Scarlet preview...

[Erich Ocean]

But I want artifact free RAW more than most other things.

Supposedly, the new Canon is S35, 1080p, 422, and Log @ $10-12K. If you can set white balance and a color matrix on set, Log is 99.99% of what RAW gives you, and it's a hell of a lot easier/cheaper to deal with if the 1080p aspect is also okay.

Canon is known for taking their time, but having a well designed body (XF305 anyone?) that's got everything built in. Add in the EF mount for cheap Canon glass, and I think there's going to be a huge market for the camera.

And by the excitement Jim is giving off these last two weeks, I think he knows it's going to be huge too.

If I had to guess, I'd say that the Epic and Sony F65 will separate from the pack for cinema and high-end episodic, and the new Canon, Sony F3, and Alexa (and perhaps the Scarlett) will duke it out for 1080p TV production.

 

[Gary Paul Walker]

Supposedly, the new Canon is S35, 1080p, 422, and Log @ $10-12K. If you can set white balance and a color matrix on set, Log is 99.99% of what RAW gives you, and it's a hell of a lot easier/cheaper to deal with if the 1080p aspect is also okay.

Canon is known for taking their time, but having a well designed body (XF305 anyone?) that's got everything built in. Add in the EF mount for cheap Canon glass, and I think there's going to be a huge market for the camera.

And by the excitement Jim is giving off these last two weeks, I think he knows it's going to be huge too.

If I had to guess, I'd say that the Epic and Sony F65 will separate from the pack for cinema and high-end episodic, and the new Canon, Sony F3, and Alexa (and perhaps the Scarlett) will duke it out for 1080p TV production.

Difficult to make a case for 1080p nowadays, even for TV. Even more difficult to make a case for a brand new camera that is limited to 1080, the shelf-life of milk.
(and yes, Sony F3, Alexa, iPhone 4s & Canon DSLR are all doing it, but for television and film its probably adhereing to an old standard). Capture Hi-Res and cut it down to size.

 

[Francesco Cammarata]

Not rich, but many of us actually work and make money off our gear and so paying a premium for professional goods goes with the territory. There probably is also a "protect my investment" side to it for some.

True! But in this case the Epic is the best choice for you and not the Scarlet.

For three years the Scarlet was presented like a professional camera at limited cost 6,000$ about, in reality never exist, in fact seems to me that they want transform an Epic-S in to a Scarlet.
I put me in standby and wait if this concept it's true.

 

[Mike 'Fireman' Ross]

Anyone else noticed that on the store the DSMC SSD Side module says that it is incompatible with Scarlet? Am I reading too far into this?

Yes, I think so:

1. The RED DRIVE store page said, until the day they sold the last they had in stock, that it was compatible with EPIC and Scarlet. THEN they cancelled the EPIC/Scarlet rear module that would have allowed use of the RED DRIVE on those cameras; everything is subject to change.

2. The Scarlet chassis that we've seen is similar to EPIC in general layout and appearance, but it is NOT the same. It wouldn't surprise me if the EPIC SSD module was designed removable, to leave open the possibility of future additional storage options (same as RED ONE), but the Scarlet SSD module is built-in - part of the chassis.

Mike

 

[Antony M]

... too long we've seen cameras from other companies that were 'just about right', but not entirely, because they deliberately left out stuff, ...

EVERY camera leaves SOMETHING out.

e.g. The Epic can't do high speed flash sync, and can't do exposures of > 1 second.

I doubt there will ever be 1 camera which can do everything.

 

[Mike 'Fireman' Ross]

OK a thought. Scarlet S35 became EPIC-S, guessed price point (RED quote): $12k.

Quite a few respected people here on this thread are saying 'if you were expecting a sub-$10k camera, think again". Jim says "Scarlet is now a professional camera. It will be more expensive"

EPIC-S was tentatively scheduled for the 'fall'.

*checks temperature outside.... yep! More like winter in NYC in fact....*

Maybe, maybe, 2/3" has been dropped and what was to have been EPIC-S *IS* now 'Scarlet', again, and will be going on sale on the 3rd...

Doesn't suit me: I'd sooner have Scarlet Fixed sub $10k; that I could afford without hesitation as a simple second unit cam. We'll see. Whatever happens, I trust Jim; I'm sure it will be... Epic

Mike

Jim just answered to those speculations on other thread:

Originally Posted by Jannard
Sounds like EPIC... lower your expectations. Really. Not close. This is what bugs me. And you get something like this from where?

Jim


Which leaves us with something of a contradiction. The original slated price for Scarlet Fixed was... $4,750 as I recall. Then HDRx came along, and we had Ted quoting a ballpark of $6k for what he was holding in his hand: a basic operational Scarlet fixed. Now factor in inflation, cost increases due to Japan etc... if RED put what Ted demonstrated on sale for $7k, $8k, maybe a little more... I would run, not walk, to the store.

But now Jim is saying things that appear contradictory... around NAB it was 'design is pretty much locked down, we're just waiting for software to be finished and production issues to be solved'. A couple of weeks ago there was talk that it had changed a lot. Now we've got 'Sounds like EPIC... lower your expectations. Really. Not close.' juxtaposed with 'Scarlet is now a professional camera. It will be more expensive.'

So how to interpret that? The quoted ballpark target price for EPIC-S was $12k. It sounds like Scarlet Fixed (if that's what they're still planning to announce) is drifting up close to that price point... now it sure as heck won't be close to EPIC-X for ~$10k, but how far short of EPIC-S can it be? If it's now 'professional' and 'more expensive' maybe it's still the same basic Fixed design, upgraded to 4K shoehorned onto a 2/3" chip, maybe if progress has been faster than expected with an early spin of the Dragon sensor tech, for ~$10-12k?

Isaac Asimov famously said 'the solar system consists of Jupiter plus debris'. It's only a little bit of a stretch to say that RED consists of Redcode Raw plus debris - ok ok it's a heck of a lot more than that, but you get my point. I really could use a sub-$10k camera that shoots Redcode Raw. Whether it's 3k or 4k I don't really care, for this particular application. But it's price-sensitive and Scarlet Fixed at $6k-8k fitted that bill perfectly... especially with the autofocus and power zoom at that price, it was *perfect* for a one man second unit. I really really hope something like that is still on the cards.

Mike

 

[Harcharan Singh]

Disspoiinted

Disspoiinted

Hi,
If SCARLET is 5K and with prices being suggested here then as a EPIC M owner I will be disspointed...But I know RED
will not do anything like this which will kill the sale of their GEM THE EPIC....

Harcharan

 

[Antony M]

Parsing this...

Cannot be over $10k

Cannot be "slightly under 10k".

Only option left is, well, more than slightly under 10k.

You're fired!

Those statements parse to: "equals $10k".

 

[Maik Müller]

Hi,
If SCARLET is 5K and with prices being suggested here then as a EPIC M owner I will be disspointed...But I know RED
will not do anything like this which will kill the sale of their GEM THE EPIC....

A less expensive camera with 5k-resolution was always on the roadmap (EPIC-S/Scarlet S35), so this shouldn't be a shocking surprise for EPIC-owners or a reason to be disappointed. I'm sure there would be many things that define EPIC's status above such a (hypothetical) 5k-Scarlet. Don't be disappointed, you already have the best camera and Scarlet will not change that.

 

[Steven Hammer]

Hi,
If SCARLET is 5K and with prices being suggested here then as a EPIC M owner I will be disspointed...But I know RED
will not do anything like this which will kill the sale of their GEM THE EPIC....

Harcharan

Jim's comment that "3 of a kind beats 2 pair" in the other thread (in the context of the discussion that Canon's was going to capture 4K but record 2K) really seems to say to me that Scarlet is still 3K. Which is fine by me! The closer it is to the original specs for the Scarlet Fixed or Scarlet Interchangeable, the happier I am. Maybe they made the fixed lens interchangeable. That'd be sweet. And certainly considered more "professional".

 

[Bjørn Vermo]

I don't understand why people are so pleased to see that it's going to be more expensive ... It seems that all RED USERS are rich or I'm not living in the same world ...
I may be be the only one to say that, I will probably get all the bad comments after that, but I'm pretty sad to see that price are being elevated ... pretty nice info indeed ....
Anyway let's see what's coming but I'm deeply sad to see that the SCARLET is more expensive again... I thought the dream was coming true... not this time for me
bye bye

I think people are relieved that nothing unexpected has happened. Remember that $3000 in 2008 is a lot more money than $3000 today. The US dollar is in reality a currency backed by debt rather than something of value, and does not have any kind of fixed value over time. The expected price for a Scarlet (3k for $3k) at end of 2008 was 88.57 barrels of oil. Today, 88.57 bbl oil will cost you 9743 US dollars. That is an indication that the price of Scarlet has not increased at all measured in real value, it has probably dropped.
If you price it in gold the difference is even more dramatic, but gold does not have much intrinsic value so the price it fetches is mostly psychology.

 

[Walid Kocht]

Guyz, second night i dream about this scarlet, i hope i could afford it : ))

 

[Lliam Worthington]

Yes speaking of the dollar. Lets get this scarlet done and dusted before the US dollar completely recovers against the AUS $ PLEASE. :emote_headwall:
My tax and shipping offset is now rapidly disappearing.

 

[Lliam Worthington]

Guyz, second night i dream about this scarlet, i hope i could afford it : ))

Just make sure you use protection. I have heard there are many people who plan on paying for her services as well.
:yesnod::yesnod::yesnod:

 

[DJ Meyer]

You're fired!

Those statements parse to: "equals $10k".

Doh. Yes. Two options are either exactly 10k or, say, <8k.

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

I wish people argued about their scripts or argued for their stories as much as they argue about the tool that records it.

This might be shocking to you but a lot of people here aren't first and foremost writers they're visual people. Visual people arguing about visual technology on a forum dedicated to visual tools shouldn't come as surprise to you. If you want to argue about story go to FinalDraftUser.net or CharacterUser.net

2/3" has all kinds of benefits... I'll leave that for Steve Gibby to expound on... a 2/3" Scarlet records to the same glorious GRAEME and DEANAN REDCODE magic.

I completely disagree. 2/3" sensors have essentially no benefits what so ever. Why? Because a s35 sensor can shoot s35 or 2/3" in the same package. A FF35 sensor can shoot 2/3", s35 or FF35. 2/3" sensors are only limiting.

Only Arri right now uses wavelt compression (besides RED)... the BATTLE OF THE MATHLETES... is all that matters... not photosites. its all horses for courses.

Let's not all forget Silicon Imaging the first company to deliver a touchscreen controlled, Bayer Pattern, RAW, wavelet encoded modular camera system.

 

[Zac C]

EVERY camera leaves SOMETHING out.

e.g. The Epic can't do high speed flash sync, and can't do exposures of > 1 second.

I doubt there will ever be 1 camera which can do everything.

Thats not something left out, thats the problem with the sensor refresh rate, and the sensor in general.

 

[David Rasberry]

A less expensive camera with 5k-resolution was always on the roadmap (EPIC-S/Scarlet S35), so this shouldn't be a shocking surprise for EPIC-owners or a reason to be disappointed. I'm sure there would be many things that define EPIC's status above such a (hypothetical) 5k-Scarlet. Don't be disappointed, you already have the best camera and Scarlet will not change that.

Jim has also said in the past that 3k is as good as it gets for less than $10k. Epic-S was expected to price out more like the RED 1 with similar performance.

 

[Gavin Greenwalt]

Is everyone on reduser rich? seems like money is no issue here if so how come u all haven't bought an epic or redone lol

There are certainly different markets at play. Everybody should be able to afford whatever they announce tomorrow. It was supposed to be released 3 years ago. If you could save up $3k in 1 year then in 3 years a $10k package should be doable. I started saving for a Scarlet FF35 several years ago to have enough set aside when it released... and then it wasn't. Now I've saved up enough for a nice Epic package but that's then where markets come into play.

Epic is a no-brainer if you can rent it regularly out or hire yourself out as a DP. As a professional tool $30k is cheap! You take a high end workstation, big monitor and RAID and your average editor has probably invested that in their trade. The question though is whether or not it makes sense for every professional to own a high-end camera. The answer to that is "no".

If you were planning 3 years ago to buy a scarlet you should be able to afford whatever is announced on Nov 3. I think what people are really saying is "I don't want a camera that expensive even if I could afford it." Which is a reasonable position.

You don't have to be rich to afford a Ferrari... you just have to want a Ferrari more than eating nothing but rice and beans.

 

[Terry VerHaar]

You don't have to be rich to afford a Ferrari... you just have to want a Ferrari more than eating nothing but rice and beans.

Or putting your kids through college, or saving for retirement, or paying your taxes, or having medical insurance...

It was great to be young and single and without obligations :laugh: