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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Scarlet...

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I think you have to differenciate:

Scarlet 2/3 was supposed to have up to 120 fps.
Scarlet S35 was limited to 48 fps.

If they build in more processing power into the Scarlet S35, it might be able to have more fps too.


My wish would be: make the Fixed Scarlet like it was announced 11 months ago and make the Scarlet S35 to whatever they think is best.
The Fixed Scarlet was always a different story from the rest of the cameras. Let it be a "RED Starter Cam".
 
bye-bye Scarlet
 
Hi Bing

No, it's too late, Red has announced Scarlets spec and it is what it is, bloody amazing.

I'm just saying that as a Red One owner and soon to be Epic owner, Scarlet will knock seven bells off the value of Epic once it ships in volume unless Red can differentiate or add further value to Epic.

Do you seriously think an extra 70fps is REALLY worth $21,000? Would you be willing to part with your money for this? Perhaps for those who specialise in slow motion filming but for the majority, no way.

But at the end of the day Jim knows what he is doing, after all he's a billionaire and sadly I'm not. :cry:

Scott
 
Spot on, Scott.
Most producers will dictate the cheaper camera, or rental houses will have to match the price of the cheap camera as a "favor" to the DP (200 days a year as "favors") So the ROI of an Epic X becomes 200 days and the ROI on a Scarlet is 40.
THAT'S the problem...
Cheers,
Harry
 
Leo Sardello said:
For those asking about EasyHDR:
Click to expand...

Jannard said:
If we did this, Scarlet could have both EasyHDR at 30fps and HDRx to 60fps.
Click to expand...

Leo, that 2 week-old quote from Jim is not really an answer to my question about EasyHDR. Jim's announcement at the top of this thread only mentioned HDRx. So I and some others are wondering if EasyHDR is included or not.

Also, I assume the engineers have had a chance to look more closely at implementation of HDR (both modes) in Scarlet 2/3 and S35. So are these still the frame rates? And what about data rates with recommended compression?

I'm happy either way, but especially for Scarlet 2/3 there could be implications for storage media. I.e. will CF's be sufficient for most users - in terms of bit rates and capacity? Personally, I think RED should just go 100% SSD. This would likely mean another price increase, but it looks to me that RED has already decided who their main customers are - even for their lowest end model. There is another thread on the storage question over in the Scarlet forum, and it's already been beat up pretty well in the Epic forum.
 
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Thanks Harry

Glad someone agrees with me here.

The good thing, as has already by mentioned, is that we will have a head start to make our money on Epic before Scarlet steals its thunder and completely destroys its value as a rental camera and our ROI.

I think if Jim keeps HDRx out of Scarlets reach then he will protect the value of Epic but is this likely?

Scott
 
Likely differentiations for Epic vs Scarlet;
16 bit vs 12 bit image capture
Lower compression/higher data rates, including mathematically lossless for full uncompressed image quality.
Larger sensor, higher resolution and higher framerates in cropped formats vs 2/3"
Higher framerates at full resolution vs S35 Scarlet.
HDSDI out on the brain
Probably more we don't know about yet.
Glad to see the HDR features in the 2/3" version. Further nails the market distinction between HD video cameras and Scarlet as the best low cost digital cinema alternative to film.
I am so looking forward to this.
 
Steve Wake said:
Leo, that 2 week-old quote from Jim is not really an answer to my question about EasyHDR™™™. Jim's announcement at the top of this thread only mentioned HDRx™™™. So I and some others are wondering if EasyHDR™™™ is included or not.
Click to expand...

Steve,

I know it’s not the same as an “official” spec, but he said elsewhere that what he was proposing would allow for it so why should that have changed just because he didn’t include EasyHDR™ in this particular post?

Maybe I’m reading it all wrong, but it looked to me like the first post of this thread was more like “ok, we decided to do that thing I was talking about” which included EasyHDR™.

But I get that you’re just looking for a clarification.
 
I'm pretty sure RED's mission is to make the best goddamned video cameras on the planet. No offense to those of you looking to rent EPICs out, but I would not respect RED nearly as much if they pandered to your profit margins. Renting out cameras is your business, not REDs. The cameras are what they are, and are worth what they're worth. People who find the EPIC worth the price (and when it comes to art, whatever you need to get the job done is generally worth the price) will buy or rent an EPIC. People who don't need the extra specs will buy a Scarlet. RED isn't going to artificially differentiate the cameras because they're keeping it real.

All the little guys (myself included) really appreciate it. The projects I have planned are very long-term and renting would not be an option, however the extra specs like HDRx will be extremely useful (almost necessary). So I'm pretty much bottlenecked on the technical side of things by what RED decides to offer, and at what price. They're going to be known as a company that "does what it can", rather than "does what it can get away with".

I'm very excited!
 
Your use of the word "pandering" might be misconstrued as being rude.
Some of us make a living at this...
And that might mean instead of buying 2 or 3 Epics I might buy 5 or 6 Scarlets... because why the hell would I spend three times the money on product "Y" to earn the same amount as on product "X"???
Having said that I hope that Epic X really does offer compelling advantages.
Cheers,
Harry
 
Well... I'm a bit disappointed at this time. And I don't really know what to think about this.
Once again, extra charge of 1000$ for scarlet ! More delays, but anyway no fixed date.
But the thing, and I can understand them, is why future epic buyers would still buy epic... scarlet seems to be a better choice.
Maybe I just don't really get this.
 
Harry Clark said:
Your use of the word "pandering" might be misconstrued as being rude.
Some of us make a living at this...
And that might mean instead of buying 2 or 3 Epics I might buy 5 or 6 Scarlets... because why the hell would I spend three times the money on product "Y" to earn the same amount as on product "X"???
Having said that I hope that Epic X really does offer compelling advantages.
Cheers,
Harry
Click to expand...
Perhaps "pandering" wasn't the best word—I don't know.

As for why spend three times the money on product Y to earn the same amount as on product X? Well, as you've implied, you wouldn't, would you? My point is that I don't think it's RED's responsibility to do anything but release the best cameras at the best prices they can. If the premium for EPIC seems excessive to some people, then obviously it's not worth it to them—to others, the EPIC will be worth the price for its advantages.
 
Scott Brown said:
Scarlet S35 is $7000

Epic is $28,000

So what does the extra $21,000 buy you?
A higher data rate, 250 v 100 MB's, higher frame rate and ramping. Am I missing anything else?....
Click to expand...

Well think about how much more you spend on film pushing it through
at 120 FPS vs. 24 FPS. Slo-mo is expensive whether you're talking
film or digital. If you're in the rental biz and someone needs it you've
got it. If you don't have it..you lost a rental. So everyone has to decide.
 
thanks Jim and team this is an amazing step and once again shows how great of a company Red is.

For those saying that 1k extra has squashed their dreams of scarlet I have a few questions to ask them. What are they going to buy now, a far inferior camera for 1k less (or more?) and if adding 1k hits you so hard then it seems like you were stretching your budget in the first place to buy one. Maybe just maybe that means the camera is not for you, if you work in the field a few jobs should cover the price difference (one actually), and if you are just a hobbyist you really are in no rush so why not save up for that extra bit of time?

Really you can get just about anything you want if you put your mind to it, so how about not complaining and putting in the work to pay for it like the rest of us.

For now this is scarlet nothing else exists so complaining about the change (to me) is a waste of bandwidth and all of our time.

No offense meant we all have our own paths, have a good night and weekend.

keep on filming
 
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