RED party reel powered by RED RAY

[conrad gaunt]

Yes, I'm sure they could, but to do so would require developers to learn yet another standard. However if they go with an established standard, they will immediately have developers ready to rock their new format.

true, but wouldn't they then need to pay royalties to Microsoft etc?

I really hope red can produce a cheaper version of the Red rocket that simply accelerates decompression times. I'd buy several of these frankly..and later, maybe a posh one with monitoring outputs!

 

[Graeme Nattress]

I was there, I saw it. I knew ahead of time about the compression so I sat in the front row and looked very hard at the gradients, the explosions, the darks (the darkest of which was my footage in the reel , etc and could not detect any banding, blocks, artifacts or any sign that this was compressed at all. And to repeat, I was on the front row looking at a 40ft? screen.

To be honest, if it were anyone but Red, I would flatly accuse any company making such claims as outright lies (PT Barnum style). But Red has integrity, I believe them.

4k @ 10Mbit/s can change everything

Thanks Shawn. Was good to see you there!

Graeme

 

[JD Holloway]

Well I'm very impressed to hear of the demo.
I can't say I didn't think it would happen. Jim's leviathan is full of surprises.
I must admit I felt this unveiling must come soon from RED.
But what to do with such power?

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=4308&highlight=broadcast
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?t=12098

One thing I mulled over

"OK, just musing here,
if RED can playback at 1080p and our computers can barely....
then red is a solid basis for redcode-decoder.
if RED RAY can handle low(ish) bandwidth 4k transcode...
if you coupled them together, do you have a 4k on set playback device for real time? Like a pimped out AJA? This could of course be a RED HERRING"

"Correct me if im wrong, but if its possible to have data rates/compression this "deep" with common red laser technology, clearly it must be possible to use existing satellite transmittion to send 4k(ish) to an at-home 4k decodebox."

"A proprietary REDCODE realtime hardware converter could transcode the datastream into 4K RGB for inhouse viewing. I suppose at some level this would work for movie houses too; recording to a harddrive for cinematic projection."

This became Red Rocket (very Toronto-centric). Not bad for 2007!

But what about broadcast!?!
I'm curious about what input slots are available on the RED RAY!
Can it stream from other sources other than the platter????

 

[JD Holloway]

Oh ya EDIT
"THE ORDER OF CANADA FOR ARTS AND TECHNOLOGY GOES TO.....
GRAEME NATTRESS!!!
For serious ass kicking in the area of digital cinematography.
(Everybody stumbles onto The Grounds of the GG's for whiskey...)

 

[Graeme Nattress]

Thanks for the vote James.

Graeme

 

[Stacey Spears]

true, but wouldn't they then need to pay royalties to Microsoft etc?

HDi was the name of Microsoft's implementation of HD DVDs advanced interactivity. At least one player, which never came to market, used its own implementation. All of Toshiba's players used Microsoft's implementation, which was Linux based, in the first gen HD DVD player. The 2nd and 3rd gen used a WinCE implementation, though the player still ran Linux for everything else. There may have been an ARM port as well, but the format is gone as is the team who put it all together.

The advanced content was all based on open standards, so no license to Microsoft.

 

[Andrew Thomas]

Hello Stacey,

hope you are doing well. I always enjoyed reading you and Amir's posts on AVS during the great format war of 2006-2008

 

[Casey Green]

Visual proof was provided for those attending. First time round they didn't know they were watching REDRAY. 2nd and 3rd time round, people knew what Ted was up to with his demo and must have been looking at it critically knowing what it was.

Graeme

I was another who attended the REDUser Party. (Thanks to everyone who made this happen! Great to see everyone.) I arrived at the start of the day and Ted showed the two Reels.

At the end of playing the second Reel and it being revealed that it was RED RAY 10mb/s, I was astounded. I then realized I had cheered loudly in excitement, but was somewhat embarrassed by my "outburst" since I think most in the first audience didn't quite realize the significance and/or were in too much shock.

This is simply incredible. RED RAY's impact could have as much, if not more, in the industry as the RED ONE Camera has. Think distribution in all categories, from home entertainment systems, online downloads and viewing, to Theatrical distribution and Presentation.

This reminded me of the NBA's marketing of LeBron James... "We are all Witnesses"

Congrats RED Team!

 

[Craig Meadows]

Seems to me the licensing potential of this could easily eclipse the income of just selling great cameras.

 

[JD Holloway]

Absol-&^%ing-lutly.

Its a possibility of a total re-design of distribution channels.
Some people are going to be pissed. It will hinge on RED delivering the final
pieces of the puzzle. High res. monitors and projectors.
Plus some intangibles...convincing people that they need to buy them!

There opens up the option of much cheaper (compressed) archiving.

 

[Michael Schrengohst]

Seems to me the licensing potential of this could easily eclipse the income of just selling great cameras.

Billions....

So, is RED RAY an offshoot of Blu-Ray? Or is RED RAY independent of
DVD & Blu-RAY?? I wonder if RED RAY is having to license something??

The reason I ask is that if RED RAY is what you all say it is then it is more
like a new book, not just a new chapter in an old book.

What about RED RAY interactive? Will an authoring platform be developed?
What about pressing discs? Should factories start moving out the Blu-Ray stampers?

 

[J. P. Sendall]

I'm in the same boat as Erik only because of the fact that lots of consumers cannot (or will not) see the difference between DVD and Blu-ray.

One comparison shot between an uncompressed frame and wavelet-compressed frame is all I need--even if it's only 1080p.

After a music producer (worth his salt) does a final mix of his or her stupendously expensive track they then listen to it on a crappy system. Why? Because most people will probably listen to it that way. If it still sounds great then the mix is finished.

I would say the same about 4K going out on crappy projectors and TV's. The public may not notice the difference (I think more people do than is realised) but the better the front end grade is the better it will be at the consumer end. Just because people watch stuff through bad quality systems doesn't mean you have to downgrade your grade, if you know what I mean. In fact probably the opposite.

 

[Steven Caesare]

Interesting ideas.

Synthetic grain modeling such as being described here is already in production. Thompson, I believe, has it as an adjunct for some AVC codec stuff.

(Note I'm not suggesting REDRay does this, just commenting on the idea somebody proffered earlier).

 

[David Wyatt]

I have seen it. All I can say is HOW IN THE HELL can you guys get that image quality from 10megabits/sec?!?!?!!?!?!??!?????????????????!?!?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?!?!?!??!

The answer to this is obvious: reverse engineering from the display systems in crashed UFO's :coolgleam:

 

[David Wyatt]

I was just posting on ScarletUser that the only thing left is projection. Once we get our 4k projector, we can set up tent and start our circus.}

The crazy thing about this whole "game" is that if Red also made an "affordable" projector you could potentially be your own studio, distributor & exhibitor...circumventing the whole notoriously sewn-up, established infrastructure. As Jared puts it, you could literally set up your own "tent" and start showing your own independent film and rather than taking a small slice of any box office takings you'd take the majority of it (minus from that marketing & advertising costs...maybe Red could make a revolutionary product that does all that for you at a cheap price point :laugh.

For some reason all these potential developments remind me a bit of the exciting, pioneering early days of cinema!!

 

[Stephen Gentle]

So, is RED RAY an offshoot of Blu-Ray? Or is RED RAY independent of
DVD & Blu-RAY?? I wonder if RED RAY is having to license something??

From what has been released, RED RAY has a DVD drive (they said 2 hours of 4K on a dual-layer disc), but I beleive that it has also been mentioned that you can read from Compact Flash and a USB drive as well.

But no Blu-Ray for now. If the licensing issues do improve (like with DVD) then I hope someday there is a Blu-Ray version available - a dual layer Blu-Ray disk can hold 50GB of data, which is around 11 hours of 4K at 10 Mb/s!

Hopefully the RED RAY will also be able to read USB hard drives though - that would probably be more useful.

 

[Kenneth Elkington]

From what has been released, RED RAY has a DVD drive (they said 2 hours of 4K on a dual-layer disc), but I beleive that it has also been mentioned that you can read from Compact Flash and a USB drive as well.

But no Blu-Ray for now. If the licensing issues do improve (like with DVD) then I hope someday there is a Blu-Ray version available - a dual layer Blu-Ray disk can hold 50GB of data, which is around 11 hours of 4K at 10 Mb/s!

Hopefully the RED RAY will also be able to read USB hard drives though - that would probably be more useful.

Hell I just want it to have Wi-fi. Streaming true 1080p and 4k video onto my 65-inch laservue in under 2MB/s streams would be a dream come true.

 

[hmurchison]

Forget the optical drive.

I wouldn't waste another dollar beyond the red laser in the RED Ray device on optical technology.

Support NAND flash and HDD and you'll be fine.

 

[Ian Slessor]

Satellite delivery of HD through REDRay?

Satellite delivery of HD through REDRay?

In regards to RedRay's compression and the quality of the picture that everyone has raved about it makes me wonder if this would enable satellite and cable companies to increase the quality of their HD offerings without sacrificing bandwidth like they seem to be doing lately.

ian

 

[Häakon]

Forget the optical drive.

I wouldn't waste another dollar beyond the red laser in the RED Ray device on optical technology.

Support NAND flash and HDD and you'll be fine.

The whole point is to be able to record - and share - stunning 4K onto a red-laser DVD-R disc that costs 50 cents. If you ditched the optical drive, you'd have to hand out HDDs to all of your clients, and well... obviously that's just silly.

I know a lot of people like to hate on optical media, but it's still the cheapest, most easily distributable media there is.