (Bay, Jackson, Fincher, Scott, Soderberg, and obviously not big like that, but MovieMakers), then Big Rentals and small Rentals.

Then some friends and families (no sarcasm here: if i have something good, first to know it and have it are my friend and families).

Then everything you said in your post.

Keep also in mind that before "open to public sales" the Dragon, i think Red will need to have a large number of it in store, since going sold out after short term sales, would be badmouthing from the old same Red haters.

So let the guys work, it's their primary interest make as fast as possible, i don't see secrets here, only manyfacturer's time needed.

My two cents.
 
Last edited:
no idea how soon it will be available in non carbon form, the carbon may not be worth it for the weight loss according to your needs, but you can get a camera in hand sooner. some find value in that and can work it fast enough that the premium isn't relevant. i am sure red is doing everything it can to get things done. i think buying a new or used epic is your best bet, you can make revenue now, today, and still get dragon. personally went from scarlet to epic and am very happy
 
I would guess not until 2015, honestly. But I think Red has learned the hard way that it's better in the long run to release cameras when they're ready instead of trying to meet self-imposed deadlines. They wouldn't suffer so many "delays" if they would just set more realistic deadlines.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top