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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Something New....

Piers McGrail said:
Are the SSDs a lot more rugged than CF?

CFs are nice and light, rarely had any problems with them. I guess the issue is data rate & capacity?

Would the 64gig cards have been less wieldy and less capable of capturing at the data rates of SSDs?

Sadly it is a huge increase in base cost. Who's going to want to keep their bundled CF module when it appears pretty much a redundant media in Red terms... it's like shipping the Epic with a free DV tape module :)

Would be nice to see a good deal on upgrading to the SSD module for the Epic-X package...
Click to expand...

The SSDs have no pins to bend like CFs (reader side), are almost 3x as fast, and much easier to scale capacity and speed over time. CF is very limited by comparison and more costly to scale.

The 64GB CF was going to cost quite a bit more than the 64GB SSD.
 
I know it's been said that the connectors will be replaced, as for the internal workings, will RED have it's own check fault system inside the SSD like p2 does? It so, then that justifies the pricing even more...
 
Cross compatibility...

Cross compatibility...

I am overjoyed to see the announcement that my R1 is going to be upgradeable with a SSD side module.
While I had decided to go with SSD on the Stage 2 EPIC, I had been concerned about managing two different types of media; CF for the R1, SSD for the EPIC.

Now, one media, either camera - makes all the sense in the world. :yesnod:

I fully understand RED's position on proprietary SSD media - the reasons are many and have been adequately addressed in other threads.

However, my question is whether the proprietary features of RED SSD will preclude cross-product use.
In other words, RED has confirmed that COTS SSD will not work in the R1 or EPIC modules. But will RED SSD's work in other 1.8" SSD compatible equipment?

For a real world example, I am planning on purchasing the CineForm Extreme monitor/recorder - which uses a 1.8" SSD. Will I be able to use RED SSD in that unit or will I need to purchase different sets of 1.8" media assigned to different recorders?



Edit: COTS = Commercial Off The Shelf
 
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Brian F Kobylarz said:
For a real world example, I am planning on purchasing the CineForm Extreme monitor/recorder - which uses a 1.8" SSD. Will I be able to use RED SSD in that unit or will I need to purchase different sets of 1.8" media assigned to different recorders?
Click to expand...

I believe you're referring to the Cinedeck Extreme. It uses 2.5" SSDs.
 
Mitch Gross said:
I believe you're referring to the Cinedeck Extreme. It uses 2.5" SSDs.
Click to expand...

Mitch,
Thank you so much for the correction. You are absolutely right - on both the product name and the SSD size. Somewhat embarrasing - I've posted on that unit before - obviously my memory cells are not up to spec tonight - I should learn not to post when this tired -
Tnx,
Brian
 
Any idea of those ssd lifespan ? How many cycles should they handle ?
I've never bought any ssd for my computer system because of short lifespan...
 
there are two types of ssd that are mainly used for drives. mlc and slc. mlc are the ones generally used for computing because they are cheaper. However, their lifespans aren't going to win any awards. Slc's have a much longer lifespan, but are unfortunately more costly. Red ram's run off slc drives, I'd expect then that the new 1.8 ssd's would be the same.
 
Ok, good news. Thank you for updating that outdated knowledge of mine :-D
 
Dear Perry
How are you
This is percy from Hong Kong, checking in
Percy@digitalmagic.com.hk

Currently we have 5 MX and a RED ONE
Arming 3x 3D stereo Rig.., 3 EXpo Pavilions' movie finished, and 4 3D stereo full length features, too
 
sorry I may have missed sent..
Percy
 
RED SSD 1.8 with other readers...

RED SSD 1.8 with other readers...

I understand only RED SSD media will work (at least full speed) on RED ONE or Epic SSD modules but can we offload to computer using other readers or will only the red station be supported ?

addonics are listing a cheap 1.8 e-sata reader on their website, that could be handy as a backup when traveling or to leave in the truck while on set...

http://www.addonics.com/products/flash_memory_reader/msxuddeu.asp

Thanks
 
The CF module in the RED One looks similar to most SATA to CF modules on the market, not just the Addonics. But that still doesn't account for customized firmware or any other tweaks that may make the RED version special.

As for the Addonics, or other off the shelf, 1.8" readers, they won't work. RED is using a proprietary connector on their SSDs. Off the shelf SSD's won't work here.
 
Dennis Guskov said:
soooo, if the new module allows for higher write speeds, does this mean that the R1s will be able to learn new tricks, like higher framerates at higher resolutions (eg 50fps @ 4K, or 100fps @ 3K perhaps) or some other things?
Click to expand...

more write speed to the storage means not more computing power before...
 
Stronz Vanderploeg said:
I think my biggest problem is the proprietary system. I have no problem with RED making SSDs available. I actually think it's quite a wonderful solution but I don't like the fact that it has to be RED SSDs only.

So many companies make you buy their products at their premium. I understand this from a financial standpoint but as a consumer it's really frustrating especially when the company stops making the device that works with their product but no one can come in and fill this gap.

Maybe RED SSDs are superior because RED just knows exactly what they are doing but is there really no hope for third party SSDs as well? RED makes really nice lenses but it'd be pretty frustrating if that was the ONLY option for their cameras.
Click to expand...

I just finished reading a (long) article on AnandTech http://www.anandtech.com/show/3812/the-ssd-diaries-crucials-realssd-c300 that looks at some performance problems with top-drawer SSDs. Short version, the write speed of a given SSD module can drop from 180 MB/sec to 20 MB/sec based on the controller firmware version and the usage pattern.

Assuming that the goal is that you can stuff a (RED) SSD module into the camera and hit 'record' without worrying about data rate, wear leveling, or any of the other attributes of the SSD module, then paying RED for qualifying the module (and possibly tweaking the firmware) is pretty much a no-brainer.
 
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This SSD situation kind of sucks. Red's proprietary media is going to be more expensive than off-the-shelf drives, and harder to find in an emergency.

Also bugging me is the issue of lengthy recordings. Two weeks from now my brother's band is going to perform a two-hour live concert. I'm going to capture the entire concert onto a single Red drive without any breaks in the recording, so as not to miss anything. That sort of recording is not possible with the proposed SSD drives, because they simply don't have the storage capacity to run continuously for a long event. Juggling multiple cameras to maintain constant coverage is a hassle, and drives up costs.

This SSD situation means I'll probably have to give up on Red products. The only thing that would keep me interested is if a 3rd party (or Red) produces what we all want, which is a module that allows generic SATA drives to be used with the camera. The SATA drives would be attached to trays (essentially a one-time operation), and the trays would then slide into the drive module. By using the trays, the contact pin issue becomes non-existent, and a quick insertion/ejection system can be utilized. The trays could be designed to hold multiple SATA drives simultaneously, so that the drives can run in a RAID configuration. The module itself could analyze the drives and determine if they can perform up to expectations. If not, they would be rejected by the system. When better cheaper drives come out in the future, the old drives can be replaced simply by removing them from the trays. The trays and the module continue to get used with the new drives, while the old drives can then be used like normal SATA drives (probably as external backup drives). The system is efficient and logical, unlike Red's currently proposed system.
 
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