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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

TIME AND DATE ISSUE...really?

Luca Volpe said:
Yes I know Neil...just wondering what the real issue is...
Click to expand...

I don't know what the real problem was. However, the camera was running at higher temperature when compared to other RED cameras. And the internal battery was draining within a couple of days.

I don't think it is a problem with RED cameras in general. This anomaly might have been specific to our camera only.
 
Ok so, at Red UK I think they find the problem:
It has to do with the Internal Circuit Design.
They said that if for a longer period of time Camera hasn’t been used, the Camera needs to then be Charged for a period of 30+ hours. This will recharge the internal battery.
 
Luca, are you saying the camera needs to be left on for 30hours or just plugged in for 30hours?

Is that for DSMC1 as well?
 
Luca Volpe said:
Ok so, at Red UK I think they find the problem:
It has to do with the Internal Circuit Design.
They said that if for a longer period of time Camera hasn’t been used, the Camera needs to then be Charged for a period of 30+ hours. This will recharge the internal battery.
Click to expand...

Can you be more specific? I usually have a 2nd camera as a backup and never turned on for months....so are you or rather RED UK...saying the camera needs to be plugged into AC power for 30 or more hours? Not sure i understand what you mean by "charging the camera"....i was not aware that it needed to be charged...or am i not understanding correctly?

thanks, Johnny
 
Luca Volpe said:
Ok so, at Red UK I think they find the problem:
It has to do with the Internal Circuit Design.
They said that if for a longer period of time Camera hasn’t been used, the Camera needs to then be Charged for a period of 30+ hours. This will recharge the internal battery.
Click to expand...

Well, then RED needs to change how that battery is charged. If you have to leave the camera 'ON" to charge the battery, that is NOT a good thing. It is a poor design by engineering dept. While the camera is "ON", it accumulates time or hours of operation. Consider it as a "Hobbs meter" running at power on and stops at power off. It indicates the total number of hours in operation (or accumulated total number of hours) which affects when you go to sell your camera or if and when you send it for repair. Besides, it is an inconvenience (and an intellectually challenged method) to have the camera "ON" just to charge the internal battery.

RED could device a better charging option by obtaining power (when the camera is turned off) thru a brick (battery) is attached to the back of the camera or whenever power is supplied with a charger, power supply etc.
 
Neil Abeynayake said:
Well, then RED needs to change how that battery is charged. If you have to leave the camera 'ON" to charge the battery, that is NOT a good thing. It is a poor design by engineering dept. While the camera is "ON", it accumulates time or hours of operation. Consider it as a "Hobbs meter" running at power on and stops at power off. It indicates the total number of hours in operation (or accumulated total number of hours) which affects when you go to sell your camera or if and when you send it for repair. Besides, it is an inconvenience (and an intellectually challenged method) to have the camera "ON" just to charge the internal battery.

RED could device a better charging option by obtaining power (when the camera is turned off) thru a brick (battery) is attached to the back of the camera or whenever power is supplied with a charger, power supply etc.
Click to expand...

I would guess that the camera doesn't need to be on to charge, just plugged in.

I just had the battery thing happen with my Scarlet Dragon (for the 3rd time!!) and, yes, it was not used for awhile. I will try the 30-hour charge thing and report back. (Can't get to it for abut a week, though.)
 
Just had the confirmation that had to be ON and in plug! Charging for 30hours it will avoid the internal battery die...for a while. I have the feeling that we need to use more our cameras even to film our dog in a park...lol...I think that we will see an update on this on new dsmc bodie in the future...
 
I was experiencing the same issue where the timecode was reset to 0. But since using it for production this week and it being on the problem seem to have gone away temporarily. I suppose the more you use it (with frequency) the more it has the ability to be charged (while being in use), would make sense. What I think is a pity is that it cannot be charged with only having the AC adapter connected (without the camera being on), but the fact that the camera has to be on in order to charge the battery. This I think most owners will try to avoid as your hour count will go up only for the sake of charging your battery. The response from RED support has been good and I will see if under "normal" usage, the internal battery in fact will hold its charge - meaning that if the camera is in use with a certain frequency then it will not have the opportunity to get completely discharged. Just a thought.

Pasting the response from RED support below:
"The camera will need to be on (as in, camera running) for 35 hours to achieve the full charge on the internal RTC battery. We would then expect the battery to last around 90 days depending on storage temperature."

I hope this information helps.
 
I'm not sure I believe the theory that the RTC battery is rechargeable and that the camera must be on or even plugged in so frequently. If that's true then it is a spectacularly poor design. Any camera should be able to be left on the shelf for long amount of time and be able to come back to life 100% once a charged battery is attached -- that is a fundamental performance requirement. The entire point of a RTC battery is to keep things going while a computer is turned off. It should be able to last as long as one would conceivably leave the computer/camera off -- I would say a minimum of six months and a year is more typical. And when the battery does finally go dead, it needs to be user replaceable.

If such a flaw was indeed built into DSMC1 and especially DSMC2 cameras I would be surprised.
 
Med D said:
And when the battery does finally go dead, it needs to be user replaceable.

If such a flaw was indeed built into DSMC1 and especially DSMC2 cameras I would be surprised.
Click to expand...

I still remember my grandfather's old camera from the 70's that has a removable slot that houses a thin coin battery inside that's easily be replaced by removing a single screw..
 
Med D said:
I'm not sure I believe the theory that the RTC battery is rechargeable and that the camera must be on or even plugged in so frequently. If that's true then it is a spectacularly poor design. Any camera should be able to be left on the shelf for long amount of time and be able to come back to life 100% once a charged battery is attached -- that is a fundamental performance requirement. The entire point of a RTC battery is to keep things going while a computer is turned off. It should be able to last as long as one would conceivably leave the computer/camera off -- I would say a minimum of six months and a year is more typical. And when the battery does finally go dead, it needs to be user replaceable.

If such a flaw was indeed built into DSMC1 and especially DSMC2 cameras I would be surprised.
Click to expand...

It's exactly like this. The internal battery can't be replaced by the user and the only way is to send the camera to Red to have it replaced. I really don't understand how the internal battery for storing clock and date have been designed to not hold for more than 90 days or at this time 14 days. My wristwatch will hold time and a mechanical clock running for more than 5 years. That such a tiny and in-expensive thing in our camera creates such an expensive and tedious problem is really mind-boggling.

I've spoken with Red London and proposed them to get the word up the chain since it's not certain that this thread has the attention from Red. These problems need a permanent fix. What happens to someone who buys an old Red that has been stored for a while and the internal battery is dead because of it? (I mean dead dead, depleted). This tiny battery-thing renders the camera useless in terms of timecode consistency and production workflow. That a $30 000 - $70 000 camera has a worse time/date/info battery than $9 scrap toys is not what I consider ok for such an investment.

I don't understand any of this.
 
Luca Volpe said:
Thanks David...but still looks absurd on how a brand new camera has an internal battery alteady dead?
Click to expand...

not to me.. sounds like my redmote that came with a dead battery, that can't be changed by the user ..or my faulty main IO board that's been replaced each time ive upgraded (twice, despite never pluggin any SDI devices into it EVER!) , or the red paint flaking off my red 300 prime when I unpacked it.. update your expectations , its going to be expensive beyond reason over time
 
Mike P. said:
Does the camera need to be turned on for 30+ hours, or just plugged in?

And does this work for DSMC1?
Click to expand...

Wouldn't it be nice if someone from Red were to answer this and post the answer here in this thread? :)

My understanding is that the camera has to be ON for the internal battery to charge and not just plugged in.
 
Martin, See my post #59, official response from Red Support. Unfortunately as Luca wrote in post #87 charging time was corrected to 30h+ for charge in the meantime and only holding power for 3 month and yes, this is with the camera turned on and not only plugged in power supply. It looks like the design team never thought about a professional camera not being in use at least a couple of hours every week, which is odd. Once again, I would not even care if I just have to set date and time prior to shooting, I´m worried about the internal battery might fail soon when a camera is just a backup camera or not used regularly. We all know what happened the deep discharged batteries. Cheers!
 
Ulf Krentz said:
Martin, See my post #59, official response from Red Support. Unfortunately as Luca wrote in post #87 charging time was corrected to 30h+ for charge in the meantime and only holding power for 3 month and yes, this is with the camera turned on and not only plugged in power supply. It looks like the design team never thought about a professional camera not being in use at least a couple of hours every week, which is odd. Once again, I would not even care if I just have to set date and time prior to shooting, I´m worried about the internal battery might fail soon when a camera is just a backup camera or not used regularly. We all know what happened the deep discharged batteries. Cheers!
Click to expand...

Thanks for this... but post #59 is not a post that Red posted. I'm not saying that your post is incorrect, just that Red did not post it.

I would like to see this charging info in the MANUAL. Also, how do we see the charge level of this little internal battery?
 
So you can't just have the battery put onto the camera without it on?
 
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