VV Monstro Canon Mount

[Greg M]

I received the new VV Canon Mount today...Is this VV only or can it be used on Helium sensor or Dragon?

Product page indicated VV only:
http://www.red.com/store/products/dsmc-al-canon-mount-vv


Love the improved build quality and the captive screws...great little addition at a new affordable price.

 

[BrendanLeahy]

My rep stated:

"It's more about of the spacing between the lens mount and the sensor. They expose a different size of the sensor. The VV Canon Mount is intended for the VV Sensor while the S35 Canon Mount is intended for the S35 Sensor.

But yes they are also equipped for different lenses."

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

The VV mount can be used on your DSMC2 camera with S35 sensors, I don’t know about DSMC1 compatibility. The updated mount has an improved internal masking design that means less chance of gate shadow and less chance of obstruction for some FF glass on the larger VV sensor. The electronics are updated too. As for the captive screws, yes this is a nice addition, but not new to this version of the mount as they were added in the previous revision. There is no difference in spacing as the flange depth for Canon EF is always the same, regardless of whether it’s 35FF/VV or S35 (APS-H, APS-C, etc.. in Canon speak). Currently the aluminum version of the mount is all that’s on the RED store, but we should see the titanium one at some point. The titanium one being more expensive, probably the same $2K price tag of the current Canon Ti mount as the new VV aluminum is $750, same as the previous aluminum one.

 

[Greg M]

Thanks for the replies...I finally received an answer from RED and was advised NOT to use the new mount on DSMC2 bodies with S35 sensors.
Specifically it should only be used with the VV Monstro.

I shot some footage today on a Helium S35 sensor, so after Ive had a chance to review the footage I'll report back the results...but be advised that RED recommends not using this with the Helium.

 

[Antony Newman]

Greg :

Do you want to swap your Canon VV with the Canon regular?

I was just about to order the Canon VV & have the standard Canon mount.

(I have unopened : STH & LLO OLPF to sweeten the deal!)

AJ

 

[Greg M]

Greg :

Do you want to swap your Canon VV with the Canon regular?

I was just about to order the Canon VV & have the standard Canon mount.

(I have unopened : STH & LLO OLPF to sweeten the deal!)

AJ

Thanks, but I ordered the VV mount for my Monstro...it just arrived yesterday. You can buy one from RED.

The original question is because I have both Monstro and Helium sensors.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

Curious who told you not to use the new mount with the S35 sensors? Absolutely nothing with those sensors is effected in any way. Not only that, but whichever mount you send in with your camera (PL or Canon) they upgrade it to the new VV enhanced version. Yes, the PL mount has been upgraded to play nicer with VV as well. And they don’t swap the mounts back if you send in the camera for an S35 sensor swap...

The new mounts most likely work on DSMC1 cameras as well. They work just fine as dumb mounts for sure, just not sure if the new electronics have new or different instructions vs the old mounts. I’m going to guess they do not and compatibility is fine, but I have not specifically asked RED that question nor tried it — no more DSMC1 cameras here.

 

[Phil Holland]

Thanks for the replies...I finally received an answer from RED and was advised NOT to use the new mount on DSMC2 bodies with S35 sensors.

Curious who told you not to use the new mount with the S35 sensors? Absolutely nothing with those sensors is effected in any way. Not only that, but whichever mount you send in with your camera (PL or Canon) they upgrade it to the new VV enhanced version. Yes, the PL mount has been upgraded to play nicer with VV as well. And they don’t swap the mounts back if you send in the camera for an S35 sensor swap...

Sort of.

While the Canon EF VV Mount WILL work on S35 cameras it's flocking, matte, and port hole size and design are different which can effect contrast and light bouncing in the sensor box. It's a subtle thing, I mean way subtle, but it's a thing.

 

[Greg M]

Curious who told you not to use the new mount with the S35 sensors?

The guys who made the mount.

BTW- look at the product page I linked above. It states VV only.
Ive shot with the new mount on the Helium, so I'll report the results after ive reviewed the footage...although I suspect unless I do a side-by-side comparison (same scenes using both mounts) it will be hard to tell.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

The guys who made the mount.

Heh. No, really. I was asking because I’ve got guys at RED telling me otherwise.

That said, I agree with Phil’s assessment of possibilities above. And yet I’ve been told that the new VV versions of the mounts are intended to be the upgraded, superior versions, even when used when swapping back to an S35 sensor. I asked this specifically of multiple people before sending in the camera. I did not want to upgrade my Canon mount if it was going to affect operation on S35.

So I’m interested in what your tests show.

BTW- look at the product page I linked above. It states VV only.
Ive shot with the new mount on the Helium, so I'll report the results after ive reviewed the footage...although I suspect unless I do a side-by-side comparison (same scenes using both mounts) it will be hard to tell.

 

[Antony Newman]

Jeff,

You are probably already aware :

If you have a non-VV magnesium PL mount lying around - RED will replace it with a VV version.

As RED only (kindly!) offer to upgrade one mount in the Monstro upgrade process - it make more $ense to send the PL.

AJ

 

[Samir Patel]

Kind of makes zero sense if a VV mount won't work on S35. So you're telling me if i owned a Monstro and bought a Helium sensor and was in the sensor swap program i still need to own 2 different mounts? I can understand yeah if my only one was s35 size but if i owned a VV one how is that not backwards compatible? I had actually been considering selling both my s35 mounts and buying 2 VV mounts just to cover me incase I moved forward or rented just a VV body on occassion.

 

[James Kuo]

Kind of makes zero sense if a VV mount won't work on S35. So you're telling me if i owned a Monstro and bought a Helium sensor and was in the sensor swap program i still need to own 2 different mounts? I can understand yeah if my only one was s35 size but if i owned a VV one how is that not backwards compatible? I had actually been considering selling both my s35 mounts and buying 2 VV mounts just to cover me incase I moved forward or rented just a VV body on occassion.

Agree��

 

[Mike P.]

Internal reflections aside, I'd love to know if it can (technically) work on a DSMC1... If someone still has one of them kicking around, that'd be pretty sweet to know.

I was also under the impression that the mounts were pretty universal (albeit with the VV merely having a bigger hole to support an obviously bigger circle/opening).

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

It *should* work, but I can’t guarantee it. My Canon TI mount I’ve had since the early days of my EPIC-M works fine on DSMC2, both Helium and Monstro VV. The VV mount has an updated PCB design and larger aperture so as to eliminate possibility of vignetting or other effects that may occur with certain lenses on the larger sensor. Have the new VV Canon mount as well which works on all DSMC2 brains/sensors, Helium, VV, Gemini 5K... but no DSMC1 cameras to test with, although I’m 98.5% sure it will work on DSMC1 as well.

 

[Patrick Kendall]

here's the two thousand dollar question.. if you go to the red store, you will see that they no longer sell the Mg PL Mount for $3200, they instead are selling an Al PL Mount for $950.. cudos for that.. but my worry now is if I send in my camera with the Mg PL mount next week to upgrade to VV, that I will get back an AL PL VV Mount.. My contract says I will get back an Mg PL VV mount, but still I worry about falling between the cracks and getting the coconut switch. Can recent Monstro upgraders confirm their traded for VV PL mount is indeed Mg? it will say it on the back.

 

[Jeff Kilgroe]

You could talk to RED before-hand and clarify which mount you’ll get back. I don’t think they’re making more Mg or Ti mounts so they’re only still available while supplies last. The nutshell explanation here is that the new price point for these cameras doesn’t support the cost of $2K~$3K lens mount options and I’m betting most opted for the Al versions anyway. My Ti PL mounts got upgraded to Mg with the 8K upgrades. I sold one Ti Canon mount and still have another, bought the Al VV Canon mount to replace the Ti one. Meh... the new VV one supposedly works better for some lenses with the larger sensor as it has a larger aperture opening. But I don’t see any difference. I guess I made $200 on the exchange and the new VV one has captive screws that my older mounts don’t. So there’s that going for it... The Mg PL mounts are definitely lighter than the Ti ones, so if you can get Mg then do so. I’ve actually never owned or used an Al PL mount for the DSMC system...

 

[Antony Newman]

My understanding is they replace like for like (I am not aware of a policy change)

+) During my own Monstro upgrade : DSMC2 Magnesium PL mount -> returned with a DSMC2 Magnesium PL VV mount.

+) Captive screws in the mount (as JK mentioned)
+) There must have been some 'corner cases that needed a wider opening from REDs testing & Dragon VV feedback for RED to warrant a redesign.

AJ

 

[Björn Benckert]

I use the old canon mount on monstro. Have not seen any flocking artifacts. But I guess some port hole shadow can accur if aimwd toward somthing that flares. my guess is that the VV mount has flocking thats improved and should not leave a shadow on helium or dsmc1 but possibly give some light bounce in the port on those cameras as the flocking hole is larger than before but improved.

 

[James Kuo]

Kind of makes zero sense if a VV mount won't work on S35. So you're telling me if i owned a Monstro and bought a Helium sensor and was in the sensor swap program i still need to own 2 different mounts? I can understand yeah if my only one was s35 size but if i owned a VV one how is that not backwards compatible? I had actually been considering selling both my s35 mounts and buying 2 VV mounts just to cover me incase I moved forward or rented just a VV body on occassion.

Agree��