What is "lost" when a sensor is not deemed Epic worthy?

[Jay Birch]

Any thoughts on what issues we may be facing with the lower par Scarlet (edit*) components?

Less resolution? more noise? less range?

Any thoughts from a more technical minded user?

 

[Nick Pasquariello]

It's not the sensor, it's the processors. Same way an Intel i7 is formed from the same die and then binned out based on performance (with the ones that happen to perform better being sold at a higher cost), the processors that were deemed too slow (and way more abundant) than those used in Epic were re-purposed for Scarlet.

All else being equal, you will get the exact same quality images from Scarlet; it just can't make as many of them each second. Hence the same resolutions, but lower frame rates.

 

[Vance Colvig]

My understanding is that Red One MX, Epic X and Scarlett all use the same MX sensor. Bandwidth and camera features vary from model to model.

 

[Peter Lyons Collister ASC]

The sensors in the Scarlet are the exact same ones and the same quality as those in the Epic. It is the ASIC boards that slightly different.

 

[Imran Farouk]

The brains the same...the parts that get to the info are just a step down...

EPIC needed higher grade parts...

Scarlet gets the lower grade, its not waste from EPIC its parts that didn't suite the EPIC because they didn't have the bandwidth...

 

[Graeme Nattress]

Each and every camera gets a high quality sensor. Just because you buy a Scarlet doesn't mean your sensor is any less worthy than if you bought an Epic.

What is different on the Scarlet is the processing speed of the ASICs. That limits functionality (high fps, high redcode), not sensor image quality.

Graeme

 

[Jay Birch]

ahh cool... I understand now... thanks for the answers.

 

[David Battistella]

And I am so glad it is this way and not just a software only solution. If that were the case there would be HACKIN' RED's all over the place in six months time.

David

Each and every camera gets a high quality sensor. Just because you buy a Scarlet doesn't mean your sensor is any less worthy than if you bought an Epic.

What is different on the Scarlet is the processing speed of the ASICs. That limits functionality (high fps, high redcode), not sensor image quality.

Graeme

 

[Erik Franzén]

Usually, when a an ASIC or similar does not pass QC, you pass it on to it's less capable brethren and disable a core or two, downclock it, and that's pretty much it. Some redesign is usually necessary, but not extensively. So no, as Graeme said, it's not the sensor that's being affected.

 

[Kamilla Lusa]

What is different on the Scarlet is the processing speed of the ASICs. That limits functionality (high fps, high redcode), not sensor image quality.

Graeme

Are current ASICs capable to process more than 48 fps in 3K? We in PAL land would really appreciate 50 fps in 3K but do not want to get our hopes up if that's not possible because of ASICs. On the other hand, 25 fps HDRX seems ok. So is it possible that a firmware upgrade in the future might enable 50 fps 3K or is it simply impossible? I know it's foolish to ask for more when we already have a lot but +2 fps does not seem like much (of course I have no idea what's involved)

thanks, Kamilla

 

[David Battistella]

The name of this thread should be changed. People might actually start thinking there are different sensors in the different cameras.

David

 

[Mondo Ghulam]

What is different on the Scarlet is the processing speed of the ASICs. That limits functionality (high fps, high redcode), not sensor image quality.

Graeme

Hi Graeme,

Forgive my lack of knowledge, do you know if the difference in performance with the ASICs has any impact on rolling shutter behaviour?

 

[AJ Aguirre]

The name of this thread should be changed. People might actually start thinking there are different sensors in the different cameras.

David

+1, pretty misleading if someone doesn't take the time to read the post

 

[Graeme Nattress]

Hi Graeme,

Forgive my lack of knowledge, do you know if the difference in performance with the ASICs has any impact on rolling shutter behaviour?

It should have no effect.

Graeme

 

[conrad gaunt]

its possible epics get cherry picked sensors, the x was originally sold as having a "select" sensor. epic s might have four times the bandwidth, but they sure don't cost four times as much to manufacture, so that would seem reasonable. im pretty sure some need more blackshading than others, but the end result should all be the same

 

[Mondo Ghulam]

It should have no effect.

Graeme

That is excellent news! Thank you.

 

[David Battistella]

its possible epics get cherry picked sensors, the x was originally sold as having a "select" sensor. epic s might have four times the bandwidth, but they sure don't cost four times as much to manufacture, so that would seem reasonable. im pretty sure some need more blackshading than others, but the end result should all be the same

I have to ask:

Where the hell are you getting this stuff????????

David

 

[JohnF]

I have to ask:

Where the hell are you getting this stuff????????

David

During the excitement of the November 3rd announcement it was reported, and I'm paraphrasing here, that for the SCARLET cameras Red would be using sensors that did not meet the standards for EPIC's.

The reports had the statement in quotes from a named source at RED.

Unfortunately I do not have the links to the articles ATM nor can't remember who the named source was reported as being.

That's probably what started this rumour.

JohnF

 

[Jay Birch]

I think myself and JohnF saw a similar thing (during the announcement) and were confused.

If a mod can please change the topic to read "components" and not "sensor".... that will clear up any confusion.

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

I have to ask:

Where the hell are you getting this stuff????????

David

The Nov 2008 announcement did say that Epic-Xs get "Select Sensors" over their normal Epic brethren. That was the last time I think that was mentioned.