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  • Hey all, just changed over the backend after 15 years I figured time to give it a bit of an update, its probably gonna be a bit weird for most of you and i am sure there is a few bugs to work out but it should kinda work the same as before... hopefully :)

Scarlet S35 is now...

Kris Anderson said:
I think your decision to do this is a good thing.... definitely solidifying the RED line and making clear distinctions.
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I've been catching up on threads that I missed while I was away and found this thread that seems relevant:

http://reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=50608

..and this post in particular:

Frank Nicholas said:
I should clarify that I was referring to earlier comments about producers being unable to understand why an EPIC S35 would rent for significantly more than a Scarlet S35. Say what you want about not working for people who don't automatically take your word for why something that, in their eyes, is nearly identical but will cost much more to rent, when they have budgetary veto power.

My assertion about this product differentiation is more about creating an understanding of the performance characteristics of the cameras that is easy to describe and remember for the benefit of the non-tech production folks, i.e. producers.

This is not an artificial differentiation. Scarlet 2/3, Scarlet S35, and EPIC are three distinct products. If you had Scarlet 2/3 and Scarlet 2/3 HDRx™™™™™ then you have one product with two variations.
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I have to agree that having a clear differentiation between RED cameras will be of value in getting people familiar with what are each camera's features and capabilities. RED enthusiasts will already know, but this will help those whose primary role may be not as technical but who still need to be able to understand what things do and why they might want a certain camera.
 
J Davis said:
For some strange reason I really felt need to quote this three times
Why is no one talking about this?
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Probably because we are a little weary about "the future" and hoping to hear more about "the now." :emote_headwall:
 
Jared Caldwell said:
That was helpful. Thanks.

Only Red Team can tell us what is possible, but maybe an S35 body could have less boards, less framerates than 2/3", still including HDRx™ @3k?

The Scarlet line could be associated with 3k resolution (it was originally 3k for $3k, after all). Epic 5k+? :}
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Yeah I thought the same thing mate. Don't worry, there are some real tools on this forum...
 
J Davis said:
For some strange reason I really felt need to quote this three times
Why is no one talking about this?
Click to expand...

Heh...I'm guessing because people are more concerned about what these additional features and price changes to Epic Light will amount to. We've already seen how much price increases can effect folks, even in relatively small amounts (think $1000 for HDRx and the uproar that brought about).

Also, it seems like these "ideas" probably quite a ways away, whereas Epic and Scarlet seem to be entering the realm of now and very soon respectively.

Perhaps there will be a simplified bit-depth 5K 30fps Scarlet with an S35 chip when Monstro and FF hit Epic?
 
jimhare said:
For those of you who do not own a Red product, this may come as a disappointing shock, but for those of us who invested early, before Red was fully proven, this announcement is right on course, and I must say a very good one.

When you are in the Red camp you need to be prepared for change, often drastic and game/plan changing.

While I do feel for those who held onto the thought that they would get an Epic-style camera for a D-SLR budget, this move makes total sense.

There should be a linear price increase as the cameras become more capable.

As it stood, there were very few features separating the Scarlet S35 and Epic-X.

Indies should be over the moon with the Scarlet. Just 4 years ago you would be shooting on HDV for heaven's sake!

When you are ready for Epic you will easily be able to afford it. Believe me the money rolls in and THAT'S what will let you know you are ready, not that Jim should subsidize the entire industry single handed.

Jim and team are doing a fantastic job taking care of the entire industry, from students to the top names in the business and we have a lot to thank them for.

I have spent over $60,000 putting my kit together that was originally advertised as $17,500. The most expensive pieces aren't from Red so reality has a price friends!

Things change and we all knew what we were signing up for.

No whinging, no screeching "unfair" please.
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It sounds like, you were jealous that some people could get a good product too cheap. I'm not very religious but the story of the laborers in the vineyard, Matthew 20, might very well describe how I interpret your point of view. Before this announcement was made, people like me who questioned the difference between Scarlet and Epic S35, was told that it was the little things that meant a lot in the end, that made the huge difference. Not to say all the functions we did not, and still do not know about. And yes these cameras seems very alike, but do I need to remind you what we original signed up for? The 3K for 3K, which evolved into four different Scarlets which then again evolved into an Epic Light. A lot of people wanted S35 DOF, so Red made this happen by popular demand, which was huge. But how great features this camera might hold, I'm not sure how many people ever asked for 5K resolution, HDRx, autofocus and so on and so forth. Features that without a doubt is worth the price, but not part of what people original signed up for.

And yes you probably supported the Red-team when they most needed it and that is good, both for you and for Red. Without people like you we might not be discussion this now. If I had the money back then sure, I would do the same. But you should take your time and think about people on this forum who doesn't own a Red One is maybe in another situation then you are and were. But concider this: I have waited for this camera for roughly 2½ years now like many others. A day haven't gone by where I haven't thought about it, looking forward to buying it cause it has never been that far away. I have had a job for almost 2 years which I only took because I had to earn money for this camera. I have saved every penny I could possibly save. It was like many other jobs, a job I didn't have much interrest in, but I did because I knew what was at the end of the line. Not to talk about all the time invested at this place. All in all I have invested a huge part of my life in Red, so don't tell me to be over the moon with the Scarlet. For all you know I might bring the next sensation to cinema shot on a Red. I'm not being ungrathful for what Red has to offer no matter what this next announcement (that always seems to floath in the horizon) will bring. But I feel in my right to be dissapointed if they don't meet my expectations.
 
Richard_JP said:
Yeah I thought the same thing mate. Don't worry, there are some real tools on this forum...
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there are extremists on both sides, you seem to be on the opposite end of the spectrum but extreme none the less. Just because another is rude does not give you the right to be rude, but here I am being the morality police again so yes I will also mention you don't have to read to a word I write, but I write it anyways in hopes people will listen.

the original question is a little late in the game and does not really fit in the current red line and hence this thread, now that is how it appears now, who knows what will happen in the future. honestly doesn't make much sense to me and it seems like it stems from a DSLR standpoint and customers reflecting what they like in their cams and trying to get that applied to a raw red camera. I feel they are two different systems, red will make their cams the highest resolution possible so making a s35 lower resolution would not be something I would think they would do. just as I assume they got as much resolution out of the 2/3 they possibly could. (but this is just me guessing)

though I could be totally wrong and they could make this camera anything is possible, I just don't think it is probable and I think that is how the person who replied no felt but just didn't want to go into it and came of rather rude when he was just being blunt.

play nice people
 
No matter what we do... there will be unhappy people. As long as everyone understands that we really are trying to push the industry along and deliver meaningful cameras with the most capability at the best price possible, I can live with some disappointment out there.

Jim
 
Jannard said:
No matter what we do... there will be unhappy people. As long as everyone understands that we really are trying to push the industry along and deliver meaningful cameras with the most capability at the best price possible, I can live with some disappointment out there.

Jim
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Just keep giving us something better to aspire too. Love what you are doing all around.
 
I just dont like the stigma, that all current non-owners of REDONEs are non-believers and skeptics. I have followed the development of this brand since well before the RED ONE dropped, and have been like may others(amped on any new info). As interested as I was, I just couldnt afford a REDONE package. When the Scarlet was first announced as a 3K cam for 3K dollars, I flipped! Completely stoked on the entire concept! Frequent check-ins at REDUSER for new info, kept me charged, but as the delays piled up, and changes and price hikes started mounting, my interest started to wane. The camera kept improving, but the fact that it kept getting more expensive and delayed over and over again stripped me of excitement.

Im not bitching about RED, or Jim, or their buisness practice in general. I just dont like the idea that RED ONE owners are treated like royalty and are the only ones recognized and rewarded as supporters of RED. Ive been here all along waiting for Scarlet, even knowing that I would have to wait behind people who already have REDONES. If it was me, I would have released the cheapest Scarlet before EPIC, to increase the userbase and satisfy us less financially endowed RED fans. The funny thing is, as soon as I got a go ahead for a REDONE to shoot a bridge building project, that went on backorder until after the opening ceremony(which made it not an option) Sweet Irony!!!!(shakes fist in air)

Like Im saying, Im not trashing RED, just frustrated at how things have panned out. Still a fan. Amped on HDR. Pissed I cant have one.

-burk




jimhare said:
For those of you who do not own a Red product, this may come as a disappointing shock, but for those of us who invested early, before Red was fully proven, this announcement is right on course, and I must say a very good one.

When you are in the Red camp you need to be prepared for change, often drastic and game/plan changing.

While I do feel for those who held onto the thought that they would get an Epic-style camera for a D-SLR budget, this move makes total sense.

There should be a linear price increase as the cameras become more capable.

As it stood, there were very few features separating the Scarlet S35 and Epic-X.

Indies should be over the moon with the Scarlet. Just 4 years ago you would be shooting on HDV for heaven's sake!

When you are ready for Epic you will easily be able to afford it. Believe me the money rolls in and THAT'S what will let you know you are ready, not that Jim should subsidize the entire industry single handed.

Jim and team are doing a fantastic job taking care of the entire industry, from students to the top names in the business and we have a lot to thank them for.

I have spent over $60,000 putting my kit together that was originally advertised as $17,500. The most expensive pieces aren't from Red so reality has a price friends!

Things change and we all knew what we were signing up for.

No whinging, no screeching "unfair" please.
Click to expand...
 
Jannard said:
No matter what we do... there will be unhappy people. As long as everyone understands that we really are trying to push the industry along and deliver meaningful cameras with the most capability at the best price possible, I can live with some disappointment out there.

Jim
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Jim, many of us still remember, and appreciate, the surprise $2500 discount for accessories you generously gave us early adopters. There has never been any doubt in our minds that you have always had the customer's best interest at heart. We fully understand the incredible value all the RED cameras represent.
 
There is a reason I kept my original 1K deposit with Red. I trust them to deliver. If it ends up I can only afford the 2/3" model, I'll still take that over an AF100 or the upcoming S35 NX. Not because I'm an uncritical fan boy, but because the quality of the video that Red produces far exceeds what others are outputting, and gives me more flexibility.

But hopefully I can afford the EPIC light plus RedRocket.

Anyone who shoots for broadcast knows there is definitely a large market for a world class 2/3" camera. Though if I'm being totally selfish, if they bump it to S16 that would be sweet.
 
Jannard said:
Scarlet 2/3" has grown into a full professional system. We also have ideas for a future Scarlet that fits well with this category.

Changing Scarlet S35 to an EPIC name is only right. It is entirely based on the EPIC S35.

Jim
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Just to be clear, the Epic Light will still be the smaller form factor... right?

(Sorry for the redundancy if this has been addressed already)
 
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