Welcome to our community

Be a part of something great, join today!

Register Log in
  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

The Martian - Ridley Scott + Dariusz Wolski shot on RED DRAGON

Does anyone know why the shot at 24.00 FPS instead of 23.98?

Is is that also a result of the regional power differences?
 
Marcus Friedlander said:
Does anyone know why the shot at 24.00 FPS instead of 23.98?

Is is that also a result of the regional power differences?
Click to expand...

It was merely a request by the sound department. Why they requested I don't know, but that's the genesis of it.
 
Hmmm that seems like a strange request theses days. Time to do some research on the benefits!

Thanks for for the answer!
 
I agree. But it was info given to me to pass on to my crew to set up the cameras. That's all they told me. I was shooting for Ridley Scott. That's all I needed to know :)
 
Marcus Friedlander said:
Does anyone know why the shot at 24.00 FPS instead of 23.98?

Is is that also a result of the regional power differences?
Click to expand...

Just a half educated guess, but I believe DCPs require integer frame speed of exact 24fps. 23.98 (23.976) is primarily for NTSC broadcast, and as this is a movie primarily intended for the cinema, prioritising DCP delivery would make sense.

Edit: http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?79406-23-98-VS-24/page2
This relatively old thread indicates 23.976fps would still be the more failsafe option with a conversion to 24.00 for DCP/film out, but if you're Ridley Scott or Dariusz Wolski, I expect you can shoot whatever framerate you like! And as long as all production and post knows that you're shooting true 24fps, then all will be well.
 
Daniel Stilling said:
I agree. But it was info given to me to pass on to my crew to set up the cameras. That's all they told me. I was shooting for Ridley Scott. That's all I needed to know :)
Click to expand...

hahahaha that is certainly reason enough! Is there anything you can share with us about that experience? I would love to know what working for a legendary director like him is like!
 
ericyoung said:
Just a half educated guess without checking, but don't DCPs require integer 24fps? 23.98 is primarily for NTSC broadcast, and as this is a movie primarily intended for the cinema, prioritising DCP delivery would make sense.
Click to expand...

That definitely seems like a reasonable explanation. 23.98 vs 24 seems more like a post production question these days then a question for the DP.
 
ericyoung said:
Just a half educated guess, but I believe DCPs require integer frame speed of exact 24fps. 23.98 (23.976) is primarily for NTSC broadcast, and as this is a movie primarily intended for the cinema, prioritising DCP delivery would make sense.
Click to expand...

Yes cinema has been 24p since... long back. People used to work with film tend to like to think that a second is an even number of frames. American TV standards I dont know who draw the lines for but I think it´s more people than me that try to avoid the as far as possible.
 
possible reason for 24.00 v 23.98 fps

possible reason for 24.00 v 23.98 fps

I have worked in sound on (digital) projects where we set up both camera and sound at 24.00 fps because post told us it would simplify making a film print from the digital original.
Perhaps M Most or M Weilage could comment, and expand on this.

Or.." that's what they told me to do... I was shooting for Ridley Scott" is also a great reason
 
I recently DIT'd the movie Green Room and in prep the post supervisor and I asked the same question: WHY exactly can't we shoot 24.00?? The answer is there is no good reason for feature work. The post sup asked everyone up and down the workflow and as long as they were expecting it, 24 was no issues at all. The post sup was pushing for it because it skips a conversion step from 23.98 to 24 for the DCP. So if you aren't shooting for broadcast, 24.00 makes a lot of sense to me.
 
So as long as the DCP is the main deliverable, then it makes more sense to shoot 24.00 instead of 23.98. That's so interesting, I didn't think that the .02 frame conversion was that big of a deal but I guess it is! Thanks for sharing!
 
Sean Rawls said:
I recently DIT'd the movie Green Room and in prep the post supervisor and I asked the same question: WHY exactly can't we shoot 24.00?? The answer is there is no good reason for feature work. The post sup asked everyone up and down the workflow and as long as they were expecting it, 24 was no issues at all. The post sup was pushing for it because it skips a conversion step from 23.98 to 24 for the DCP. So if you aren't shooting for broadcast, 24.00 makes a lot of sense to me.
Click to expand...

It really makes no difference at all.

Nobody does a "conversion" - they just do an audio pitch shift and change the speed the progressives frames play.

DCP is true 24 - but the most common deliverable frame rate for streaming is 23.98. You play back material originated in either frame rate at the other frame rate with a simple audio pitch shift (pull up or pull down).
 
I just wish 30 frames per second wasn't a thing*. :( Biggest ballache 23.98, 24 or 25 to 30 or vice versa. But I'm just a PALand guy!

*Aware of the historic reason for different framerates.
 
Anyone else notice the varying color temps in some of the NASA meeting scenes? In some shots, it looked like some actors were being lit with fluorescents with a green tint while other actors in the same shot looked properly balanced. Other than that, the movie looked stellar but I definitely would have liked to have seen it in 4K. The 2K version I saw had aliasing in a shot or two.
 
Patrick Tresch said:
I shoot 25p for DCP. No headache here anymore.
Click to expand...


Well at 25p is not a DCP rate so it is actually a headache. I shot a feature at 25fps, 24fps would have been better..... we did do a 4k DCP FWIW, the post house wanted to test the workflow as they had never done a 4k DCP for a feature. Top post house in Zurich if not all of Switzerland.
 
Daniel Stilling said:
96349478-afb4-4914-a5f1-07c0b436c358_zpsvcdvwxck.jpg

Hello from the Hermes :)
Click to expand...

Great shot Daniel!!

Sadly, I am still in Mauritius and haven't seen it yet... Well not sad that I'm in beautiful Island... Just sad that I haven't had a chance to see this film yet... :)
 
Stephen Williams said:
Well at 25p is not a DCP rate so it is actually a headache. I shot a feature at 25fps, 24fps would have been better..... we did do a 4k DCP FWIW, the post house wanted to test the workflow as they had never done a 4k DCP for a feature. Top post house in Zurich if not all of Switzerland.
Click to expand...


Well the top post house is maybye not there where you'd think. I'm doing 25p 4k DCP here since 4 years and no problem at all. The usual suspects in Switzerland don't know how to handle 25p subtitles and tell the producer a lot stupid things like they have to "burn" the subtitle in the picture wich is a non sense.

Dolby told me that they are aware of the importance of 25p (wich is a DCP SMPTE format btw) and won't let the 25p folks down.
Only one old server couldn't handle 25p (DSS100 with DSP100 MB), none of those where installed in Switzerland.

Pat

For more infos from Dolby:

System Frame Rates for DCP Playback


DSS100 with DSP100 MB
JPEG 2000 2D: 24, 48
JPEG 2000 3D: 24
MPEG2: 23.98, 24, 25, 29.97, 30, 47.95, 50, 60

DSS200 with CAT862 MB
JPEG 2000 2K 2D: 24, 25, 30, 48, 50, 60
JPEG 2000 2K 3D: 24, 25, 30
MPEG2: 23.98, 24, 25, 29.97, 30, 47.95, 48, 50, 59.94, 60

DSS200 or DSS220 with CAT745 IMB

JPEG 2000 4K 2D: 24, 25

JPEG 2000 2K 2D: 24, 25, 30, 48, 50, 60, 96, 100, 120

JPEG 2000 2K 3D: 24, 25, 30, 48, 50, 60

MPEG2: 23.98, 24, 25, 29.97, 30

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top